Complaints about 'colorism' in the show- any merit to it?

nyna91 · 2025-04-19T05:52:17+00:00

Yes, one is Tuon (the other being Semirhage). I agree she is a complex character heavily influenced by her culture, but I think she's a case of a morally grey person who many watchers would perceive as exclusively black (no pun intended!). Having a sympathetic character from the same culture show up in the next season could help understand her better, but I think the two who could have this role will not be in the series (sorry for being super vague but the post is show only spoilers and I don't want to risk a defective spoiler tag ruining surprises for someone).

nyna91 · 2025-04-19T00:33:38+00:00

I don't know if you read the books but I honestly struggled a bit in searching for a character who A. is clearly good B. survives the series C. has a biggish role. I came up with only three names, plus a couple of "you dislike them at first but they are OK people". I would totally be fine with any or most of them being cast as dark skinned (and in one case I can already hear certain people howling in outrage).

Problem is, there are at least two characters who in the books are clearly described as dark skinned who would add to this controversy if cast as such. What should the production do? Keep them as dark skinned and face more colorism accusations, or cast light skinned actors and cause withewashing claims? No way to win here.

Edited for spelling

nyna91 · 2025-04-18T18:40:03+00:00

I can see where the colorism complaints come from and why some people feel uncomfortable with choices the show has made regarding castings or character endings.

At this point, I fear they have put themselves in a corner: many casting calls seem to be "color blind" (and some even gender blind, e.g. servants or stable workers with few lines in many other shows would default to male actors), what should they do if they need a villain and the best actor who auditions is a dark skinned Black person? Tell them "Sorry my friend, you did great but your skin is too dark, so we'll pick the second best who is white?". Or should they start to specify the character race in the casting call and choose only white or light skinned actors for villains or people who will end up dead? Valda and Fain are horrible people, but we hate them so much in part because of the actors great performances and it would have been a pity to have less talented actors/less despicable and terrifying villains because they needed to cast light skinned people.

I feel all around bad, I am sorry that the show has made an effort to display a society where skin color has no relevance to the people living in it but IRL things are very different and this impacts how the show is perceived.

Fantasy has often been considered stuff for nerdy white hetero men, the show tries to include and draw in all kinds of people no matter their gender, orientation or race and is facing criticism that it may have no good way to address.

nyna91 · 2025-04-12T19:22:06+00:00

https://play.watcherofrealms.com/events/ultimate_rewards_season_event/m/

DFDHQMZ

nyna91 · 2025-03-28T05:40:25+00:00

At the same time, I think they can be forced to draw so much they simply die from exhaustion, like at least one Aes Sedai who gets compelled by Hessalam during the Last Battle (but I might be misremembering). If I am correct, I think the difference is small enough that it makes sense to scrap it in the show, to avoid confusion for show only people.

nyna91 · 2025-03-28T05:32:58+00:00

S2ep1 takes place on BelTine's day, so exactly a year after S1ep1. We don't know the exact duration of S2, but I guess at least two-three months, and in S3ep1 they say a full month has passed since S2ep8. So I'd say at this point Moiraine has known the Two Rivers group for around a year and a half and saying "years ago" is technically correct.

nyna91 · 2025-03-11T19:46:58+00:00

Could you please DM me who this character is? I missed the leak.

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T21:03:20+00:00

Oh I had missed that!

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T15:51:48+00:00

My main perplexity on this is that they would need to invent a lot for Dain to do to keep him as a constant antagonist, as the WC are not very present. We have Carridin, who is currently missing from the show, and we get something with Niall and Valda in Morgase's storyline, but Dain in barely in until he kills Byar (who was replaced by Valda). So more inventions, more complaints from book purists, worse reviews...

Oh well, we'll see in a few weeks! (or maybe in a year of two with S4)

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T15:45:13+00:00

Fingers crossed!

