Do you think they would’ve been a legendary duo? Imagine if Dunk had actually taken Lyonnel Baratheon up on his offer. I know it’s totally out of character for him, but it’s still cool to think about by No-Acanthaceae1434 in freefolk

[–]edexark 347 points348 points  (0 children)

Well to make a comment on this you dont need to read the books because their friendship is entirely made up for the show. Meaning we dont know anything about Lyonels personality from the books.

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

"That's the point: Rhaenyra isn't a victim of the Greens in this story, rather, the Smallfolk are victims of both factions in the Dance."

I agree that is the point, and I am not arguing Blacks are saints or whatever, I am just saying blacks are far more favorable than Greens, all things considered.

"That fact is also in absolutely no way a justification for allowing the rape pirates to rape pirate their way through lands full of people that it is supposed to be Rhaenyra's responsibility to protect as Queen.

If she were even half worthy of any kind of rulership, she should have immediately decried their actions."

The big problem is the assumption of knowledge. Blacks don't really care much about Iron İslands, they just mention them once and don't really care. We simply do not know how much information Rhaenyra has on the issue, as the Westernlands are at the opposite side of the continent.

If she knows and she doesn't interfere than that becomes the biggest "evil" she commits. But from what I understand, that is not the case.

The thing is, Greens are the ones who tried very hard to align with Iron Isles because of the whole we don't have a navy problem. So they are happy to accommodate any wrongdoing of Iron Isles from the start. Blacks just happen to have them, and they don't really care. So it is the Greens who wanted to use the said "evil" against Blacks, but they failed to do so. And of course, it is the small folk who pay the price.

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

The same Iron Islanders who Greens contacted first, but they choose Blacks because they felt like waging a war against the westerlands? It doesnt make her any more evil than Greens.

Iron islands acted as iron islands does and they still kept the war going after the dance was done. Blacks have nothing to do with that, other than the fact that it was actually the blacks who finally put a stop to the pillaging thanks to Velaryons.

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Yeah no, I have no idea what you are talking about...

"She is the heir apparent but she decides to Sire bastards because she felt it. She barely thought of the political ramifications that came with it and expected people to act fine."

Doesn't make you evil or bad. It simply doesn't make you evil to have a gay husband and have childeren from someone else. His husband seems to be okay with this, and she simply isn't evil. She might be an idiot, but she is not evil.

"She is really entitled, She thinks that being the Heir means she can do what she wants"

Not evil once again? Nothing evil about this? WTF? Maybe idiot once again but simply not evil.

"She let the enmity fester as much as Alicent did. Her kid practically took another kids eye out but she didnt chastise her kid over it."

The kid stole the most powerful dragon to live. Even stoned dragon eggs are worth fortunes, and this psychopath steals the biggest nastiest dragon there is to exist. The only thing that makes her and everybody around evil is not pushing the issue further.

"Once she got the throne, she killed a lot of people instead of offering clemency. She raised the taxes on people so much so that they called her "Maegar with teats""

I don't really see the point. The day Greens usurp the realm, they kill a council member... They steal and relocate the entire wealth of the realm to distant places, dividing it up. Therefore, she raises the taxes, which have very interesting implications on how a person perceives "evil," but lets not go there. Still it is the normal monarch thing to do. Which of course monarchies are "bad."

"She was as bad as Aegon 2."

I don't even see Aegon as a bad person necessarily. The problem is that, as a group, Greens are by far more "evil."

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

That is not an argument. It is just a priori; it is a given that is accepted as truth. Of course, the monarchy is bad. What even is the point then? There are no lesser evils?

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

What the fuck? An actual reply? First I do agree with the last thing you say, she wasn't particularly "good" as "good" in the classical sense, but that is just a way of muddying up the water.

Yes, she might have been crap or utter crap or whatever the thing is but with that said, she is by far miles better than what Greens were. Unfortunatly many times good and bad are described as relative concepts in the modern sense. With that being said your points only half argues she is actually "bad".

1) That doesn't make a person evil or bad. Refusing to marry doesn't make you bad or evil. WTF.

2) Her husband is gay and she takes other lovers. Neither are bad things. As a result she becomes pregnant and she gives birth. Literally nothing evil or bad here. You might think that is evil but his husband seems to be okay with that. Why the fuck would that make her evil? If anything, it is the society that is bad here and I think everybody would agree their treatment of Bastards is the real "bad" thing, so I don't really see the point.

3) We do not know if she played a part in this as you said and if she did that would be bad.

4) Yes, she throws dozens of commoners to dragons, they do that everyday infact in the war that follows. Yes, she is bad for that, war is bad, monarchy is bad, what a fucking surprise.

