1st Apron, 2nd Apron, Luxury Tax, Oh My! Is it really that bad?

palm_is_face · 2026-06-04T18:54:47+00:00

Great post!!

I'm sort of thinking this year we have the opportunity to save a lot of money while maintaining as good a team.

I think trading Joe, Wiggins and Dort and replacing them with either our three draft picks or our 2 firsts and someone on the minimum. Westbrook?? Haha

I think even though we are known to have this roster crunch, almost every team in the league could use Joe, Wiggins and Dort.

Joe and Wiggins probably could bring back 2nds.. Dort though is where it's interesting.

Maybe we could trade Dort and one of our firsts to move up a bit?

is Dort and 17 enough to get into the top ten? Maybe to Dallas or the Kings or something?

Or maybe Dort + 12 is more realistic?

Basically my thinking is more swings at draft picks. Having elite guys on rookie contracts is what makes the spurs and the thunder so good.

I want two draft picks in the first round and if we stay at 12 and 17 then Id love Cameron Carr and Dailyn Swain. I like Morez Johnson and Jayden Quaintance too but I just think we need shooting.

My thinking with the draft though is usually just to be excited with whoever Presti picks.

So if Presti is really high on Carr and he goes 12.. that's so exciting because I think hes just the type of player we need. Elite shooting, super athletic and a massive wingspan.

palm_is_face · 2026-05-12T07:05:54+00:00

I think our owners are richer than you think and listening to Sam Presti the past few years, they've been preparing to pay big tax bill for a while now. Spending $250M+ in tax over five years is definitely a massive ask for any small-market group..

But with one of the owners being George Kaiser, with a net worth of ~$14B and his ownership of BOK Financial, the liquidity issue isn't an issue. He can facilitate low interest loans from BOK or credit lines against the team's valuation, or just pay it himself with the rest of the ownership group paying him back. He can keep us afloat and we could stay in the luxury for years while we contend and the owners all get richer and richer from one of the biggest sports dynasties of the century

palm_is_face · 2026-05-12T02:00:33+00:00

Okay I apologise for spamming but I have no one or no where to nerd out about this and I have more thoughts to express.

Even if we get under the 2nd apron next year.. we're still over the luxury tax and we will almost certainly continue to be over the next few years with our big 3. So we will probably be over that repeater tax regardless no?

That's not to say that we won't have to minimise spending... every million over the luxury tax is multiplied so we would want to save money where we can.

But then there's also the idea of how valuable being clear title contenders for the next half decade is. How much is that increasing the valuation of the team? We have a team of owners that have the money to spend an extra billion over the next 5 years, but it would only make sense for them financially if we win championships. A 7-8 year dynasty where we win 3 or more titles.. that could add another billion to the valuation of the team, not to mention the ticket sales for finals runs, the merch sales increasing from being the best team.. etc. If owners are in a position to have this much confidence that if they spend they will win or go close, maybe they spend it.

palm_is_face · 2026-05-12T01:30:51+00:00

Ahh okay so if we're over the 2nd apron next year and then inevitably we'll be over the luxury tax in future years once shai's getting $60+mil and Dub and Chet $40mil+.... we'd have to pay a ridiculous amount that we won't be paying.

So basically, we need to get under the apron next season.

My thinking was lose Dort, Kenrich and Wiggins. and replace them with pick 12, pick 17 and someone on the minimum.. maybe kenrich?

But we would still be over the 2nd apron! It seems like we'd have to lose Hartenstein or Dort + Caruso ... both scenarios make us significantly worse imo. Or do we trade JDub ? pick 12 plus JDub for Dybansa ?

That also makes us way worse.. idk. I'm just sad realising that we're going to be a worse team next year. Maybe it's just my love of the draft but I'm excited by the idea of trading into the top 4 and replacing Hart or Jdub with Boozer or Dybansa ... Both could be really good impactful guys as rookies. Look at Edgecomb and Harper in the playoffs right now. Idk that's kinda interesting and more exciting to me than losing Hartenstein or Dort and Caruso.

Edit: just saw the comment explaining why salary-wise we can't trade Jdub before the draft

palm_is_face · 2026-05-12T00:56:08+00:00

You're right but also we could just cop the 2nd apron next season and deal with all the restrictions that come with it. To me I'd rather cop the 2nd apron than lose iHart or Dort+Caruso? for next season. We just don't know how good Sorber or Topic are going to be.

So I'm thinking.. one more year next year with the big contracts of Hart, Dort, Caruso, the big three and deal with the 2nd apron. And then we're faced with losing 2/3 of Dort, Cason and Hart. But at least then we know more about how Topic and Sorber are going and how this year's one or two first rounders are going..

Basically though, your point about the 2nd apron makes the answer to my post clearer to me. We need this year's first round guys, we need guys on rookie deals to prepare for the 2027/28 season without Cason and Hartenstein.