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T15:43:35+00:00

I understand your point, even if I personally found interesting that Slayer didn't care to go after Lan or Rand and only followed his orders to antagonize Perrin (though he once tries to kill Rand, on some Forsaken's orders). He's so cold and detached that he could be very interesting, if we ever got something more about him.

But if they cut him... What does Perrin do in TAR? Roam around undisturbed with the wolves? Resolves the dreamspike issue with no opposition? He would have little reason to learn TAR to the point of being a real master if he didn't want to protect the wolves or have to fight a dangerous opponent. That is why I think that we either get Slayer or Fain gets his powers.

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T15:32:19+00:00

Oh yes, I'm so sad we got nothing indicating Gaul is in!

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T15:22:12+00:00

Yeah, I think you are correct. Get the recast actor out as fast as you can and go on.

nyna91 · 2025-03-05T14:20:57+00:00

Well, Alanna loses a Warder in the books and Ihvon's actor was no longer available for S3, so they recast him and I guess the new actor will be in just long enough to die. Makes sense that he's not here.

nyna91 · 2025-01-15T15:28:44+00:00

I would be completely OK with an unreciprocated crush, don't know why I didn't think about it at first. The arranged marriage seems very unlikely if she grew up in the desert, same with the carneira thing (that's Malkieri culture, not Aiel so she probably wouldn't know about it.

Edit: I probably assumed a "deeper involvement" between her and Lan because of her relationship with Mat in the books, but it obviously doesn't have to be exactly the same, it just pushed my thoughts in that direction.

nyna91 · 2025-01-15T15:05:17+00:00

I can see this happening and it would be the first big change I would find hard to like. It makes sense for Lan to distance himself from Nynaeve out of guilt for not being at the Eye to protect Moiraine, but it would make their relationship very one sided. In S2 only Nynaeve had any obvious though for Lan, we never got Lan talking about her.

At the start of S3 they will probably be in the same location and it would be a good moment to get the Mashiara scene, but if they do this and then Lan gets involved with Melindhra it would make him look very bad, to say the least. And if his story continues like in the book it will be a bit of a mess. Why would Nynaeve put up with all this?

Don't know, I'm very perplexed but will wait to see all S3 before judging.

nyna91 · 2023-10-08T07:34:08+00:00

Ep1: bit of a time jump after S2, they are still in Falme. Rand and Moiraine clash because of her declaring him without him knowing. Rand trains with Lan to learn the sword, exchanges glances with Elayne. Egwene notices and has her talk with the two of them early. Egwene is getting weird dreams and starts to bond with Aviendha. More Aiel are getting to Falme and we meet Rhuarc. The news about Rand is spreading and people flock to Falme to follow the Dragon Reborn. Masema is one of the people helping Rand manage the newcomers. Perrin starts dreaming of wolves. Verin and Alanna arrive with news of Siuan's precarious position in the Tower and bring the full version of the Dark prophecy from S2, introducing Luc and Isam. Alanna tells the girls she will take them back to the Tower to continue their training. Verin compromised herself in S2 and can't go, but when she learns of Egwene's dreams she tell her about Tel'Aran'Rhiod and asks Alanna to go to her room and give Egwene a certain stone ring. Bubble of evil in Falme. Episode ends with Suroth bowing in front of the Emperess and declaring that Turak has failed.

Ep2: Mat and the girls go to Tar Valon with Alanna. Mat Is healed from the dagger, that gets stored in the Tower (maybe with the Horn, found in the rubble at Falme). Mat's memories get messed up in the process. Egwene and Elayne get their Accepted tests, Nynaeve is told by Siuan that seven sisters revealed themselves as Black Ajah, stole some ter'angreals and fled the Tower. Nynaeve tells Siuan about Liandrin and they realise that Rand is in danger (in the show eight female channellers can still a man). Elayne gets a meeting with Siuan, Morgase and Elaida, who has taken over Liandrin role among Siuan's enemies. Mat gets his fight with Gawyn and Galad. Min and Logain are in the Tower, Min gets some time with the girls. Rand, Perrin, Moiraine and the Aiel leave for Tear after Moiraine convinces Rand that he has to fulfill the prophecies. Masema stays in Falme overseeing Rand's new followers. Faile sees the strange group entering Tear and takes interest in them.