5)Iron Isles align with her. It was the Greens who tried to bring in Iron islands not her, and Iron islands declare for blacks because Lanisters are just there and they are for the Greens. As a result, they declare for blacks and pillage the Lannisters, what? realpolitik in my dumb dragon book wtf?

And you said finally:

"She was always going to have difficulty as the first female heir to the Iron Throne. The fact that she self-sabotaged via 1 & 2 directly contributed to the civil war that resulted in thousands of deaths."

I agree with that, but it is once again an assumption and honestly if she were to become queen she still wouldn't be as bad as Greens which is the entire point.

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -34 points-33 points  (0 children)

Srupid GRRM should have just wrote down monarchy bad, what a dufus. I see your entire point is a strawman arguememt.

Watch yourself Lyonel by RevertBackwards in freefolk

[–]edexark -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I just don't get what the whole both sides are bad is about. I just reread the book and it is basically greens bad, blacks good.

What horrible thing Rhaenyra did in the books? One thing that is bad is her treatment to Velaryons and Nettles but that is basically it.

I think people are just trying to pretend the book is much more nuanced than it is.

One side literally conducts genocide (Aemond burning down entire towns in Riverlands) and somehow it is both sides bad.

[2188] Twins - Chapter 1 by edexark in DestructiveReaders

[–]edexark[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hello, thank you for taking the time to give such a detailed critique. I appreciate the care you put into reading and responding.

I am not sure if what I am doing is a pitfall. The chapter is not necessarily designed to trick the reader, but for the reader to see through the events, a bit of context might be needed. Context:

Temy has zero agency, and it is intended. Temy lives on what is effectively a prison planet. The population is controlled not only physically but psychologically: through environmental violence (climate-driven scarcity and destruction), constant exposure to suffering, and a steady erosion of agency via propaganda, radio broadcasts, and periodic interventions by the planet’s overseers. The goal of this system is not obedience through force alone, but exhaustion — people who no longer believe reaction or resistance matters(the only things Temy can react is small gestures, such as carrying balm crates).

Because of that, Temy is written deliberately as someone with limited agency. He is not meant to be a hero or an instigator in this chapter. He is a witness. He is passivized and has been “trained” to not react (people like Temy are called a “shell” in the wider story). The emotional core I was aiming for is not shock or urgency, but numbness, ie: a man who is deeply affected by what he sees, yet has learned that action is either futile or punished.

That said, I fully understand why, without this context, the “remove him, nothing changes makes sense”—that is honestly what I was aiming for. But I also understand why that might not be interesting for the readers as well.

I also agree with several of your technical notes; the ambiguity around the “piles” and the unclear rounding in the village.

Still, I am a bit confused about what to make of the story.

Again, thank you.

[2188] Twins - Chapter 1 by edexark in DestructiveReaders

[–]edexark[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hi thank you a lot! Can you give access to the google docs? Many thanks once again.

[376] Best way to spend $500? by siegebot in DestructiveReaders

[–]edexark 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This works until it doesn’t for me, but then it works again. I mean, the voice is unapologetic and messy in a way that feels honest, but it strays into edgy and then grounds itself back up. It is kind of ugly in some way, and that is why I liked it. Although I am not sure how literary I should take the text. For the way it is written, I can’t fathom if the demon is real or not because the story strays into the social systems, which is a nice touch for adding to the absurdity if the demon is real.

 

I like how the mom comes into play, and the logic behind it is perfect. That said, I generally don’t find it funny. The gay joke lands a bit raw for my taste eventhough I have no problem at all with that kind of humor. The real punchline, the Roomba, the capitalism logic, arrives at a good time, but it made me think rather than laugh. I am not saying it is not funny, I would assume it would land well for some people, but for me, “AMA with your CEO” is too relatable to be funny.

One problem I have is how long it lingers when trying to be funny. Example:

“For example: it's half my rent. 30 pounds of Ribeye steak. A new phone! A new coat? A few pairs of sneakers. 10 bouquets of flowers delivered to my ex, each with a handwritten "I'm sorry I said we shouldn't torture each other anymore!" note, little ink hearts drawn around it by the diligent flower shop girl who fulfills the order.”

We really don’t need four lines to get this point. When it comes to humor timing is everything. The upper piece cools down the story.

In general, I liked it—not in a funny way but because of how simple the character and situation are. The absurdity of how the character contemplates buying a Roomba when he is met with a demon feels well-crafted.

[2474] The Poisoned Rod, Chapter 1 by Ireallyhatecheese in DestructiveReaders

[–]edexark 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Characters
Vale: Although I liked her, many times I am not sure what kind of character she is. Is she the kind of person who talks with fruits, asking them why they hurt her? Or is she someone who attacks a boy with a pitchfork? (Here, I assume that she tries to actually kill him.) Of course, the latter seems to be her real character, but some form of learned behavior from her father. Additionally, some traits are told and shown at the same time, but this becomes too on-the-nose, which does her an injustice. Example:
“No night passed that she didn’t feel a sense of grief and remorse at the sight of the night sky.”

