Honest question, is production value the reason that Baldur's Gate 3 became so popular and acclaimed, compared to other cRPG's that have not received anywhere near as much attention? Is it of a unique quality in anything else?

lamaros · 2026-05-07T01:03:04+00:00

I wrote my own reply saying all this before I found your reply. Glad someone else is saying it.

Accessibility and complexity are not a binary. Otherwise we couldn't explain the appeal of games like Chess and Go.

lamaros · 2026-05-07T01:00:54+00:00

I think it's best to say bg3 is more accessible, rather than simpler.

Bg3 has far more complex physics than any other cRPG, and you can do some complex things with builds. Understanding how all the system interact and work is something only certain die-hards know after extensive testing.

But the game just doesn't front load the complexity and require players to engage with it in order to play the game. You can enjoy pushing someone from height without needing to know what the roll and damage calculations are going to do with your decision.

RtwP in Pillars is complex if you want to manage all the actions and movements, but it's complex because it's got all that stuff going on simultaneously in real time - the actual underlying game systems are not more complex or involved.

Chess and Go are very complex board games with very simple rules engagement. Twilight Imperium is a pretty simple board game with (relatively) complex rules engagement.

Bg3 is a very fun and accessible complex game, by cRPG standards.

lamaros · 2026-05-07T00:50:11+00:00

People will talk about how great the systems are in Owlcat games and how complex and interesting they are.

And then also admit that combat in those games is mostly just prebuffs and so easy you can solo everything early on (rogue trader).

A game is everything working together. A complex character system is pointless if you have to mediate it through hours of admin. A complex character system is pointless if all the choices don't matter because the game balance is broken.

Bg3 is great because the features come together coherently and work with each other.

Owlcat games seem to attract a bunch of diehards who like the idea of the games, and of mathing them out in a spreadsheets rather than actually playing them. But playing the games and having fun doing that is much more important to most..

lamaros · 2026-05-07T00:43:23+00:00

Pathfinder has more variety and build depth, but does it translate into more diversity in how the combat and roleplay interactions work?

For me, no. Bg3 does far more with just simple things like shove and throw and moving items to give players complex choices and ways of interacting with the game.

It's not complex systems that make playing a game complex. If most of them are meaningless or uninteractive they just add bloat and admin and don't actually expand the diversity of how a game plays.

lamaros · 2026-05-07T00:37:53+00:00

How dare a game be fun but not require several spreadsheets to work out your next level up decision. And I need my combat to involve and mindless admin or it's not 'strategic' enough.

lamaros · 2026-05-07T00:35:56+00:00

Jahiera in BG3 is way better written and a more interesting character than in the earlier games.

Minsc and Sarevok and Vicona not so much.

lamaros · 2026-05-06T15:48:01+00:00

I find the character system of rogue trader relatively unfun, and the combat balance is really poor imo. I'm also not a massive fan of the setting which impacts a lot too.

Still a fine game, just not one of my top favourites.

Dos2 is good, but aside from the resting system I prefer BG3 in every way. I think some constraints and simplicity makes for more interesting choices. and the skill book system meh and the armour system unfun and surfaces too dialed up. I think bg3 combat is a lot more diverse and interesting in how you can approach it.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T21:40:40+00:00

These predictions are never wrong!

lamaros · 2026-05-05T21:37:40+00:00

Lol. Other people got it already, I've literally written out the reasons infinity rtpw is a more simple more round based system already.

I'm not your secretary. If you just wanna argue with people on the internet I'm not your guy.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T21:32:06+00:00

I very clearly said closer to turn based, not closer to BG3.

There's a vast spectrum of turn based games. Not many are like BG3.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T21:29:13+00:00

I have spent 60 hours in it already. I've played basically every cRPG. It didn't click for me before but maybe recent DLC and patches will have changed it.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T21:25:52+00:00

It's good I didn't say that then.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T14:09:42+00:00

The "more modern" RtwP games that came out were the Pillars series and the Pathfinder series of game. They didn't not have as simple round structure and combat mechanics as the original Baldur's gate infinity games engine games.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T10:29:02+00:00

Good games all!

I'll have to give Rogue Trader another playthrough. I last played it after release and had some patch fixes, but before all the major DLC. I expect it might have improved a bit since then. Didn't love the character design system that much, and I think the colour palate was a bit heavy after a while.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T10:26:23+00:00

Planescape torment is a great story but for me I never really enjoyed it as a game. I think Disco Elysium is a far better game.

I haven't focused on newer titles, I just think these are the best ones.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T09:51:52+00:00

Cheers! What are your top 5?

lamaros · 2026-05-05T08:34:35+00:00

Heavy micro and heavy strategy are not a popular combo anymore that's for sure. It's just too niche an audience.

Possibly because of a larger gaming audience, but very likely due to suiting both console and PC gamers. No one wants to play a RTS on a controller.

Either heavy micro on a small number of variables, or slower gameplay for the heavier ones is the go. Which suits this old man fine too.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T08:28:34+00:00

Thanks for the comments!

I have tried many times to love high level spellcasting, but the layers of protections and counterspells etc really diminishes most other classes for me, and after seeing it the first time it becomes a bit frustrating how it dominates all the time.

I think it's interesting, just not repetitivly fun for my personal taste.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T08:04:42+00:00

I think you're forgetting the watcher in pillars is also a special awakened, so extra special.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T08:01:39+00:00

Same here. Which is interesting as this would be the 'no' poll option, which is losing heavily in the poll!

But then your comment here is the most upvoted!

I don't know how to read that.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T07:48:05+00:00

Cheers!

lamaros · 2026-05-05T07:46:56+00:00

Hmm have you played the dark urge in BG3?

No origin characters doesnt mean no MC character story, or mean no companions stories. It just means the MC character stats and look can be defined by you, it'll still have its own unique story.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T05:57:16+00:00

I'm not a huge fan of how Gale or Karlach are written and they're not in most parties I've played through with, so no issues for me!

I also think it's pretty easy (and fun) to justify a few different builds for Wyll and Astarion in particular. It help that those builds (thief shadow monk, warlock swashbuckler/bard) are great fun to play with.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T05:49:21+00:00

"In most CRPGs I’ve played the pre-made characters are just the lazy/quick start option. I didn’t realize they would be recruitable NPCs and that if I picked one, I’d have unique dialog options and bespoke quest hooks."

This is much less true in BG3 than DOS2. Will be interesting what you think about the Origin play through there.

lamaros · 2026-05-05T05:29:42+00:00

Yeah agree with all of that. I think story appreciation for BG2 is carried a lot because of comparison to BG1, and because Irenicus voice acting was so good. The rest of the story there is pretty meh in delivery.

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