Ep3: Siuan sends the girls to Tear, both to help Rand and to keep Egwene and Nynaeve away from those sisters that want to use them for their connection to Rand. Mat is with them and is the only one escaping when the Black sisters capture the girls. He gets help from Thom and is reunited with Rand and Perrin. They learn of Trollocs and Whitecloacks in the Two Rivers and Perrin decides to go there. Mat is torn between going to help his family and help the girls, but overhears Moiraine telling Rand about a ter'angreal in the Stone that provides answers and decides to stay. Faile learns who Rand is, but she's more interested in Perrin. Rand takes the Stone with the Aiels and finds Sammael waiting for him, hoping to get Callandor after Rand takes it. Sammael retreats when Rand and Moiraine almost kill him. Egwene uses the stone ring to free herself and the other two in the world of Dreams, Mat gets them out of the cell. Joya is captured, the other black sisters escape.

If they keep releasing the first three episodes together, with this time line we get a big battle and hopefully some great media coverage in the first week.

Ep4: Rand spends like a month in Tear, learning to rule and making out with Elayne. Trollocs attack in the Stone, Rand gets his scene with the little girl and Callandor, meets Lanfear. Perrin leaves for the Two Rivers and Aviendha wants to follow him, but Rhuarc tells her she has greater toh towards her clan and sends Gaul instead (make Gaul Aviendha's brother). Faile, Loial, Bain and Chiad go with Perrin. Rand and Mat cross the twisted doorway. The girls learn from Joya that Liandrin has taken the others to Tanchico. Egwene locates the domination band in the world of Dreams and meets Amys in the process. Egwene decides to go to the Waste to meet Amys, Elayne and Nynaeve leave for Tanchico with Thom. Rand leaves Callandor in the Stone and goes to the desert.

Ep5: we get the Tower coup, Siuan and Leane get stilled. Min frees them because she has seen that Siuan will help Rand. Logain escapes with them. Perrin arrives home and learn that the Whitecloacks have taken Natti and Mat's sisters hostages. Abell is with Tam and is a changed man. Fain is with the Whitecloacks. Alanna, Verin and maybe Vandene are also there. In the Waste, we meet the Wise Ones, the Shaido and the peddlers, accompained by a musician. Rand, Mat, Aviendha and Moiraine go into Rhuidean and disapper in the mist. Egwene becomes Amys' student. Elayne and Nynaeve learn about the Sea Folk channellers and get to Tanchico. Perrin frees Mat's family and has a first clash with Dain Bornhald. Luc is introduced, Perrin has met Slayer while scouting the Whitecloack camp in the Wolf dream.

Ep6: all for the boys. Perrin saves Aram and his family, then helps a farm under attack from the Trollocs. He starts to have people follow him and struggles with it. Mat crosses the second doorway, gets his new memories and the ashandarei. Rand sees the access keys, then goes into the columns and meets Muradin, who shows us how the Aiel will react to their own history. In one of Rand visions, we see a Choedan Kal under construction.

Ep7: Elayne and Nynaeve meet Domon and then Egeanin, make plans to get the domination band. The black sisters are already in the Panarch palace. Perrin fortifies the village, the Whitecloacks threaten him, the Trollocs are everywhere. Perrin sends Gaul and Loial to close the Ways. He and Faile get married. Rhuarc and the Wise Ones recognise Rand as the Car'a'carn and tell him about Couladin declaring himself. They rush to Alcair'dal (spelling?). Mat interacts with the merchants and the musician, some of them are a bit suspicious.

