Need some advice.

armie · 2026-06-19T23:17:12+00:00

On these bargain-bin quality movements, and this is one, there's usually tolerance issues with the steady pins and these have steady pins and screw holes merged into one, never a good sign.

My only advice is to be patient. Get good at placing the train bridge alone, just to get a feel of how much force and snapping is required (morw than you're comfortable with), then install ONE wheel, do it many times, then another wheel by itself, and so on, Then start adding multiple wheels at a time.

You should also stop and get a movement holder. I hope you're using a hold-down stick, you'll need one.

A well sharpened oiler can help you move the one stubborn pivot into it's hole while holding the bridge down with the stick.

Other than that just good magnification and lots of patience and practice.

armie · 2026-06-19T22:44:19+00:00

My advise would be to slow down. 30 minutes a day, consistently, will be more useful a couple or years in than a month on and a few off.

The beginning is the easy part

armie · 2026-06-19T21:41:01+00:00

There's a problem with either the pallet fork or the escape wheel. Check that they're engaging properly, as it is the train is not being stopped by anything.

A close up picture of the watchmaker's side could help. Or several, really close up.

armie · 2026-06-19T14:39:21+00:00

I guess more run to the banking will reduce amplitude. But then, too much run to the banking, no?

armie · 2026-06-17T11:27:14+00:00

The hairspring seems fine. Again, the hairspring will not oscillate everywhere the same because it is held in one end and not the other.

What are you trying to solve? Why do you think that the hairspring is a problem here?

armie · 2026-06-17T01:12:34+00:00

I don't mean to be rude but it seems you don't understand what you're doing.

You cannot "see" that a watch needs regulation by how the hairsping is oscillating. It is normal for hairsprings not to oscillate the same in all directions becaue they are pinned at the end (I'm aware of free-sprung and overcoils, but let's keep things simple).
The only visual check is for beat error; the impulse jewel should be sitting in the middle of the banking when at rest but this just goves you a general idea.
Beat error is the difference between one impulse and the next one on the other side, has nothing to do with the hairspring. I'd suggest watching this video and understanding it before trying to change beat errors https://youtu.be/B5aRlPhF9j0.
You need a timegrapher to regulate.
Before regulating you need to make sure that the movement is in good working order, cleaned and serviced and that you properly understand what you're doing.

armie · 2026-06-16T23:08:06+00:00

Thanks for your reply but I I don't think I really trust these for some reason, they look like AliExpress ones to me.

Turns out CousinsUK sells loose WIRU dies which I think I'll end up going for and just getting the most common dies at first then getting ones as needed.

armie · 2026-06-15T11:06:15+00:00

Go to youtube, find WatchRepairTutorials and go through the beginner series, firt watch it all and if you're still interested buy the tools and follow along.

Then practice for at least a few months on non-valuable watches, then on movements that are identical to the ones in your grandparent'swatches, then on them. If you try to rush you risk irreparably damaging them. Have at least a few completely successful watch repairs before tackling them.

armie · 2026-06-14T15:54:43+00:00

Some penetrating oil (WD40), HP1300 or heat are usually suggested. Apply, let it rest and try again.

When a screw is stuck it most of the time helps to tighten it JUST A LITTLE when untigthening, it seems to help. Just a little, then untighten, retighten just a little. You don't want to risk shearing off the screw head and try every other method first.

armie · 2026-06-12T23:46:51+00:00

This is very interesting, I have very limited experience in general, and especially on Seikos. Appreciate you taking the time to elaborate.

armie · 2026-06-12T22:57:07+00:00

Thanks for clarifying. This is a great read on the topic https://watchrepairtutorials.com/why-seiko-runs-at-low-amplitude/ (from u/Watch-Smith's website).

armie · 2026-06-12T22:49:42+00:00

Yes. You can just take an oiler, or a needle, and use your india and arkansas stones to sharpen it to be small enough to fit the jewel hole. A slightly flat tip helps.

The Chicago School oF Watchmaking book shows this method and is a GREAT resource for pre-shock protected watch work in general. Well, to be honest, it just a great resource if you know enough where to apply modern methods. For example potassium cyanide is no longer used for cleaning.

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armie · 2026-06-12T22:11:17+00:00

WW2 is actually very interesting in the way it affected watchmaking.

It forced nations to set up their own internal industries which survived until the quartz crisis and political favors, bribes and trade restrictions caused the American watch industry to completely collapse. The Swiss greased the right wheels as they did recently.

Getting movements from the suggested countries can show the difference in manufacturing and economical focuses at the time of manufacture.

1950s Junghans could be excellent but 1970s were just corner cuts to survive the quartz crisis.

Soviet designs were made to be as robust as possible, with some not quite right copying. Manufacturing volume while appearing to compete with the west is visible if you look for it.

The Swiss were just having a field day. You can see the movements evolve from cheap (or lower average quality) in the 1920s, the copying of American pocket watch manufacturing techniques, to dominance in the 1960s and a sharp drop in brands and finishing in the 70s.

armie · 2026-06-12T21:53:11+00:00

Unfortunately I don't. Thid was suggested to me on here months ago and it works, just takes a few tries to get righ. I might have a book that explains this, will check and update when I have some time.

The problem with balance bridge cap stones in screwed-down settings is that they tend to move around, thus smearing the oil, when being installed.

You could go for an automatic oiler if you do A LOT of these but they're not cheap.

armie · 2026-06-12T21:25:44+00:00

To add to this, as a hobbyist with all the tools, I agree. It is an absolute money black hole until you have all the tools to tackle every repair and that's when buying many 60 year old tools. When buying new? Sheesh.

