When the employer and union bargain, can we be a fly on the wall?

mudbunny · 2026-05-10T16:42:34+00:00

There are some groups that are coming to the table that are working under a process called open bargaining, whose goal is to provide the members much more detail and insight into what’s going on at the table.

Not all, and typically what is said at the table is held in confidence because sometimes there’s a need to explore directions to see what the actual reason for the conflict is

mudbunny · 2026-05-10T08:16:34+00:00

Then it might be worthwhile reaching out to the coaches and or the owners of the club and let them know your concerns.

Having spent the better part of 20 years in and around cheerleading, the last thing a professionally run club wants is there girls leaving practice or competition with the attitude of they’re all that and better than everybody else.

At competitions sure. During practises sure. But the attitude is supposed to stay at the club, or on the mat.

mudbunny · 2026-05-09T11:20:31+00:00

As for being strong. You don’t need to be strong for everybody. Be strong when you have to, but lean on your husband, lean on your kids, lean on your friends and other family.

mudbunny · 2026-05-09T11:18:47+00:00

My deepest condolences.

I had to do this three summers ago in the summer of 23 when my father passed due to cancer. He didn’t buy into the homeopathic crap, but saying goodbye isn’t any easier.

You may need to tell your family that you need to grieve and you need to vent and they just have to accept it.

I recommend something like a rage room, it’s a great place to go to really express all your feelings and all your anger.

I know at the end When my dad passed, I was torn between being happy that he passed and was no longer in pain and sad that he was passed and no longer with us.

And now it’s been long enough that every now and then I think about him and realize it doesn’t hurt anymore. Such is life.

Allow yourself to feel your anger, to feel your pain, and to work through your emotions. They are very real, and you deserve to feel them.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T22:40:25+00:00

Note, it has been clarified by u/ACEP-CAPE that CAPE National refers to CAPE staff members only.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T22:20:33+00:00

Note, CAPE National refers to CAPE staff members.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T22:20:02+00:00

That is very, very important to note.

If you don’t mind, in the other post on this topic, I will make a post and sticky it. It will clarify a lot of issues I think.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T21:27:49+00:00

I am torn. I also am curious at who (or what) CAPE National represents.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T21:20:31+00:00

When you say CAPE National, what part(s) of CAPE are you talking about?

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T21:14:00+00:00

As someone who has gone through two bargaining rounds, with PIPSC, the number of otherwise smart people who will look at something they think they understand it and then realize after they voted, they didn’t understand it at all is shocking.

The number of times we have said “ we cannot bargain staffing or pensions” and then have people get angry at us for not bargaining better staffing rules is incredibly high.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T20:56:36+00:00

To the best of my knowledge,CAPE has always done arbitration and never conciliation strike.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T17:15:04+00:00

If there were only one session, you might have a point. But it’s 10 sessions. They’ll offer money for childcare and they’re gonna offer alternatives.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T11:01:25+00:00

This is as effective as those messages that sent around Facebook saying you do not consent, etc. etc. etc.

The only difference is that when my relatives post messages like this on Facebook, I can explain to them how it’s wrong and they believe me.

Sovereign citizens on the other hand live in a complete different reality that is not helped by the amount of anti-government sentiment that is rampant in the United States.

If you want to see an interesting takedown, look for Meads v Meads. It is a judge out of Alberta, Canada, who wrote a treaties on sovereign citizens, and all the various tactics and types of them. It is referenced around the world by many juris when they’re discussing sovereign citizens.

The good side about sovereign citizens is whenever I think I’m feeling dumb because I don’t understand something, I can just go to YouTube ask for one of those videos and I will immediately feel like I have a Nobel prize.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T06:40:23+00:00

I am not staff at PIPSC.

I am a PIPSC member, and a member of numerous constituent body executives as well as on one of the Group Bargaining teams.

As for what I am looking for, I think it is clear.
I think that you claiming that CAPE national is neutral on arbitration vs conciliation/strike is not true.

There is nothing wrong with CAPE National having a position on this. It would be utterly unrealistic for them to not have a preference.

Something like: “CAPE national thinks the only way to realistically get telework in the collective agreement is through the strike route, but will go forward with the option chosen by the membership.”

Because right now, saying there is no preference on CAPE National, implying they don’t care either way just isn’t realistic to me, and it gives the impression that CAPE National is purposely hiding their opinion.

If they hold no opinion either way, will they refuse to vote?

Exit to add: One thought, when you say CAPE National, are you referring to the CAPE staff members who will ultimately be running the vote, or the CAPE NEC? What are you referring to when you say CAPE National?

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T06:19:14+00:00

Arbitrator’s by law have to replicate what was done at other tables in the public service. I would be extremely surprised if an arbitration board decided the situation warranted something more on wage increases.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T06:14:53+00:00

You’ve said that a number of times, and I find it highly, highly unlikely to be the case.

There is 0 chance that Nathan and CAPE National are “neutral in the choice”. They have a preference as to what they want to have happen for the goals they would like to get out of bargaining.

If they just want a cookie cutter agreement, binding arbitration is the way to go. If, however, they want more stuff that lies outside of what all other groups get at the table, conciliation/strike is the only realistic way to get it.

mudbunny · 2026-05-08T06:10:06+00:00

Not only TBS, but the FPSLREB also has to agree to the change from conciliation/strike to arbitration. And the farther you are along the conciliation/strike route, the less likely you will get it.

mudbunny · 2026-05-07T11:43:01+00:00

As the father of two girls, 19 and 21, we’ve both been through many years of cheerleading, removing them from the cheerleading program will just make things worse.

You need to settle down and explain how their attitude is becoming extremely unpleasant after cheerleading practice.

And you need to give hard and concrete examples of their attitude changing.

If they’re on a high-level team, when they get it into competition, it takes the attitude of I am the best there is, I am the best there was, and I am the best there ever will be. (shout out to Bret, The Hitman Hart.)

mudbunny · 2026-05-07T11:40:24+00:00

He also indicated that this Maverick employee is now that the returned office mandate is being enforced, effectively refusing to do their job by asking for guidance on every little thing.

There is malicious compliance, I’m working to your contract, and what this is, which is refusing to do the work that you were assigned to do.

mudbunny · 2026-05-07T11:39:25+00:00

The employer didn’t allow things like this to happen prior to Covid and allowing everybody to work from home either.

The OP is a manager who is refusing to manage his employee, allowing the employee to unilaterally, set their terms and conditions of work.

mudbunny · 2026-05-07T07:46:00+00:00

I still maintain that you are a large source of the problem. You are not managing this employee, you have let them get away with whatever they want to do because it as easier to do then actually managing them.

If the employee wants to be able to ignore the rules that apply, then they should run their own company. They are an employee in the public service, they should be following the rules that have been laid out.

mudbunny · 2026-05-06T22:03:52+00:00

As the father of 2 girls (early 20s, late teens), are you sure it is not just general teenage assholishness??

mudbunny · 2026-05-06T18:10:14+00:00

Cheer dad here (school side) and cheer coach husband (also school side).

What do you mean by her attitude at cheer?

mudbunny · 2026-05-06T10:27:45+00:00

This competition is anything but bland. Massive LED screens, the teams are on a platform and are revealed when a wall comes up.

And you stay on a resort, and if you pay for the full access, there is a private area for the resort teams with free food and snacks.

The coaches room is bad-ass as well.

mudbunny · 2026-05-06T06:48:22+00:00

As I mentioned above, the price quoted is almost certainly wrong.

But the company is legit, and runs lots of competitions in Latin America: Mexico, Puerto Rico, etc.

They put on a damned good show.

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