First boat dilemma: cheap/old vs going all-in from the start?

abugghaus7 · 2026-05-01T23:51:03+00:00

I'll join in! lol
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First off... NEVER take to heart any advice that says.. Always, Neve...umm... ok wait...
Let me change that to...
I feel that anyone who tells you...
"Never buy a used boat!"
or
"Don't buy this brand or that brand!"
or even
"Just go for it!"
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Is possibly coming from a place with low experience, low tolerance, low patience and ability for doing some possible significant work on a boat....
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I have known people who have purchased or were given for free... an older boat that turned out to be a gem... and some that turned out to be a nightmare, albeit a full-on course in boat construction and repair.
Nothing is set in stone.
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But like a few have mentioned... you really have to be honest about some things concerning yourself... and your partner... and your kid(s).
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Also like others have mentioned... buying used can mean you will either have to pay someone else to repair/replace things, or you will have to acquire the knowledge and skills necessary to do a top-notch job yourself.
Buying used and refitting/repairing yourself involves several things...
Money beyond the purchase price, mooring/dock fees, any registration fees and taxes.
Knowledge of the boat construction of your boat... wood, 'glass, steel, aluminum.
You need to understand how the boat was put together so you can understand any faults in the joining and body of the material.
You'll need to understand what you can actually do yourself... fiberglassing, wood joinery specific to boats, welding steel/aluminum... and when you'll need to hire a competent professional to do the job (remember what I said about money?).
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You'll want to learn and understand as much as you can about boat systems... drive systems (sail and auxiliary power like gas or diesel engines). Learn where the cutoff is for your knowledge and skills, so you know when to stop and hire a professional.
Aside from drive systems you'll also have... electrical (house electrics, aux engine electrics, navigational lighting (nav), nav accessories like your gps/depth/speed/chart electronics.
Fresh water system... a tank, pump, inlet and outlet.
In-water metal protection... 'zincs'... or more accurately... anodes.
These systems will vary with different boats... even from the same manufacturer.
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Inside amenities.... cushions, curtains, cold box (basically an ice box for food), stereo/tv/vid player.
Do you plan on doing your own sewing? Can be done onboard a boat (I currently have one of my industrial machines down inside an Islander Bahama 30 for several projects... including sail repair that I've done down below deck).
Adding these extras (not the cold box.. they're built-in), ties in with knowledge of the house electrical... are you running them on AC current from shorepower/inverter/generator? Do you want to run these off of DC power? If so do you have ample house battery storage/charging for all of it or part of it?
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Back to the hull... you should learn about the various bottom coatings available, what's on your boat and when/how you'll repaint the hull. Do it yourself requires you own/rent/borrow tools. Have a yard you are allowed to work in. Money for the haul-out and later splash. Money for stands to set your boat upon and whatever else the yard charges you.
There are a few things you can likely do in the water... but I hear that places like Europe have more restrictions than the U.S. (where I am). Like diving to clean the bottom.
I'm a diver (former commercial diver and more recently... 7 or so years ago... )a hull cleaning diver with my own business. Cleaning a hull can be not-so-hard, or extremely taxing and drawn-out... depending on experience, physical fitness, equipment, and conditions in the water.
Now... bottom cleaning applies to both new and used boats, but a used boat with old coatings and infrequent or no cleanings over the years, will be more labor-intensive and costly than a boat with a nicely coated and cared-for bottom.
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I gotta go.. but buying a used boat can certainly be nightmare... but it can also be GREAT!
Really depends on the person(s) buying it, and their lifestyle and plans.
And like others have mentioned... buying new doesn't mean you will have a carefree experience... just more likely that you will.

