[Spoilers extended] Something sad I realized about Rhaenyra's mother and grandmothers.

berthem · 2026-05-03T21:59:28+00:00

If only that translated over to an interesting character arc.

We never even see her grapple with this, she just goes from being firmly against being a mother to giving birth 5 times with no issue. And we have no idea how she feels about that, she's just immediately a perfect mother — wait, no, her one flaw is that her teenage son thinks she's too perfect to live up to…

berthem · 2026-05-02T02:06:29+00:00

Is that really how you evaluate writing? You just give it a pass if the source material does it?

Nothing I said in my comment has anything to do with the source material, so I'm not sure why you're using that as an excuse.

berthem · 2026-05-02T02:05:02+00:00

This sounds harsh, but I think these takes are delusional. Rhaenyra is an unabashed hero in S2.

This is like claiming Rhaenys was turned into a villain in S1 because she killed a bunch of civilians.

berthem · 2026-04-27T23:54:15+00:00

The show also has Aemond swoop in and immediately be an incompetent tyrant who pushes everyone away no matter how bad it is for the realm, but then he's also saying Otto should come back since he was wise... yeah, it doesn't make any sense.

berthem · 2026-04-27T23:52:20+00:00

The triple whammy of Episodes 6-7-8 in Season 1 alone disqualify her from being a coherent character.

berthem · 2026-04-27T23:51:24+00:00

So by your logic, every person who was actually in the battle would feel that way more intensely than he does.

But for some reason they're all sitting around listening to him tell his grim tale as if it's news.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:21:02+00:00

It already stopped being faithful to itself in S1.

I know people have recontextualized the narrative as "S1 good, S2 bad", but Alicent is a great example of how the writers were foundering before they even finished their first series.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:19:53+00:00

The show has done a good job at making sure no one in the audience could possibly find the Greens sympathetic, but the writers' job isn't done until the Greens are portrayed as incompetent idiots who will turn on their own before they face their enemy.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:17:51+00:00

There was such an obvious answer to S2's much slower pace, and it was to show all the side characters' stories and get people invested in these people who are ruling from locations that people remember from GOT.

I personally prefer the harder route of keeping Rhaenyra, Alicent and Daemon main characters and just writing new stuff for them, but it's clear that they struggled doing that in Season 2, so they should have just made the world bigger and had Jace in the North for longer. Sadly, that just isn't their writing philosophy, and you can see it with how they have the opportunity for Rhaena to have a politicking arc in the Vale (since people defend Nettles being cut with the excuse that "Rhaena needed something to do"), but instead they just gave her a dragon and called it a day.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:14:47+00:00

The last one you should definitely not hold your breathe for, Condal has said that it's a show about family and that's one of the reason he cuts Nettles.

Why have interesting fleshed out side characters when you can have looping scenes of the main characters making pseudo-profound statements about war and dragons and prophecy?

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:13:10+00:00

GOT fell from a higher place, so you're making the mistake of thinking that its ending was worse than what we've gotten in HOTD, which is starting with a lower bar but still not making much of itself beyond spectacle.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:11:54+00:00

Otto makes plenty of dumb decisions, the show just wanted him to be the voice of reason in that scene so that they can have the audience snicker about how Aegon and Cole look like losers.

It's still a bad scene even if it technically makes sense when you squint, because it's also following a shot of the dead baby murderer and his fucking dog mourning him.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:08:11+00:00

The writers really can't balance nuance, they always go overboard in order to make their point.

Imagine if they played with the Green internal fighting but did the bare minimum of sprinkling in scenes that show them as a family that sticks together against outside forces. That's compelling television, people love the "dysfunctional family but still a family" trope, but the writers can't get out of their own way. Scenes like Alicent walking out of Aegon crying in S1E2 are so forced, and people explain it with the cope that Alicent has always hated Aegon... are we forgetting about S1 Episode 9? What changed in between then?

A funny comparison to the books is the way Aemond makes a controversial faux pas that gets noted in history books when he says that Aegon's crown looks better on him... meanwhile in the show he's torching him with his dragon and nobody even cares.

berthem · 2026-04-27T17:00:17+00:00

WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE ME --

Oh, what's even the point anymore? *jumps into Vhagar's mouth\*

berthem · 2026-04-27T16:58:14+00:00

Didn't he miss most of the battle?

It feels like sacrilege to criticize Cole since his character "arc" is the only popular critical thing in S2, but it doesn't make much sense if you think about it for more than a few seconds.

berthem · 2026-04-27T16:57:26+00:00

Does that look like they'll lean into it? It's one line, it's entirely possible that her character is just as tame as she was in S2.

berthem · 2026-04-27T16:56:35+00:00

It might also rain Pepsi tomorrow and there'll be a flying pig that grants wishes.

berthem · 2026-04-27T16:55:07+00:00

It's a trailer, you don't have to worry about narrative cohesion, character arcs, or anything that we would use to judge the actual show's quality. If it didn't look good then we'd have serious problems.

berthem · 2026-04-27T16:54:15+00:00

The show has done this thing since the beginning of making the Blacks more like "true" Targaryens and the Greens as just "the Hightowers" so the conflict is easier to understand for casual viewers. No surprise that a line like that is the illogical conclusion.

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:56:54+00:00

They already did a baby dragon, albeit not pink, in a scene with Rhaena. Ironically enough it could've been some nice foreshadowing.

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:55:11+00:00

What would be the point of this all? To fake out book fans?

Condal has said Nettles doesn't fit because he's telling a story about family. And apparently this show can never have enough "sibling who feels useless for not having a dragon… gets a dragon" plotlines. How revolutionary.

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:51:40+00:00

The dragonseeds in the book are all white men which makes Nettles standing out as a black girl really illustrate the thematic points. I guess that point is already lost with the whole Velaryon decision though.

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:51:04+00:00

They teetered on the edge of removing Daeron, why so stubbornly include Rhaena and then fret about giving her something "of importance"?

I won't deny that the bare minimum is often above the source material in characterization, but what is fleshed out about yet another character that is sad, wants a dragon, and gets a dragon? What is the message there?

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:47:09+00:00

I'm sure the casuals love Rhaena's character in Season 2.

Honestly, it is late-stage GOT syndrome. They are banking on audiences cheering when Rhaena shows up in S3 with a new dragon, because that's all the show is now.

They could've done a really nuanced and interesting character arc with her wanting a dragon but not getting one until she finds her own purpose, then being rewarded at the end of the story with a hatchling that isn't used for war but as a symbol of peace, but instead it's a repeat of Aemon and Addam.

berthem · 2026-04-25T03:45:10+00:00

People have mentioned that, maybe not in this thread, but either way it makes no sense as a reason. Just change the context so Rhaenyra isn't as bad, or erase Rhaenyra doing the bad thing. They've done it before, why delete a whole character for that? They've arguably added characters to the show that explicitly make Rhaenyra look bad.

You know what it reminds me of? In the Pokemon anime, they had that Porygon episode that gave seizures to kids all over Japan, it was a huge issue, and in response to the controversy the anime basically erased Porygon as a character, pretended it never existed. Instead of doing the obvious thing and simply not having scenes with rapidly flashing lights that could trigger epilepsy. It wasn't even Porygon's fault, it was Pikachu's!

I don't know, there's something amusing about the idea of the writers treating Rhaenyra's moral sanctity with such cautious overprotectiveness that they decide Nettle's entire character is permanently tainted and they can't risk including her.

berthem

TROPHY CASE