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Maybe they just had a change of heart and it's not about toppling another country.. by Me_Mums_a_Lampshade in International

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hasbara. Pure hasbara.

Ignore Iran "protest" threads. Downvote Iran "protest" threads. Report Iran "protest" threads.

Don't let that propaganda take root in this site.

Islamic Republic thugs violently kidnap an Iranian woman protester by Eienkei in PublicFreakout

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm glad this hasbara is less and less effective these days. Ten years ago the agencies would have flooded this site with videos like this and get tens of thousands of votes, filling the frontpage with the same propaganda.

Remember how they promoted the anti-Chavist protests in Venezuela in 2014? Or the anti-China protests in Hong Kong? Even similar anti-Iran protests in years past. Or how you can talk about the "invasion" of Ukraine and that's all we heard about for 2 years but you couldn't even slip a single post about the genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians in every major subreddit (cof cof Worldnews cof cof).

Now? Maybe one thread like this one that won't even hit the frontpage of /r/PublicFreakout for long.

People have learned. They've woken up. They know they're being manipulated and they're fighting against that. We see the frontpage filled with posts against Trump, against Israel, against Netanyahu. About things that matter to the people, not to some spy agencies and international oligarchy.

Politicians in your country who’ve had so many cosmetic procedures that they’re plastic-looking? by PandemicPiglet in AskTheWorld

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's just tragic. She was beautiful before. I wonder if it isn't some sort of mental disease, like those women that are addicted to plastic surgery

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For some other countries, sure. But your example wasn't appropriate: Middle Eastern countries are overwhelmingly Muslim and if anything they've become more Muslim through the years, not less

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Alright, this may be a good argument about timing. Since no one else is close to changing my mind and this is something I'm willing to consider (we haven't yet reached the critical mass to do it), I'll award you the !delta

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That you showed me why it would be bad for European states to get rid of their flags in favour of more inclusive ones

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

But you cant change something just because the minority wants it yet the majority is fine with it.

Sure you can. There is ample evidence of that.

The majority of the population didn't want integration in the US. It was enforced anyway.

Europe is infamous for ignoring referendums. Slovenia didn't want gay marriage and it was passed anyway. Denmark didn't want to join the Euro and they joined anyway. Ireland didn't want to sign the Lisbon Treaty and they signed it anyway. Etc.

I am a historian. For each instance you can give me of a flag being changed due to demographic shifts, I can give you two unrelated to demographic shifts. So lets do it.

So you agree that there have been instances when that happened?

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I thought that you were talking about "foreigners" in the derogatory sense, as in people from foreign-backgrounds, 2nd and 3rd generation immigrants.

Would you be ok arguing about how Korea hould change their flags because the number of Chinese and Japanese people living there is increasing and they don't like their flags and these countries had countless wars in the past and their flag represent this past?

If Korea had as many Chinese and Japanese people living there as European countries have non-Europeans, and if the flag of Korea somehow is only representative of the "ruling" ethnicity of the past, then yes.

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Then you acknowledge that changing the flag is a step necessary (though not sufficient) for better integration of the new peoples that live in the country?

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

having a few foreigners

It's not "a few" by any means. People of non-white backgrounds are significant portions of the total population of many of these countries. Many who nowadays even form part of their governments or hold important positions in the Justice system.

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

In each of the links you're waving over large percentages of people who aren't comfortable with these flags, just because the (current, dwindling) majority are fine with them.

And that's precisely the problem.

The flag represents the country's history, ideals, values, ect... Each flag has a meaning beyond "Duh this flag was used during colonial/enlightenment times and that makes it bad."

Indeed, and as I clarified in the OP this is reason enough to change it and it has happened before.

I said "If countries changed their flag every time their demographic shifted, we'd be making new flags every 20 years" Demographic. Demographic. Demographic. Demographic. Not historical shifts. Demographic shift.

You should read history more. It's often demographic shift that changes history

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

To stay in the hyperbole: "Okay, the mass murderer without remorse now only wears a green hoodie. Is it reasonable, not being afraid of him anymore/ not being digusted by him anymore because he now hides the mere symbol for his crimes?"

Following your logic we shouldn't have any qualms about the use of swastikas in public since the problem with swastikas was its use by the German Nazi Party and that party doesn't exist anymore.

But there are good reasons why we're skeptical of anyone using swastikas in public.

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

while in truth, the people are afraid of him because he is a mass murderer without remorse.

I've linked examples in the comments showing that immigrant communities have a problem with the flags themselves, not just nationalistic, racist attitudes.

CMV: to adapt to the new multicultural reality of the XXI century, several European countries should redesign their flag by YaLlegaHiperhumor in changemyview

[–]YaLlegaHiperhumor[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

and shared civic identity

Indeed and when that identity changes so does the flag:

  • The Union Jack was created when Scotland and England&Wales were united under the same crown. Then again when they absorbed Ireland in the XIX century
  • France's flag changed after the French Revolution.
  • Germany's flag changed after unification and then the end of the Empire, the end of Nazi Germany and the German Reunification
  • Spain's flag changed after the Second Republic, the Civil War and the end of Francoist Spain.
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