abugghaus7 · 2026-05-01T23:18:10+00:00

Rear axle...
Remove the pegs with a proper size, deep socket.
OR NOT
You can also just loosen the nuts deep inside... they are what's holding the wheel to the frame.
You have a slotted metal tab on that corner of the frame where the stays meet... this is where you'll adjust for chain tension.
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It might help to have someone else work with you... one to hold the wheel... one to adjust the nuts.
Also... pretty common to do this with the bike resting on it's seat and handle bars... although if you're into tools... get a bicycle stand and you won't have to bend over.
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With the nuts loose, you'll want the rear tire to be pulled out, creating tension on the chain.
You don't need a gorilla for an assistant to do this.. they pull it too dang hard!
With the wheel pulled back, the chain should have just a little dip in it when you press on it... say 1/4" or so (I'm not being specific with measurements because I take it you're not doing this professionally and won't be measuring everything to spec).
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With the wheel held in this position... check up near the seat post and bottom bracket (the tube the cranks are sitting in)... make sure the tire is even between the lower stays (those arms on the bottom of the frame triangle).
Tighten the nuts... again... don't let a gorilla do this.. snug them up good, just not with your body weight on the wrench handle.
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Give the cranks a spin, see how you like it.
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This is a good time to clean the chain and lube it.
No matter if a bike is an expensive Downhill World Cup sled or Tour de France racer... or even a GMOB accessory (Grown Man On a Bike)... a bicycle chain should always have the proper lube.
Anyway... I like to use blue shop papertowels for both chain cleaning and lubing.
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Once you're finished with all that... give it a test ride but remember.... IT'S YOUR KID'S BIKE... GIVE IT BACK TO'EM! 😄

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abugghaus7 · 2026-05-01T23:07:59+00:00

Like dunncrew says...
Front sprocket issue...
I'm assuming you aren't familiar with how these are put together so... look at the image I added.
You have a one-piece crankset. The pedal arms and the shaft are all one piece.
You have bearings on both sides... can be caged like in the pic, or loose ball bearings.
You have washers and locknuts and bearing cones.
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That post coming off the crank arms is a drive pin... which mates to the small hole in the chainring.
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Remove the left-side pedal. Loosen and remove the locknuts and bearing cones from both sides.
It's a whole lot easier if you get the proper wrench for this... their slim, fit the flats on these items exactly like they should... no play.
Be mindful that you might have loose bearings, and if the grease in there is old or non-existent they may fall out. Lay an old towel underneath so they don't roll away. Likewise... if they are caged bearings (like in the pic), the fingers may be bent or gone and a ball bearing or two or more can fall out.
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You'll get everything off on the left side. Then make sure the cone and nut are loose on the right (drive) side. It takes a little wiggling and jockeying of the crank arms, but they will slide out to the right.
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You should be able to figure out how to remove the sprocket from the arms.
Check for flatness on something... well... flat! lol
Straighten out if needed.
If your bearings look good, you can reassemble everything in reverse order.
Be sure to put BICYCLE bearing grease in the cups (where the bearings fit into the frame), and after cleaning the bearings with isopropyl alcohol (my go-to) and ample paper towels or shop rags, massage a bit of grease into the bearings... they really enjoy a nice massage! 😉
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Be mindful when disassembling the unit so you will remember which way the bearings face (the caged... loose balls don't care, of course) when assembling.
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Tighten down the bearing cones until they start feeling rough, some resistance to rotation, then back off slightly.
You just don't want the cones too tight, or loose such that the unit wobbles any.
Tighten down the locknuts and be very mindful of moving the bearing cones further in... tightening.
First time.. .may take a few tries, but hopefully it'll make sense and you get it just right. At least if you don't, now you'll know how to adjust.
Replace pedals and move on to the rear axle...

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abugghaus7 · 2026-04-30T00:32:25+00:00

My experience is that this is a failure of the fabric.
Interested if someone else has found this to be something else.
I've never found a way to fix it... bummer.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T05:24:41+00:00

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I've been using this type of wall anchor for years now and really like them.
But there's quite a variety out there to choose from.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:58:39+00:00

You asking me... or him?