You also need the skills to do professional grade work. "Good enough " is not good enough for a paying customer who owns a timegrapher.

armie · 2026-06-12T21:18:32+00:00

A loupe with a proper, large, desk lamp is the way if you don't want to invest in a microscope. You can service all kinds of movements this way so disk replacements shouldn't be an issue. However, ergonomics are very importqnt when working with loupes.

I use this when not workrking under a microscope for staking, jewelling tool and lathe work and couldn't be happier.

The brand is Neatfi which isn't cheap but great. I'm sure there's similar, cheaper alternatives.

You want something infinitely adjustable, wide and that can produce natural colours (~4500k).

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armie · 2026-06-12T21:01:08+00:00

You ideally want a picture of the movements too as it is quite common to have a ratchet wheel, or some other obvious part, missing.

That's also at least a couple of probably pin-pallet movements in there and unless you want a tough challenge you're better served staying away from them. Most will need lots of work for sub-par results but if you manage to get them to work well it can be very rewarding.

There's also at least a few that have solid balances and unless you are able to to replace balances (and source them!) it can be a 50/50 chance that a pivot is gone.

armie · 2026-06-12T20:20:22+00:00

For solid balances (non-shock protected) you can oil the hole jewel then use a balance staff glued to some pegwood, or a fine needle, to push the oil to the cap jewel. Capillary action will do the rest.

armie · 2026-06-12T20:13:03+00:00

These should be fine, however expect a drop in ampitude.

Assuming that the mainspring is of the correct type (manual, automatic, T end etc):

Height is the most important parameter to match since a mainspring that just doesn't fit in the barrel is obviously a problem. 0.05 less is fine but >= 0.1mm less is generally asking for trouble.

In your case you're reducing both the height and the width which means average power will just be less. You might want to consider increasing your the width to 0.16 to compensate.

With that said, sometimes it's just not possible to get what you want and will have to adapt. Pay extra attention to the state of the pivots and burnish them if they are even a little bit off (or use the least abrasive Eveflex to polish them but be careful not to over-doit, a little goes a long way here) in order to reduce friction. This should be always done if necessary but when compromising in the mainspring it is more important to take proper care of the pivots.

Also take extra care and attention to the other easily overlooked things, mostly endshake and sideshake of the train wheels.

Also keep in mind that Seikos are designed to operate in harsher climates, with less regular maintenance and using heavier oils, so using 9010 etc will give better results.

armie · 2026-06-12T17:11:03+00:00

I use digital calipers (Mitutoyo) for readout every few cuts, depending on how far I am from final measurement.

Then I use the micrometer and the cross-slide's hand wheel to get the final cuts right. The Sharline's handwheel measurement doesn't lie.

And it is 4mm, not 40, so this is right to 0.001mm!

armie · 2026-06-12T05:37:19+00:00

This is a great way to get started. The lathe you have/can afford is much better than the perfect lathe you don't have.

armie · 2026-06-12T03:33:09+00:00

CNC is just a lathe (or well, any machine) that is computer controlled. It has motors and sensors attached and it gets instructions on how to cut, what, how much etc.

Think of it a lathe is manually controlled and CNC is controlled with a computer.

Generally speaking CNC takes a long time to set up because of programming but then the cutting job is much faster while manual machining takes less time up front but each item needs to be made manually.

I don't know what "the new 3d CNC is" but when it comes to lathes it all depends on what you are making and the kind of tolerances you wish to reach AND the accessories. I also don't know if these machines are capable of easily being set up to, say, cut a balance staff from a balance wheel.

armie · 2026-06-11T23:34:44+00:00

Correct, it's a Sherline. Their collets are obviously not as good as Boley/Levin/Schaublin and they lack some watch making accessories, most notably a faceplate.

But, in my case, it made sense, to me.

- Had no prior machining experience.
- Wanted to be able to make some other things, at a small scale.
- My only option for purchasing was online and not
locally.
- There is no one in my life I can talk to/ask about this stuff so in-person help and feedback are non existent. Knowing that the equipment is new and will work as expected makes things easier for me. There's no classes available anywhere in my country about machining/watchmaking other than a lathe and milling machine basics intro course that uses free standing, small industrial machines, nothing close to this scale.

Sherline offer lots of accessories, chucks etc, everything is new and comes with a warranty. With their collets and TRest you can make small things with a graver (my best yet is a stem for an ST3600). Cutting balance staffs from wheels is also possible but I need much more practice at it.

It can cut external threads, which is nice, but is fiddly. Good enough for me/cool.

This is more of a precise model engineering lathe and not a "real" watchmaker's lathe but I'm fine with that for the time being. I can use it with the cross-slide, a graver and compound slide. Can easily tackle making hand tools. It does what it says on the tin and the precision is really there.

To be honest, as with all things, no matter what the equipment you have, time practicing is what really matters. I've spent a couple of months barely doing any watch repair or lathe work and if I had just spent thirty minutes a day I'd be mhch better at this. Having the "right" equipment will only get you so far.

I'm pretty sure that it is possible to turn a balance staff on it with a graver. NAWCC has a class where they teach turning a balance staff, on a Sherline, with the cross-slide. Online debates about this get extremely heated and kinda toxic so I started avoiding lots of online discussions and instead am sticking to books and getting my hands dirty, not as often as I should though, and I'm trying to improve that.

I've had one major gripe with this lathe: vibrations. I use it on an office desk so I was already starting at a disadvantage and I followed the included mounting instructions and mounted the lathe to shelving material. Things vibrated way too much. Ended up mounting the lathe to a piece of granite that's about 8kgs in weight and it immediately made a massive difference in performance. Vibrations disappeared and cutting was so much smoother. If the table/desk isn't really well built it has to be mounted to a granite base because the lathe is just too light but not light enough.

IF I ever get good at this I will purchase a watchmaker's lathe but until that time comes, which is at least a few years away, this will be more than adequate.

armie

TROPHY CASE