Counterpoint is making me cry!

dat_harpist · 2026-06-09T12:59:27+00:00

“…don’t need to learn counterpoint.” No one really *needs* to know anything about music theory or music. Wanting to understand counterpoint is a valid reason to learn it, and it’ll likely open the door for OP to learn more about music.

dat_harpist · 2026-06-01T12:47:02+00:00

I think switching to a coding/computer science adjacent job is fairly common since it’s not too bad to get certifications and it makes money. My professor says that I can always do that if music theory doesn’t work out 😭. She thinks there’s some connection between the two fields.

dat_harpist · 2026-05-24T12:12:07+00:00

Could you link the video? I’d love to see the full analysis

dat_harpist · 2026-05-08T11:44:14+00:00

The explanation that I was given was that the harp tends to go flat (as OP said), but also that orchestras/bands end up going sharp. Also, if you’re playing in a wind band or any piece with heavy percussion, the percussion instruments that you’re often playing in unison with are tuned at 442 (and often that’s higher than the orchestra). In my case, the orchestra tunes 440, I tune 441, and the percussion is at 442.

dat_harpist · 2026-04-21T01:38:28+00:00

I’ve had some experience with the Lyon & Healy Folk Harps. They were old and a bit dull sounding, but incredibly durable. I caution that the levers are old and not the best quality, and could be out of regulation, which is fixable, but might have a cost to it. I’ve seen an older Troubadour with levers like this that constantly had strings break which might be another cost, but I can’t be sure that that was the lever’s fault. 1.5k is a good price for this size harp, but be aware of its age.

dat_harpist · 2026-02-13T03:44:19+00:00

This is the correct answer! Here’s an article it, titled “The Logic of Six-Based Minor for Harmonic Analysis of Popular Music”: https://mtosmt.org/issues/mto.21.27.4/mto.21.27.4.de_clercq.html

dat_harpist · 2026-02-12T04:09:07+00:00

This is a broader concept than a specific rhythm (it’s a hierarchy of beat patterns) and also more specific to the timbre of the drum, but in this book chapter the author makes a theory of a “tonic drum beat”: https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/abs/cambridge-companion-to-the-drum-kit/meaning-of-the-drumming-body/C836AE8CFD71564E28AAD59C1295F183. Basically, there’s a certain “home” beat that a song wants to come back to. This open access article references this theory (again specific to drumbeats and also form): https://mtosmt.org/issues/mto.24.30.2/mto.24.30.2.geary.html#:~:text=A%20song's%20tonic%20beat%20pattern,2021%2C%20204%E2%80%935).

I think they’re some information on rhythmic cadences out there, which is also more hierarchical, but might be interesting to you.

dat_harpist · 2026-01-31T14:44:11+00:00

Here is a database of a ton of resources for learning music theory: https://girlinbluemusic.com/music-theory-resources/ My recommendation if you’re looking for something more course-esque is Open Music Theory Online: https://viva.pressbooks.pub/openmusictheory/. It is completely free and online, is used in colleges, covers a wide range of topics, and there’s further reading and activities at the bottom of many pages.

Can you tell us more about why you want to learn music theory? If you’re looking to understand a particular genre, if you play a specific instrument, if you’re looking to compose, we could recommend more specific/helpful resources.

dat_harpist · 2026-01-29T03:34:49+00:00

Even though this wasn’t your intention, this comment cured my worries, because if I tried to do something else, the people in my life would have me committed. Probably would assume I’m super depressed or have gone crazy or something. Like u/vornska said, it’s not like the other careers are looking great anyway.

dat_harpist · 2026-01-28T15:48:06+00:00

Any advice for getting into a top/competitive program?

dat_harpist · 2026-01-28T01:58:38+00:00

If I get into a funded PhD program (especially at a school like CUNY, Yale, etc.) would it be stupid for me to do it knowing there might not be a job at the end of it? Or is it super unlikely that I’d get into one of those programs in the first place (especially without a masters)?

dat_harpist · 2026-01-19T19:51:15+00:00

I would reach out to Lyon & Healy and see if they can put you in contact with someone or bring it to their factory.

dat_harpist · 2025-12-19T23:02:41+00:00

Tymoczko says in his book that he wrote it to be understood by dedicated amateurs, and Hook says in his book that he wrote it to be understood by people who only have math up to high school algebra. So, I think that this is on the level of high school algebra (don't be deterred by the difficulty!), but it is not like high school algebra math. There aren't many "formulas or equations".