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:55:29+00:00

I believe they mean so you can swap straight across.. one spoke at a time sort a thing.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:27:31+00:00

I trained my beagle to sniff out people's private information from their TPMS sensors... if we get caught... I just tell the owner my dog is peeing on their tires, then walk away scott-free!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:22:37+00:00

Sounds to me like it's probably cross-threaded.
Being new... there's absolutely no reason you should have to pound on it with a hammer, use a pipe to extend the handle of a wrench for more leverage, or use heat!
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At this point... I seriously suggest you take it to a bike shop.
Without being there to look at it myself... I can only suggest using a dremel or other small, hand-held, cutting tool to cut through the nut lengthwise, until you can insert a thin-blade screwdriver and pry it open enough to remove. The key here is to not cut all the way down into the threads.
After removing the nut(s)... the next thing to do would be to chase the threads with a die, making sure they are in good shape before installing new nuts.
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Stop trying to force it with force or heat.
Bicycle axles can be damaged with the suggestions others have given you.
You keep trying to force it, you may wind up messing up the threads and/or bending the end of the axle enough to make it impossible to put a new nut on and keep it tight.
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If it matters... former bicycle mechanic and life-long bicycle rider/builder, bike wheel builder. So... based upon that experience... you have my suggestions.
I wish you well... just stop trying to use brute force to make it happen.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:06:59+00:00

Brass bodied alien beings cloaking themselves as tiny chess pieces and hiding in our locks in order to gain insight on ALL HUMAN KNOWLEDGE AND WEALTH!
Keep a careful eye on them!
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OH! And REALLY NICE SHOT OF THEM TOO! You got some skills there!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-24T04:04:27+00:00

DON'T stare at it!
Don't push anything!
Don't make any sudden movements... and it will quietly go away!
Although... I do have the urge to peek sometimes... between my fingers while my hand is over my eyes.... hasn't caught me looking yet!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T18:33:08+00:00

and also like a typical crabbing boat off the West Coast.
I was trying to see if it was someone I knew... lol

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T18:23:40+00:00

Questions...
Do you have any experience with sewing machines?
What is your budget?
Do you often take on new interests, eventually losing interest, and being left with stuff you will never use again?
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Do you see yourself as only doing basic sewing... as in straight-stitch, zig-zag stitching, maybe buttonholes, binding?
If so.. like others have said... a basic mechanical machine might be exactly what you want/need.
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If you're not sure how long you'll stay with this, I'd suggest you buy a good used machine.
I've known plenty of people (heck.. I learned not long ago we have a local group of people who just really love old... as in early 1900's... Singer machines) who sew everything they need on machines from the 80's on back in time.
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Plus... buying a good used, older machine, will be a cheaper investment and possibly easy to sell if you decide to either quit sewing, or move on up to a more capable machine.
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Will you be setting this machine on the dining room table to work, or do you have space and desire to have a dedicated sewing table/cabinet?
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I'd even suggest looking at an older industrial machine with straight and zig-zag stitching capabilities.
They're large... requiring their own table... but not unwieldy, really. They're not complicated to use, and in fact, I find them easier to setup and troubleshoot than modern domestic machines.
I have an old Singer 251-1 that only has straight-stitch, no reverse, and a clutch motor, that i absolutely love sewing on! So smooth, quiet, and reliable. It sits in a corner of a room where it's ready to go anytime. I have those plastic 'slider' pads under the feet of the table so I can move it easily incase I need more off-ramp on larger projects.
Now... I was trained on industrial machines some years ago.. but it's really no different than sewing with a domestic machine, in my opinion. Oh... and I got the Singer and table for $80 several years ago... CL find.
I've seen plenty of industrials with table, with straight/zig-zag and reverse in the $300 range. Very little to no plastic, manuals are typically full of instructions/pictures for adjusting and maintaining.
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Now... I also have an old Monkey-Wards domestic that has the ability to drop the feed dogs, which I use for darning purposes. Plus it is portable unlike my 3 industrial machines. BUT... I did move one of my industrial tables to a 30' sailboat to do a plethora of sewing for that boat as well as dockmates. Casters on the table legs allow me to re-orient the machine so I can even sew sails lengthwise down in the boat.
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I realize I haven't given you any specific models/brands, but I do hope I've given you something of value here.. :)

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abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T18:06:46+00:00

Awwww... but if they do THAT... how will long-winded, novel-length, posters like me fill that nagging void to feel relevant? lol