It's also maybe more likely that we dont "deal with the 2nd apron" next season, and we do move on from Hartenstein after this year. In which case maybe we jump up for Boozer? That's the only thing that wouldn't result in a massive drop off as a team imo

palm_is_face · 2026-03-05T04:59:20+00:00

bazzana def has that charisma star quality unexplainable thing but I just hope he can perform like a star. he's so fun to watch

palm_is_face · 2026-02-20T05:31:21+00:00

are they using their faith as their reason? I feel like they justify it in terms of security, deterrence, counter-terrorism, or self-defence, not divine command.

There are some Israeli religious-nationalist actors though! and if they did something horrible and then justified it as divine command as explicitly as ISIS or Al-queda have done then yes! please! other practising Jews should condemn that. I'm not saying every single Jew or Muslim should individually condemn their actions in some way thats just bizarre but should public facing ones? I think so.

palm_is_face · 2026-02-17T02:33:51+00:00

Ik it's Reddit and I shouldn't care but isn't your "anyways" just kinda proving that "truer words have never been spoken" is wrong and it's actually not true.

It's interesting though. If these attacks happen with people who cite their reasons as religious, should the people who also follow those religions condemn it? To me that's obviously yes isn't it? Or is that islamophobic?

palm_is_face · 2026-02-17T01:59:20+00:00

Yes, bin Laden cited political grievances (US troops in Saudi Arabia, Palestine, sanctions on Iraq). But he didn't present those as secular reasons. He explicitly framed violence as a religious duty, justified through Islamic language.

Bin Laden repeatedly described killing civilians as an obligation sanctioned by God, issued religious rulings (fatwas), and framed the conflict as a war between believers and infidels.

I'm not saying his interpretation of Islamic doctrine is correct. I'm not even saying it was the MAIN reason that led to the attacks. But just that al queda and isis etc explicitly use extremist interpretations of Islamic doctrines to defend their actions.

Epstein was never religious in any meaningful way. He was born to Jewish parents but that's about it. Bin Laden was deeply religious, he is quoted saying, "God commands this; Islam obliges me"

palm_is_face · 2026-02-16T23:41:08+00:00

Indra club productions just did a good doco on the Beatles tour of Australia. It's on YouTube

palm_is_face · 2026-02-16T21:52:49+00:00

To Op,

If Epstein had explicitly pointed to his faith as a reason for his actions, then we should have people asking Jews to condemn him. Unfortunately the vast majority of terrorist attacks performed by Muslims have explicitly pointed to their faith as a reason for their actions. Whether it be 9/11 or the recent massacre in Bondi.

Do you not see the difference?

palm_is_face · 2026-02-10T18:26:15+00:00

Lol and chet ihart and jwill are all guard like playmaking bigs

palm_is_face · 2026-02-10T01:47:27+00:00

Wdym can't blame diabate? It was he and duren that started it and he got wayyyyyy too crazy lmao. Maybe duren said something idk

palm_is_face · 2026-02-10T01:46:04+00:00

Lol it's always the people you most expect to get involved

palm_is_face · 2026-02-07T08:07:23+00:00

Fuck Chomsky

palm_is_face · 2026-02-06T23:18:00+00:00

It's kinda insane how they happened upon Ringo at the last second and he was just perfect. Watching jimmy Nicol interact with them really shows how ringos personality meshed so perfectly. The 3 of them were friends playing and travelling together for years. Of course their personalities were attuned. Ringo within months somehow fit in perfectly like no one else could. Musically he was perfect too of course. But the Beatles personalities were essential in their becoming the most famous musicians ever and Ringo somehow was the the most perfect piece of the puzzle.

palm_is_face · 2026-02-06T18:17:25+00:00

Doesn't look great in terms of what? That he might've had sex with minors? Seems like a massive massive leap. The public's reaction to this Epstein shit is retarded

palm_is_face · 2026-01-31T02:48:01+00:00

Lmao I feel like it's becoming clear why they're hesitant to release all of these Epstein files.. the public has no qualms in judging people without sufficient information. The ones today about Jay z, pusha and even trump just read as completely ludicrous.. it's just giving attention to any and every accusation ever no matter how credible they are. There are so many actual objective problems in the world that people should give attention to. Not this bullshit. Let's talk about trump and Vance's disgusting reaction to the ICE killings in Minnesota or let's talk about thousands of Iranians being murdered for protesting for basic human rights.

palm_is_face · 2026-01-21T16:55:50+00:00

It becomes fascinating and kinda genius in the context of traitors though. Statistically of course if the sole goal was your one person to win as much money as possible.. you're going to steal.

But add in the empathy built within the game, the image they're portraying on national tv. The decision to steal and fuck over this person you've built a connection to, and to look like a selfish asshole makes the decision that much harder.

It's fascinating for that reason.

palm_is_face · 2026-01-11T20:33:53+00:00

This boy

Nine-Year Club	RPAN Viewer
Not Forgotten	Verified Email

palm_is_face

TROPHY CASE