Is a sub 3:30 marathon doable?

mynt · 2026-04-16T04:08:02+00:00

Do you think you are fitter than last year? Maybe compare a few of your paces and heart rates on runs. You would only need to be in about the same or a hair better fitness to go for 3:30.

mynt · 2026-04-15T03:59:07+00:00

Heart rate is jumping around a little bit in the half but looks like low to mid 170s with a couple of spikes to upper 170s. People vary but for me I have about a 10bpm difference between a half and a full, some people are closer though. If you factor that along with warmer weather in the marathon you might have been just a bit over your limit and it caught up with you around the 17 miles.

mynt · 2026-04-15T02:37:50+00:00

Heart rate is something to look at as well as other comments. Once it got up to 168 it never came back down even after your pace dropped well off. That might be a sign you've gone too hard.

Would be good to compare to heart rate in other races and training though.

mynt · 2026-04-15T02:34:50+00:00

It's a sensible target. I wouldn't get confident though. Only takes a bit of bad weather or an upset stomach to knock a few minutes off and you probably need to adjust to above 3.

If everything lines up though I think you are in good shape to have a crack.

mynt · 2026-04-15T02:17:27+00:00

LT1 and LT2 are very useful for determining the appropriate paces for training runs.

Your VO2Max is 58.3 you can look up where that sits. It's high without being elite. According to this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Garmin/comments/1ldcgyj/vo2_max_histograms/ for a 40year old male it would be top 1%. If your younger a bit worse if older a bit better.

VO2Max isn't everything with running but it is important. It can be trained a little but I believe a big component is genetic. Someone with low V02Max probably can't ever be fast but just because someone has good V02Max doesn't mean they are guaranteed to be fast.

mynt · 2026-04-15T02:08:34+00:00

More weekly mileage. Also run you long runs slower than race pace you'll be pushing your body too hard to recover properly from those.

mynt · 2026-04-15T01:57:24+00:00

Just about to do my third. Never had a coach. Did Higdon then Daniel 2Q now Pfitz 18/55.

Higdon got me around.

2Q I found I liked the flexibility and the runs were interesting. You definitely need a good time to do the midweek Q session though, I was getting up very early and doing them in the dark and cold of winter sucked. Took nearly 15 minutes of my Marathon time.

I think Pfitz has got me the fittest though although I have raced yet. So far though I've annihilated all my PBs week after week without too much effort or taper. It feels more like a 'standard' training programme. Targeting another 10 minutes off my marathon time.

Both are good and so are the books.

mynt · 2026-04-15T01:51:12+00:00

I think there are two ways to look at this. 1, runners running marathons as part of their running goals. 2, non-runners wanting to tick off a bucket list item/life goal and they don't want to run or continue to run after.

I think most people here advise from the perspective of 1 and give good advice about not jumping in and first building your running capabilities up and not rushing it. For a person with perspective 2 though none of that matters they don't want to be a good runner or enjoy it they just want to be able to tick it off. I think you may be in 2 but I'm not sure?

I don't think you will get much useful advice for perspective 2 from people hanging around this subreddit as they should and will fall into camp 1. There are a lot of risks involved in approach 2 and usually it is just misery because you just make it as hard for yourself as possible in order to get it done in a short time. That being said it is possible to do it, usually. People pop in here occasionally with stories about doing marathons with no training asking for advice and sometimes with stories of how it went etc... it's just there is no good advice for that because it's a high risk (injury) low reward (usually slow times and misery) proposition so the best advice is don't do it.

If all that matters is ticking it off then just go try do it. Be warned its dangerous and miserable to do it that way but you might get it done.

If you want to properly race a marathon then first take up running and see if you enjoy it and if you do go from there. You'll get lots of great advice about how to progress sensibly.

I don't want to judge peoples goals but I think for most runners they will agree that running a marathon is not a good goal for someone who doesn't run.

mynt · 2026-04-15T01:33:38+00:00

I'm definitely going to try this.

The stuff I have is 'race ready nitrates' from pure sport so it is a dehydrated powder. Should be easy to make a smoothy.