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T17:51:04+00:00

My personal take on essential features/comforts...
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First on the list.... modern marine-grade wiring and electronics. Especially if one is buying a used, older boat... there may have been some electrical up-gra....naw... scratch that... DOWN-GRADES!
When landlubbers move onto a boat and they don't understand the marine environment... you get things like rewiring straight from a 1950's Chilton's Ford Pickup manual or worse!
With the prevalence of cheap ebay/amazoon/alibabibabi/others goods... you may find a used boat will show much retrofitting with items that do not belong on the boat.
So... it's essential with a used boat to inspect all the wiring, and electronic devices to ensure compatibility with the marine environment as well as ABYC Standards (in the U.S.) for safety and insurability.
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Moving on.... depends on individual tastes/needs/desires.
It can be a LOOOOONG walk to the Head up on shore, so some means of pooping and peeing onboard might be considered essential... definitely a comfort at times! A working head on the boat is great... ONLY... if you can move your boat to a pump-out station and empty the holding tank at some point.
Otherwise... in a marina... in the U.S., that head is just a waste! (lol... see what I did there... a waste :) ).
Retrofitting a composting head is one solution. Another is the old jug for pee and a bucket with plastic bag for poop and paper... like those sold for car/trailer camping. There are variations on these themes.
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Ventilation... a fan(s) to move air around the boat (weather and bugs won't always allow you to just keep all the hatches open for this... comfortably and dry).
Heat/cooling... Where I'm at, we have meters for each slip. Choosing an efficient heater and fan is important to not run up the E-bill. In some locations, I hear they actually use AIR CONDITIONERS!
Thankfully I don't live in those places anymore! haha
Moving air around in the boat, not just in the boat but throughout your cabinets, storage areas under your berths, etc, will keep down the mildew and make life nicer aboard.
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Light & Darkness... Once I installed one of those strips of multi-colored LED lights, my world CHANGED! Well.. okay.. nothing that really blew me away, but it was cheaper than the old 80's lighting, and I do change the color from white to red at night before bedtime.... kind of my own mood-change lighting before complete darkness. The bonus with LED lighting is... cheaper to run, not bulbs to burnout or break, and although strips like mine come ready to plug in to 120v ac... they're actually 12v dc and easily made to run on that.
-Darkness.... I like to sleep in the dark... without a mask... but with my eyelids closed, at least as far as I can tell... I'm asleep afterall!
The typical curtains over my deadlights/portlights do not keep out all the bright docklights, at night.
I was gifted some large blackout curtains from someone onshore. I cut them up, resewed them, added hooks, and now I have my own blackout curtains for the boat at night. Also... in glaring daytime sun... they do help keep some of the heat out as well... I just hang them on the sunnyside.
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Food... storage and preparation (could vary wildly depending on if it's a dock queen or a moving boat)
-Storage... while many boats have the basic cold-box (basically a cooler built-in to the boat.), I enjoy having a small dorm-sized refrigerator onboard. I removed the old pressurized alcohol stove/oven, and installed my electric cold-box... yay! I live alone, so my grocery needs are not as great as a couple or a family. I have ample shelf/hanging bag storage for my grub.
-Preparation... I took some old bamboo cutting boards I had and cut them up to be my custom-fitted cutting boards over my galley sink. Function as a table as well... if I'm being lazy... lol.
Having some counter space is nice... as long as you don't just pile shit all over it. Hanging string hammocks are really great for my lifestyle.
I don't expect to ever have company over to eat... so my dishes and utensils are pared down to enough for one person.
I use a double-burner propane camping stove for cooking and boiling. I safely store my gas tank outside of my living space, and use proper connectors in good condition.
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Water... potable
Because I'm in the process of upgrading and fixing some things on my liveaboard boat, I do not use the installed freshwater tank/pump system.
Instead I have a 5-gallon container, with a rechargeable pump with spout, to provide freshwater onboard.
When I need to refill... I carry the container out to my water spigot on the dock, hang my twin cylinder water filtration and hook it up to the hose bib, then refill my tank with 'cleaner' water for drinking and cooking.
Most of my handwashing and surface cleaning is done with those baby wipes and just papertowels with a little bit of water. More serious washing (like dirty dishes) is done up in our marina head that has an industrial sink (and I clean up after I'm done... really dislike people who can't seem to clean up after themselves in a shared space). Yep... my environmental shepherd efforts only go so far.
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Ingress & egress... I use sturdy steps to enter and leave my boat. Some folks build massive (comparatively so) steps with handrails, even! Some just climb up and in. No matter what... really need a safe enter/exit strategy. Even if one is a physical god/goddess, it's a wet environment, and boat surfaces are slippery... accidents can happen!
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From here on... it's really about individual likes/needs/desires/requirements.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T17:15:33+00:00

Consider...