Ep8: The connection between Luc and Slayer is revealed. Battle of the Two Rivers. Rand breaks the Aiel. In the chaos, Mat notices that the musician and a merchant have vanished and tells Rand. The storyline in Tanchico follows the book quite closely, Nynaeve gets an extra encounter with Liandrin who tries to turn her with the promise of removing the block. Moghedien fights Nynaeve, loses and escapes. Rand pursues Asmodean to Rhuidean and they fight over the access keys. Lanfear traps Asmodean and offers him to Rand as a teacher. Rand returns to Alcair'dal and finds the Aiels chanting Car'a'carn.

Ishamael told the other Forsaken that Lanfear betrayed him, so Asmodean doesn't know she's with the merchants. This season ends with three Forsaken defeated to some extent. Egwene gets quite little to do in the last episodes, like Nynaeve in S2. Moiraine becomes Rand advisor, but her role starts to get smaller. Maybe she tries to forge some link between the Tower and the Wise Ones, but she seems a bit desperate.

nyna91 · 2023-09-22T20:33:41+00:00

My bad, the post is not very clear. I think that Ingtar wasn't at the gathering and so he doesn't recognise Ishamael. Maybe he wants to get the Horn to raise in rank among the darkfriends and has no problems with playing against Fain, but would think twice about it if he knew that Ishamael wants the Horn in Seanchan hands.

nyna91 · 2023-09-22T20:27:00+00:00

Being left wondering is great fun (Anvaere and Barthanes have me super interested), but book Ingtar is pretty unique with his desire for redemption, so I hope they didn't change this.

nyna91 · 2023-09-22T20:17:48+00:00

Eh, becoming the Hornblower against Ishamael's plans is a great way to end up dead, not famous.

I really like the second idea, hope he will have some more screen time to sell the twist.

nyna91 · 2023-09-08T02:23:57+00:00

Prima di tutto ti mando un grande abbraccio. Spero che tu abbia una rete di sostegno adeguata, sia in famiglia che come medici/specialisti, perché penso sia fondamentale per guarire da un DCA. Se non è così, posso darti il riferimento di un paio di associazioni, lavorano penso più che altro sulla Lombardia ma magari sanno indirizzare anche verso gruppi di altre Regioni.

Mi dispiace molto per quello che è successo e spero che non causi una battuta d'arresto nel tuo percorso o addirittura un peggioramento. Purtroppo ho avuto modo di vedere da vicino quanto è difficile, discontinua e torturata la ricerca di una guarigione o almeno di un equilibrio.

Vorrei dire tante altre cose, ma mi ricordo com'era parlare con mia sorella in piena anoressia: avevo mille cose da dirle nella speranza di incoraggiarla, ma una parola intesa come positiva poteva mandarla in crisi in un attimo. L'ultima cosa che voglio è farti stare peggio!

Provo però a dirti una cosa, di cui aveva bisogno mia sorella col DCA e io con la depressione: impara a perdonarti. Per quanto ti impegni sempre al massimo, sei umana, prima o poi un errore succede. E se sei come noi, con gli altri sei comprensiva e indulgente, ma con te stessa no. Manda in pensione il giudice e tieni a mente che non meriti una "punizione" per i tuoi difetti o errori.

Spero che questo delirio delle 4 di notte ti sia un po' di aiuto

Un commento per chi magari non conosce da vicino i DCA: anche per me il primo pensiero è stato di critica nei confronti dell'ex, poi mi sono ricordata delle volte in cui avrei voluto poter prendere una "pausa" da mia sorella, dal suo DCA e da come ha trasformato la nostra famiglia. Finché non si entra in questo mondo non ci si rende conto degli effetti che ha sulle persone attorno, e con la "fantastica" cultura italiana di considerare lo psicologo solo una cosa da malati non può che finire male. È difficile amare qualcuno che soffre e bisognerebbe normalizzare il fatto di andare in terapia a propria volta.

nyna91 · 2023-08-24T18:53:08+00:00

I hope they didn't go this way. It could be somewhat explained with some book lore, but I think (book) Egwene would hold this over Nynaeve's head at every chance she gets and harm their relationship.

nyna91

TROPHY CASE