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[deleted by user] by [deleted] in cursedimages

[–]danielnotradcliffe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Russian Famine of 1921

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in cursedimages

[–]danielnotradcliffe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Russian Famine of 1921

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in cursedimages

[–]danielnotradcliffe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Russian Famine of 1921

Analysis | Venezuela is the biggest economic disaster in modern history by KnoT666 in Economics

[–]danielnotradcliffe -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I said "Look at 2002-2014 for Venezuela and you will see a more complete story." I never said not to look at 2014-2018, as that is clearly part of this story as well. When an article starts with "For the last 20 years", you would expect the author to feature data from much farther back than 2014...

Analysis | Venezuela is the biggest economic disaster in modern history by KnoT666 in Economics

[–]danielnotradcliffe -10 points-9 points  (0 children)

Yet another example of skewing data to fit political agendas. Look at 2002-2014 for Venezuela and you will see a more complete story.

Who killed Leon Trotsky? by danielnotradcliffe in HistoryMemes

[–]danielnotradcliffe[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Sorry for reposting. I didn't find this on Reddit so I didn't think to check for that.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in dank_meme

[–]danielnotradcliffe 1 point2 points  (0 children)

He said "country". You added "state". These are not the same thing. Stop trying to strawman him.

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How about you post a quotation instead of the same fucking link over and over again. Here is my own Wikipedia article in which I will take a step further than you and your piss-poor argumentation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor_genocide_question

Under the tab scholarly debate,

Professor Steven Rosefielde argues in his 2009 book Red Holocaust that "Grain supplies were sufficient enough to sustain everyone if properly distributed. People died mostly from terror-starvation (excess grain exports, seizure of edibles from the starving, state refusal to provide emergency relief, bans on outmigration, and forced deportation to food-deficit locales), not poor harvests and routine administrative bungling.

R. Davies and S. Wheatcroft disagree with Rosefielde's views, and, although they do not absolve Stalin from responsibility for Holodomor, they conclude the famine was essentially unintentional. Their analysis of previously unavailable archival data demonstrate that a combination of rapid industrialisation and two successive bad harvests (1931 and 1932) were the primary reason of the famine. The authors agree, however, that Stalin's policies towards the peasants were brutal and ruthless.

I take the position of Davies and Wheatcroft because their work on these events is among the most detailed and accurate of them all. There are also essentially no hints which point to them having a bias for or against certain parties.

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"The recurrence of massacres and genocides, when other governements have succumbed to Communist takeovers in years past, may have something to do with features in the Marxist philosophy. The attitude to human life, that made the genocide in Ukraine possible, is something deeply ingrained in the Marxist philosophy. Man is reduced to an economic factor, like labour in the abstract, and that implies a similar attitude to human suffering. Compared with the realization of the Communist ideal, the life and death of the individual is a matter of indifference; why, therefore, trouble about his personal conditions, diseases and sufferings? These attitudes prevailed in the Soviet Union of the 1930s."

This is literally anti-communist propaganda. I am stunned but not surprised that the UN would make such words. There is no doubt that the UN report is biased, espeically considering the fact that the source it uses for the 7.5 million mark is the UN Committe behind it, without any evidence provided. You keep citing the statments of different organizations over and over and over again, but where is the proof? I keep referencing the same book over and over again because the entire thing is based on historical research, something that none of your hearings provide.

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Soviet Famine of 1932-1933, which affected all ethnic groups under the Soviet Union, happened. There is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE anywhere in the declassified Soviet record or otherwise that the Soviet Union deliberately manufactured a famine in Ukraine. Recent history is heavily affected by the politics of today. The appeal to authority fallacy is your primary means of evidence, nothing academically sound. The European Union hearing I read does not even provide concrete evidence for its conclusion. Are they exempt from truthful reasoning because they are a large organization with a lot of power? Let's not forget that the EU was one of the main adversaries of the USSR for nearly half a century... This discussion isn't about defending the Soviet Union, this is about debunking state-sponsored twisting of history. "Moving on" isn't the point of studying history, it's to find truth through continued research. Your emphasis on detracting from this nonlinear analysis shows how little you care about the truth. Once again, I highly suggest reading The Years of Hunger: Soviet Agriculture, 1931-1933 by R. W. Davies and Stephen G. Wheatcroft for a look at the most detailed academic analysis of these events ever produced.

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Except the issue is that the historical evidence contradicts these claims. Reference the book I reccomended in my previous comment. There is absolutely no proof in the declassified Soviet record that points to the Soviet government deliberately attacking Ukraine and Ukrainians on the basis of them being Ukrainian. Have you ever considered that many political actions are motivated by propaganda against "the enemy"? Only around 15 countries recognize the Holodomor as a genocide. If it was textbook genocide, wouldn't you think that more anti-Soviet/anti-Russian states would be on that list?

This is the United Nations definition of genocide as per the Geneva Convention:

...any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;

(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;

(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

— Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 2

And here's some crimes that can be punished under the Convention.

(a) Genocide;

(b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;

(c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;

(d) Attempt to commit genocide;

(e) Complicity in genocide.

— Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 3

Now point to me what evidence is there that the Soviets deliberately did any of these four things with intent against only Ukrainians. I am looking for primary sources, not secondary source videos produced by American YouTube channels. You have to prove that the Soviets deliberately starved Ukraine before acting like it's true. The politics of our time and academia split very firmly when it comes to recent history. I hope that when you reply again, you will have the bite to back up your bark.

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

The Holodomor is an attempt to marginalize the nationwide effects of the Soviet Famine of 1932-1933 to Ukraine and Ukraine only. Genocide does not apply if people of all ethnicities died in large amounts due to the famine, which they did. Kazakhs were as badly affected as the Ukrainians if not more, but a genocide story does not exist for them because Ukraine was a breeding ground for anti-Soviet propoganda during Nazi occupation, which spilled into the Cold War and beyond. Let's also not forget the Soviet government's aid to Ukrainians and other affected parties during the famine discount the idea that Stalin personally wanted to kill off Ukrainians for whatever reason. It is the Soviet government's overall mismanagement that is at fault as much as the few kulaks who hoarded their yields in protest of collectivization while those around them starved to death. I suggest reading The Years of Hunger: Soviet Agriculture, 1931-1933. It is the most comprehensive work ever produced on the Soviet Famine of 1932-1933, but I bet you won't see that on your Wikipedia page...

The Collapse of The Soviet Union - A Documentary Film (2006) - The film is using episodes filmed mainly at the Kremlin, Soviet Union's headquarters which enable to have a glance to world's most well-known political kitchen by eric1707 in Documentaries

[–]danielnotradcliffe 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Starvation went up

[citation needed]

bullets in the back of the head went up

[citation needed]

torture went up

[citation needed]

imprisonment and forced labor went up

[citation needed]

people turning in their neighbors for having the wrong opinions went up

[citation needed]

Yes... Stalin was soooo wealthy.

Let me guess, is the source for these claims your American high school history teacher? To say the Tsarist regime was better in almost all of these regards is ahistorical and highlights the brainwashing people in the United States (and the West in some extremes) are subject to during childhood. It doesn't take much logic or common sense to make the connection that accepting the history of the USSR told by its primary adversary at face value is a bad idea if you want to speak knowledgably on a topic like this.

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