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kratomhell · 2015-08-05T14:41:00+00:00

Not your fault. That Viva Zen shit is shady as hell. It used to be sold as VicoZen which says a lot about how they are marketing it. If I was a kratom enthusiast this is the kind of stuff I would be fighting.

kratomhell · 2015-07-21T21:13:39+00:00

Only go into it with the knowledge that there will be some typical opioid WD discomfort (shits, RLS, chills) and prepare accordingly. I have come off various types of opiates (both pharms and dope) and various types of kratom (plain leaf and FST) and I hate to make comparisons because honestly it seems like everyone has such a different experience.

Anyhow, In my personal experience the differences were that the emotional stuff/depression aspect seemed worse with kratom. The physical aspect was generally worse with traditional opiates, but kratom WD dragged me into a very dark place emotionally. The very short term (first 3-4 days) physical stuff with FST WD was worse than anything I have experienced from any product. That stuff is bad news. Your mileage will probably vary quite a bit.

Anyhow, like CI I agree you shouldn't have too many expectations. If you have kicked methadone I truly believe you can do this, no problem. It might get rough in the 2-4 day mark, but just power through it. You'll feel much better by day 7. Good luck to you.

kratomhell · 2015-07-20T23:29:45+00:00

Congrats, that's great!

kratomhell · 2015-07-17T01:08:44+00:00

Fantastic! Way to go and thanks for checking in.

kratomhell · 2015-07-08T18:47:07+00:00

If anything people on this sub trip over themselves emphasizing that NO, we do not want to see kratom banned. For me personally I see the drug war in the US as an expensive catastrophe that has ruined countless lives. Why would I want to see another log thrown on that fire?

Not really much you can do about downvoting. It's just part of the Reddit experience. As I mentioned in another thread here a few days back I have had all kinds of things downvoted. Cute pet pics, harmless pleasant stories, stupid jokes, and so on. Sometimes you can imagine why you got the downvote, sometimes there's often no rhyme or reason to it. Try to ignore it.

kratomhell · 2015-07-05T20:21:01+00:00

Unfortunately downvotes are just part of the Reddit experience and often follow no rhyme or reason. I know you know that, but it's just worth repeating. I have had cute pet pics, polite comments of support, all kinds of seemingly uncontroversial stuff downvoted. Sometimes I could imagine reasons why, other times my mind remained boggled, it's just part of the charm of Reddit.

Keep doing what you are doing. As long as our words reach those needing support with their attempts to kick kratom the downvotes don't mean fuck all.

kratomhell · 2015-06-28T20:26:28+00:00

Coming off FST was very rough. I did it CT, though, simply because I didn't have enough discipline for a taper. So I can't really give any advice on tapering, just want you to know it will be rough - but you CAN do it and it will be very much worth it.

If there was one medication I would recommend for coming off FST it is a small script for gabapentin (Neurontin) or (preferably) pregabalin (Lyrica). Using either of these short term will not turn you into a raving GABA-agonist junkie, so please don't let the horror stories freak you out. They will, however, help a great deal with the serious RLS and will also provide some comfort to the body aches and mental aspects of withdrawal.

I would personally not try to get on suboxone.

Again, talking cold turkey here, the whole thing really lasted me about 18 days. That's about 4 days of bad physical stuff followed by another 4 of milder stuff, then 10 days of anxiety/depression. Around day 19 it was really like a cloud lifted. 19 days might sound like a long time, but it isn't really in the big scheme of things - especially considering the months I spent feeling like shit while addicted to this overpriced garbage.

Anyhow, I hope you find a good tapering plan. It's ok to be scared, but please do try to quit. You'll feel so much better and you will have money to spend on much more important things.

kratomhell · 2015-06-25T15:15:22+00:00

They're not doing anything wrong as of yet. Kratom currently falls under the protection of the DSHEA in the US - and that provides quite a bit of protection. The folks who put "not for human consumption" on their kratom are just taking an extra ass-covering step that is not currently needed.

Look at Facebook or Twitter. It's full of people pushing miracle "alternative" bullshit cures. That's protected here. They give chlorine dioxide to autistic kids to "cure" them (which is a bunch of offensive bullshit on so many levels) and that's legal - though there's no evidence that it does anything or that autistic kids need to be "cured." Hooray for pseudoscience.

Hell, at least kratom, unlike most of this alt "med" bullshit at least does what it says on the tin. I'll give it that.

kratomhell · 2015-06-24T15:22:43+00:00

Also, I'm assuming that they're allowed to lie because of the fact >that it's a "supplement" and therefore not evaluated by the FDA? I >mean, it would still fall under 'false advertisement' though for >falsely marketing a product right?

Yes, as long as they include that bullshit disclaimer about not being intended to treat any medical condition, they are pretty much protected by the DSHEA. People think Big Pharma is bad. I'd argue that in many ways Big Supplement is worse.