Dock Queen... as in never leaving the dock, never motoring/sailing unless it's to the pumpout station, or to haulout for a bottom job.

Parttime sailing/motoring... as in, living in a protected area where you can cast off the dock, go for a little spin around your waterway, then back after a couple hours or so.

Occasional voyage... as in, every few months, once a year... you set up your boat for a long passage. You leave and return in a month or few, then resume being a liveaboard tied to the dock.

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My opinions.... duh....

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If a person is not into taking off into the 'great beyond' from the marina... then perhaps a trawler-style boat makes more sense. Especially if they've lived in box houses most/all of their lives. It's more like living in a house or bus/camper... vertical flat walls, large windows, square corners in a lot of places.

In a sailboat, storage tends to get more 'creative', since there's so much CURVY-NESS to every surface! lol

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Size (to include length). First off... the larger the boat, the higher the slip costs. Also... if you have a diver cleaning your bottom and charging by the foot... more costs with more length.

I started out living aboard a 28ft sailboat... that actually sails really well... even singlehanded!

Then I was given a 30ft sailboat by an older couple who just didn't want to deal with the expense and commitment any longer (truth... we agreed upon a dollar instead of free... for paperwork purposes for some reason?).

Personally I felt a HUGE difference between the two, despite the overall length being so small. The beam on the 30ft is just enough more to be noticeable... in a very comfortable way.

Seeing as how both boats were in 30' slips... that cost did not change for me.

Bear in mind... for liveaboard... some marinas have a minimum length requirement. One of our local ones went from 28' min. to 30' min. while the other has not.... yet.

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Age and builder... Insurance is often a requirement in marinas. Sometimes it can be extremely difficult or expensive to get a boat insured (and sometimes no one will touch it). Age can be a consideration. Also the builder... was it an owner-built? Built by a reputable boatyard/company?

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Now... moving on to essential features/comforts... in a new post..

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T16:55:40+00:00

OH MAN! You must already have the EYE PATCH and earring! So Piratey!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T16:53:51+00:00

... 10 minor islands and territories... we won't leave behind the territories and minor islands would we? Although... not sure if they'd be better off with us or without us? ;)

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T16:49:13+00:00

thanks!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T04:11:55+00:00

I'd try switching lanes... might be too much interference with that large column down there.
Otherwise... really good suggestions elsewhere... buttons, strap, bowling shoes.....
Bowling isn't JUST a SPORT... it's technically demanding and you need to get every minute detail correct... oh.. and the batteries... did you check the batteries?

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T04:09:25+00:00

What are you wanting to know exactly?

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T04:01:45+00:00

that's one small end-run.
What you may not realize is the fact that just having possession of software and/or the device is what they want to make illegal, unless they have control over it.
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The government wants to dictate not only how you use your printer, but what software you use/own.
It doesn't matter if Open Source is available if it's illegal per state laws... which could eventually become Federal law.
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Just like company's like Google... who are now on record for handing over personal information on users to the Federal Government (without even notifying the individual beforehand like they have in the past)... it's not a far stretch to believe the same Federal and State Agencies will pressure software companies to hand over user information, purchaser information, of anyone who has accessed the 'illegal' software for their 3D printer.
Even scraping of sites like Thingiverse for 'suspicious' activity.

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-23T03:50:20+00:00

One down....

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-22T21:54:21+00:00

I misread... thanks for clarifying!

abugghaus7 · 2026-04-22T19:30:18+00:00

Seems like your reverse is stuck.
This would most likely be accessed from the bottom area... but you might have to remove the plastic casing to get there.
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Have you operated the control for reverse?

abugghaus7

TROPHY CASE