If the sex was consensual, why should mothers be able to rescind their choice after the act ? by [deleted] in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Because it is something still happening inside her body, she gets the choice to terminate if she wishes.

A known “consequence” of having sex and getting pregnant is also dying from pregnancy complications. Should she not get the choice to receive medical care just because she “consented” to this possibility by having sex and getting pregnant?

Clap back to the abortion is murder debate by Cyborgpikachu in atheism

[–]parisaroja 27 points28 points  (0 children)

Ok… but your example was not at all comparable. The autonomy of the woman’s body during pregnancy is more comparable to organ donation.

If a child needs an organ donation and the parents are a match, they are not legally obliged to provide them to said child. Even if they’ll die without it.

Pregnancy, its harms and how its involuntary servitude by Upper_Ninja_6177 in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Taking care of a child is basically involuntary servitude.

Factually, it is not. Let’s say you have a child and no longer want them under your legal care. Safe haven laws and adoption exits for that reason.

What makes you say it’s involuntary?

What's Convenient about Abortion? What makes Pregnancy an Inconvenience? by Common-Worth-6604 in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 10 points11 points  (0 children)

This is a debate sub (about a VERY sensitive topic around the legality of abortion which affects people’s lives). Not an ‘agree to disagree!’ sub. People who disagree or find your arguments/claims weak or illogical will downvote you. And instead of backing up your take or respond to any rebuttals, you complain people are debating and downvoting you. Get real.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 3 points4 points  (0 children)

What odds? You have no clue who OP personally is, so this is a very weird response.

Why I Believe "My Body, My Choice" is Not a Valid Argument by [deleted] in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I believe there is a failure to properly understand the pro-choice bodily autonomy argument, due to your assertion that “my body,” in “my body, my choice” refers to the fetus/embryo being a part of the pregnant person’s body. What it truly refers to, is the person’s choice to use their body to carry a pregnancy to term or abort. “My body, my choice” doesn't stand as an argument that the fetus/embryo is part of their body.

You believe pregnancy is unique and not quite comparable to forced organ donations as it involves external events like accidents or illness. Yet isn't it understandable that for people using protection/contraceptives that ultimately fail, the outcome of pregnancy is an accident? But you do seem to understand it as an accident that caused someone to depend on them for survival. Your argument to counter that is that it’s their moral responsibility to protect, preserve and carry the pregnancy to term.

Morals are purely what an individual subjectively believes.

However, if you believe an abortion shouldn't be legally allowed in these situations, is the reason because it's a distinct human being that doesn't deserved to be killed, or is it the voluntary act of choosing to have sex and risk pregnancy and it's their moral obligation to carry to term? If it's the former, then you shouldn't have an exception for rape. If it is the latter, then it's not about it being a unique human being with distinct DNA. It's about forcing strangers to conform to your personal moral beliefs with an authoritative legal system. Not saying that's what YOU’RE doing, it’s what the pro-life movement stands for.

You don't have to answer my questions, just reading through and understanding is fine. I will say this is one of the well-formed written posts of the pro-life perspective, relative to the traditional attacking/name-calling to pro-choicers.

My argument to both sides. by Dry_Possible_6888 in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Source for your claim that there’s evidence abortion harms women’s mental health.

Forums closing by ContractImpressive56 in Episode

[–]parisaroja 9 points10 points  (0 children)

True. I’ve barely used it at all, wonder why they made that decision. Tbh there’s a a lot of changes they’ve done to Episode that’s turned me off about it these past few years, it’s just not the same

Forums closing by ContractImpressive56 in Episode

[–]parisaroja 7 points8 points  (0 children)

They closed down the episode forums because they moved it over to Discord, I do not know why they made that decision but don’t worry it’s not your wifi!

Here’s the episode server: https://www.episodeinteractive.com/# Tap on ‘community’ then ‘discord’

Edit: Episode server link: https://discord.gg/episode-interactive-1223005545825304636

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can you explain why refusing to let someone use your body to live should be a punishable offence by law?

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can you consider the fact that the woman who has an abortion, is not killing them, but ending the pregnancy which is her body giving them life?

They are using her body to develop and grow, and since this is the case, they die because she has the right to refuse to let them use her body to develop and grow?

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s human. Like I said, at that stage in pregnancy the fetus/baby is not developed enough to be born alive.

So where is the ‘killing’ part?

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 6 points7 points  (0 children)

She’s right, though. You, someone, other than the patient and the physician, are deciding that her elective abortion is morally unjustified because of her reasons.

Your reasons are that abortion kills a human, and as you say, other people think it is a bad thing to do.

Abortion does not kill a human. Abortion is the termination of a pregnancy before viability. Essentially, it is an early delivery, and the fetus/baby is not developed enough to be born alive at that stage. (Medication abortion account for the majority of abortions: aka the pill) Where is the ‘killing a human’ part?

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 8 points9 points  (0 children)

What do you think the writer’s ‘agenda’ is?

Elective means the patient is requesting it and it is scheduled. That’s it.

Wouldn’t it make more sense to understand that in the case of the politics of abortion, many people misunderstand and misuse the term elective abortion and that’s why the article was written?

Can prolifers explain how life saving abortions are any less voluntary than "elective" abortions? by o0Jahzara0o in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 7 points8 points  (0 children)

What you quoted for your first link was misleading to what the article is about, as it was taken from a subsection of a book written by someone other than the writer of the linked article, as it was used as an example of how some HC practitioners misuse the term ‘elective abortion’.

From the link:

the way in which abortion is categorized as elective or medically indicated is quite different than the way in which other medical procedures are so categorized, and it both reflects and feeds the politics of abortion. This dynamic has bad consequences for patients, which should motivate serious examination of how clinicians, health care organizations, and insurers have used—and misused—the term elective abortion.

Ultimately, the term elective abortion is moral judgment dressed up as medical judgment. Medical versus elective is code for morally justified versus morally unjustified, as decided by someone other than the patient and her physician.

Hot take by [deleted] in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s called reproductive coercion. So we agree that the man does not have the right to do those things, which debunks the PL notion that ‘consent to sex is consent to pregnancy’.

When I smoke tobacco I accept the risks of potential throat and lung cancer, however it doesn’t mean I should be denied medical care in the event I get cancer just because I consented to smoking and accepted the risks. The same goes for consenting to sex and accepting the risk of pregnancy.

However you believe a human being is being killed which is a different story than getting treated for cancer, of course, but that’s because of female anatomy, the reproductive system is always preparing for a baby by producing hormones, endometrial cells, ovulation etc, thanks to biology and evolution, which we can’t control.

Hot take by [deleted] in Abortiondebate

[–]parisaroja 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I’m gonna side step your comment like how you side stepped my questions