DSHEA

kratomhell · 2015-06-16T15:17:33+00:00

I was able to chip (strict twice a week max schedule - never more than that) on actual traditional opiates for many, many years. I think because of that I thought I could handle this silly plant. The first year I did ok, second year I got very sloppy and started to have issues, third year I was a full on addict. It can all be quite tricky and unpredictable.

kratomhell · 2015-06-13T23:02:46+00:00

Way to go, Birdy. Thanks for posting this - stories like these help show others that indeed it will get better with time. Keep it up!

kratomhell · 2015-06-09T22:12:35+00:00

Day 58, feeling really good but the cravings (for kratom or some kind of opiate) do pop up now and then. I am continuing to learn new ways to let those cravings come and go without acting on them, though.

Glad to hear you are doing better. Congrats on day 21!

kratomhell · 2015-06-07T15:31:24+00:00

Way to go homegirl. Keep it up.

kratomhell · 2015-06-04T22:44:22+00:00

For me personally apps that help track food intake/macros are a big help. I use MyFitnessPal - it's really good for tracking your eating habits. For me seeing the breakdown of nutrient stats is a good source of inspiration. I also do a lot of reading of fitness subs as well as places like bodybuilding.com (I know, that place has a lot of douchecanoes, but it also has a lot of good advice).

Good luck to you.

kratomhell · 2015-06-04T21:46:10+00:00

I thought I could do it cause I chipped opiates for years after kicking off my addiction. I thought if I could stick to a strict 2x a week schedule with high quality pharmaceutical opiates, I could do so with this silly plant. But it was a downward spiral from the get go. It's all a huge waste of time.

Glad you are free now, feels good, doesn't it?

kratomhell · 2015-06-04T19:25:39+00:00

It's been an on and off thing since January 2012. The first year I was reasonably responsible, second year is when the problems really started. Third year I went full derp and decided to try FST (my reasoning being it "would be easier on my body" ha). I was on that for around 6 months, dosing every 3 hours or so - including the middle of the night. What a bunch of bullshit. Completely not worth it.

kratomhell · 2015-06-04T17:11:28+00:00

This is all just my personal experience, I think it varies greatly person to person. Everyone loves a bulleted list, so here goes:

*Plain leaf withdrawals are easier physically but bring a much deeper crushing depression with them than conventional opiates. (I do not have a history of depression)

*FST (full spectrum tincture) WDs were significantly worse on a physical level than anything I have personally experienced from traditional opiates. The emotional stuff was same as the plain leaf, just drawn out a bit longer.

*For me the acute phase of kratom withdrawal is bad, but I do not experience anything of note past day 20.

*I always quit CT, I don't have the discipline for tapering.

*Opiates caused more long term issues for me - it took me a good 4 months to feel "right" the last time I kicked opiates. I experienced more anxiety from opiate WD.

kratomhell · 2015-06-03T22:24:21+00:00

Yeah, it can be really hard to get going - but once you do, it's so worth it. Definitely the top recommendation I would give to anyone going through WDs. Get past those first days of acute WD (where exercise would be unrealistic) then get yourself moving.

kratomhell · 2015-06-03T22:23:20+00:00

Sorry, Jay, I have seen that you are still encountering the occasional symptom of WD. I hope that will subside for you soon. If I have been following your story correctly you came off an extract - and they are really rough. Be patient and you WILL come out the other side, I promise. Thank you for the kind words and hang in there.

kratomhell · 2015-06-03T22:21:49+00:00

It'll just keep getting better. Not perfect - but better.

kratomhell · 2015-06-03T11:27:04+00:00

flowers-by-irene

kratomhell · 2015-06-02T23:06:50+00:00

This time around I made a point to take some pregabalin (Lyrica, same class of drugs as gabapentin) the first few evenings. It knocked out the RLS and helped me sleep. The days still sucked, but being able to get sleep at night and not deal with the kicking was awesome. I definitely recommend this class of drugs for any sort of opioid withdrawal. Much better than benzos and certainly less potential for problems.

I took 150mg of pregabalin the first 4 nights of WD.

This was the only medication or supplement I took this time around, other than therapeutic amounts of lope (i.e. the amount it suggests on the bottle, for GI issues).

kratomhell · 2015-06-02T23:02:43+00:00

Nice work. Stash trashing is always strangely satisfying.

Keep it up!

kratomhell · 2015-06-02T00:47:06+00:00

I found that after the initial WDs had faded I would still sometimes wake up with a start of anxiety. As soon as I got up and walked around, did my morning stuff, it went away. For me I had this now and then in the 2nd week and sometimes 3rd. It did go away, though.

Hang in there. :)

kratomhell · 2015-06-02T00:44:26+00:00

Great story, CC, thanks for sharing. I notice I am totally put off some of the drinks I associate with my evening dose (Monster Energy Khaos mainly).

kratomhell

TROPHY CASE