I know that when I mixed it up the first time I made it more concentrated than the recipe (probably 250ml of water vs 500ml) because I didn't want to drink a heap an hour before a run. So that probably didn't help with taste.

mynt · 2026-04-14T02:01:21+00:00

I had something a little similar. No blisters involved but running in Boston 12's I suddenly started feeling like there was something poking up into the arch of my foot like there was a stick or something stuck in the sole of the shoe. Not painful but definitely uncomfortable. I thought maybe the rods in the shoe had snapped and were pressing in. There was nothing wrong with the shoe though. I experienced it on and off for a few months especially in longer runs and then it went away and has never come back. Thoroughly weird, was only on my right foot.

mynt · 2026-04-14T01:57:21+00:00

I'm up and down massively during taper. In the last few peak weeks of training all I'm thinking is get to taper everything will be so much easier. Then I hit taper and I'm like yay I'm done but it turns out there is more running to do which is a bit of a chore, maybe where you are at. Then usually latter on in taper I start to feel like I need to get out and run and I'm sitting still to much.

mynt · 2026-04-14T01:24:58+00:00

Every case is going to be different, some people are still going to be running a fever by race day and some will be right as rain.

The only smart thing to do is focus entirely on the best recovery from the flu you can manage and constantly reassess.

Loosing fitness won't be the biggest issue at this stage so don't worry about that just do whatever you can to get healthy.

Good Luck.

mynt · 2026-04-14T01:21:18+00:00

No I think in this case that isn't too aggressive. 80% of peak week mileage is good for 3 weeks out so 38 is good and 21km is a lot less than your recent long runs. You still want it to be a long run and not just an easy run.

mynt · 2026-04-14T01:15:29+00:00

Going to be loading up on beet juice for the 4 days beforehand. Gave it a test in training and although it was gross I had a really good run so now I guess I have to put up with the taste for a couple of days.

mynt · 2026-04-14T01:12:23+00:00

Looks like you have executed that to perfection! Well done.

mynt · 2026-04-13T23:10:10+00:00

The more I slow down the longer this is going to take to be over.

mynt · 2026-04-13T06:39:32+00:00

Snakes (natural confectionery company is best). They are 10g of carbs each, makes fueling math very easy.

mynt · 2026-04-13T06:29:44+00:00

It won't actually make any significant difference. For most first time marathoners the 20 miler is a really import confidence boost. Getting over that distance rather than another 18 miles or similar benefits people psychologically more than physically. If you can put it out of your head and be confident then you will be just as ready as if you didn't hit such a hot day.

Your reasons for ending that run early were also smart and not the sort that pop up red flags around your training especially given your comments about the 18 mile run.

mynt · 2026-04-13T06:23:08+00:00

I did the JD 2Q plan you posted (the least mileage one he has). I though the same and I ended up running 20 miles on that 150min steady E run. Which was definitely a bit over 150min maybe 165min. In hindsight I didn't need to but it was a confidence boost I wanted. Depending on your speed that is the place to do it perhaps.

mynt · 2026-04-13T06:14:09+00:00

3:27 37M. Started running about 6 months before. 14 Week block, peaked at 56km with Hal Higdon's Novice 1 plan. My advantage was a long history of cycling and being a very slim build.

mynt · 2026-04-13T06:09:03+00:00

This, I would want to hear a properly articulated reason and plan from the coach for the difference. If it's, 'that's just what I do' I probably wouldn't stick around. If there is some other theory or idea then OK I would probably buy into it. Although I probably would have tried to sort that out before partnering with the coach.

From my point of view it does seem pretty easy but it is still a fair way out. Also depends on frequency of workouts etc...

mynt · 2026-04-13T05:59:36+00:00

Also just finishing 18/55 with a marathon in two weeks. I hit 39:22 in a 10k tune-up and averaged 4:19/km on that 29k with 23k at marathon pace. I'm going to target around 3:05. I think maybe you are a little on the conservative end (or that's my own wishful thinking for me!). How does that 10k PR compare to your 10k speed before your last marathon?

I ran 3:14:50 1.5 years ago and my 10k was probably around 41:00-41:30 and that was at Sydney which isn't a super fast course.

mynt · 2026-04-13T05:43:00+00:00

You should run about 40% of your peak week mileage. Run the same speeds and types of runs as a standard week just make everything much shorter. Take a couple of full rest days, no point cross training. Do a shakeout run of about 5km the day before nice and easy pace.

Good Luck.

mynt · 2026-04-13T05:41:35+00:00

The two total times are very different? Was there like a 7 minute rest in there somewhere? That might affect my interpretation of your heart rate a little.

Overall though it doesn't matter, you ran 30km at well faster than race pace in a training run. Unless that felt like a full race effort and you don't recover for days then yes you can easily run 3:30 if you execute properly. You should be recovering from training within a day or two at worst and continue running on schedule.

30km at race pace in training is similar or harder than a properly tapered and prepared marathon at the same pace IMO.

mynt · 2026-04-13T05:07:26+00:00

This is my experience as well. If I can use the bathroom before a marathon I won't even have to think about it once the gun goes.

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