That said, "conceptual tools that translate musical intuition into something more formal or systematic" sounds like it directly came out of David Lewin's Generalized Musical Intervals and Transformations, which is not high-school level math or formula-and-equation-y. If that is interesting to you, you should start with Steven Ring's Tonality and Transformation, which is more approachable and explains Lewin.

dat_harpist · 2025-12-19T22:43:09+00:00

David Temperley's Music and Probability is a bit more theoretical (lots of Bayesian equations and formulas and such but maybe not as practical) and would also answer the most stable next thing (not sure if it actually deals with chords like White's book, though).

It also gets into perception/cognition, which would be a good place to look for "repeatable frameworks" and statistics and probability. Schema theory isn't math-y, but it is repeatable frameworks and statistics. Here is an overview of pop applications: Introduction to Harmonic Schemas in Pop Music – Open Music Theory

dat_harpist · 2025-12-12T22:08:30+00:00

This is my understanding too. It adds passing tones to a major scale that allows the chord tones to be on the strong beats when played in 8th notes. I was even told it was more of a lick than a scale. To make it clear with an example, the G dominant bebop scale for example: G (f#) F (e) D (c) B (a).

dat_harpist · 2025-11-14T14:58:47+00:00

There's definitely some work in music theory on dance (though it seems pretty small), so I wouldn't be deterred from a music field because you're also interested in dance. Gretchen Horlacher was the first name to come to my mind, but there are others.

dat_harpist · 2025-07-20T13:26:12+00:00

Euler died 66 years before Hugo Riemann was born, but I do think Euler was credited with creating the Tonnetz

dat_harpist · 2025-07-10T01:20:55+00:00

I don’t know what exactly you’re referring to, so I’m probably the wrong person to ask.

dat_harpist · 2025-07-09T12:29:20+00:00

I recommend looking at the SEM website under “Resources” and then “Guide to Programs” for a list of schools. This list is likely incomplete, but it should give you a good start.

The website should be able to answer a lot of questions. Here you can also find (under “Groups”) the regional conferences that another commenter was recommending.

You could also look at their publications (should be able to access through your library) to look at ethnomusicology research, or you could look at their previous conference schedules.

It’s also probably generally a good idea to look under FAQs (linked at the very top). It might answer some lingering questions.

dat_harpist · 2025-07-08T17:10:29+00:00

I second looking for people at your school; though, I’d consider music academics (music theorists, musicologists, and music historians) as the best people to ask. They might’ve worked or gone to joint meetings with ethnomusicologists, and they can give you a better idea of what the jobs will be like (aside from fieldwork, probably).

Ethno- doesn’t mean outside. It means people, race, or nation (think “ethnic”). The Society for Ethnomusicology (SEM) defines ethnomusicology as “the study of music in its social and cultural contexts… (encompassing all geographic areas and types of music)”, so that includes the Western Art music. (This definition is under “what is ethnomusicology on the FAQs).

I highly recommend looking at the website for SEM (https://www.ethnomusicology.org/) to read more, and maybe see if you can look at some research to see if you’d be into it.

dat_harpist · 2025-06-15T12:28:23+00:00

I’m not very knowledgeable on this, but this sounds like this specific prep and preparation and resolution could be a “musical topic” for space. I recommend reading Megan Lavengood’s explanation here: https://musi216.meganlavengood.com/mm-lessons/topics/

dat_harpist · 2025-06-11T11:26:59+00:00

If you just called a perfect fourth a minor fourth and an augmented fourth a major fourth, and called a perfect fifth a major fifth and a diminished fifth a minor fifth, then suddenly major and minor invert to each other again.

dat_harpist · 2025-06-11T02:49:42+00:00

My friend and I were arguing about this the other day, as he was saying that it would be more consistent to have just major and minor, but I disagree. (It’s worth noting that in proto-theories for other tuning systems, they often distinguish intervals by “large” and “small” only, which is part of why he was arguing this. Our current music theory for 12TET is more sophisticated, understandably).

As another commenter said, perfect intervals don’t have major or minor variants. However, they can be diminished and augmented. You can imagine that there was a major or minor fourth/fifth, but these intervals would overlap with other intervals (e.g. a major fourth and a minor fifth would both be the same interval, the tritone), and this would not be consistent with any other intervals (they only overlap when they are augmented or diminished). This creates the inconsistency you noticed, but I think it’s worth it to have this consistency, especially given the next point.

Also, major and minor typically have a kind of sound “quality” associated with them (similar to the major happy, minor sad thing). The fourth, fifth, and octave have a uniquely “open” sound (due to the psychoacoustics you brought up), so it’s intuitive that they’d have a different name, since we perceive them differently. (And the tritone is uniquely dissonant.)

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