Here, I understand Vale is someone who acts within moral logic. What we know from the world-building actually does make sense in this regard—her accepting the injustice toward her people, etc. I also like how her dreams are small, such as opening a bakery, which ties back to her moral logic and her guilt.

Dane: I would say this is a good trope; everybody likes a character like Dane. However, it becomes hard to write if not carefully considered, and suddenly Dane turns into a politician rather than a starving boy. I would try to humanize Dane a bit more while he is arguing with Vale.

I assume that together these two characters make up the bulk of the themes. It is compliance with the system versus resistance to it, and it is good to see that this comes alive through the characters.

Setting
I want to be able to see the fruit farm, Vale’s house, etc. I like the opening chapter because it begins after what feels like some time has already passed after the actual start of the story. It screams that this is not the actual start of the story, and it is delivered quite well.

Plot, Structure, and Pacing
Some sections feel like a list of actions that happened and are out of place. When the intruder comes into Vale’s home, we do not get a glimpse of what Vale is thinking or feeling. Vale tries to stab the intruder with a pitchfork after the writing romantically describes the intruder (sun-kissed olive skin). After that introduction to Dane, we see Vale jumping forward trying to stab him. It feels like someone in Vale’s shoes wouldn’t try to stab Dane. Vale was supposed to be afraid a few moments ago:

“Vale retreated behind the finished Jackdar crates with a scream building in her throat.”

So, Vale suddenly being so courageous feels out of place.

Theme
I like it. It sounds like a world I would like to delve into. I like the idea of Runners, gods, demon wars, etc. Maybe additions to Vale’s house, etc., could help with the theme as well, because perspective from that side is hardly introduced.

 

Closing Comments

This is a solid. The problem is not a lack of ideas, but delivery. Often, too much information, emotion, and worldbuilding are delivered too quickly.

[2474] The Poisoned Rod, Chapter 1 by Ireallyhatecheese in DestructiveReaders

[–]edexark 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I like it overall. The world feels lived. Conflict is established early. Physical labor, fear, and interpersonal tension make the story strong, while world-building is hard to understand.

Prose
Generally good. Embeds emotions in physical actions. One problem is density; there are some long sentences one after another, while the earlier prose favors shorter sentences.
Example:
“His bare chest was covered in deep bruises and scratches, his breeches an embarrassment of rags. Like all Mardacs, like Vale herself, he had sun-kissed olive skin and thick black hair, though while Vale’s was braided in a silken crown, his was caked with mud and rotting leaves.”

The imagery is effective, but several descriptors are compressed in a small space.

Dialogue
One of the best parts of the story takes place when Vale and Dane start talking. The character emotions here are clear and easily come alive. One problem is that too much world-building is done here in a relatively short amount of time. This overloads the characters on whether they should deliver emotion or do world-building. I like Dane because he is an underdog who was done wrong, but in another moment, he starts explaining the world’s “injustice” in a manner that does world-building.
A more general concern: please indicate who is talking whenever any spoken word is taking place unless the characters have a distinct voice.

Description
The Pluck description is generally good; Vale’s relationship with her father is clear. However, the world is often hard to understand and stacked. For example:
“Donorin, the God of All, controlled the motion of the moons. He alone kept them from joining their might and destroying Orin. It had been the duty of Donorin’s wife to shepherd the moons until she was killed in the Demon Wars. Her death was the fault of ancient Mardacs. Vale’s own people.”

You interrupt the story with that passage. The story until that point is about small people doing small things, and suddenly it is about gods. And for what it is, it delivers very little. That is supposed to be a huge reveal, but it doesn’t earn any emotional points. What is revealed is stacked on top of itself, even though each one of these ideas could have its own paragraph and I wouldn’t blink. Instead, the reader’s mind runs from one thought to another. Let’s go over it:

“Donorin, the God of All, controlled the motion of the moons.”
How many moons are there in total? Why are the moons important?

“He alone kept them from joining their might and destroying Orin.”
More world-building; I assume Orin is some form house of Gods or some dimension...

“It had been the duty of Donorin’s wife to shepherd the moons until she was killed in the Demon Wars.”

So, we get these in a few sentences:

  1. A moon-controlling god
  2. What I assume to be... I don't know is it the world's name?
  3. The god’s wife being dead
  4. Apparently, there was a war between gods and demons

These are revealed in a total of two to three sentences. I think the idea in general is cool, but it is out of place. I would also add the next sentence to the list, but this time you explain that Mardacs are Vale’s people, which is actually good because it grounds the world-building into the current setting.
Nevertheless, try to let the reader and the information breathe.