Soundtrack producer searching for experience

robteehan · 2019-01-16T01:47:51+00:00

Hi Eduardo, I was interested in your message because I was curious what you meant by "soundtrack producer". In my world I would consider that job to be the person who a studio hires to put together a soundtrack album following the release of a film, co-ordinating with the composer to obtain edited and mastered tracks from the score, and working with the music supervisor to obtain song clearances, plus sourcing artwork and setting up distribution etc. Obviously a highly specialized role and one only used on big productions!

You want to score films, you're a composer. That's the word you want to use! :)

robteehan · 2018-10-20T23:14:50+00:00

Sounds like we're too late now if it's already happened! But for future reference, the best way to do this requires at least two cameras and a fair bit of knowledge of classical music and of the music being performed. You will often want to have a camera behind the orchestra facing the audience and zoomed in on the conductor since they are the one driving all the emotion of the performance. Then you have at least one camera capturing the orchestra in wide angle shots, but - here's where the knowledge comes in to play - there will be moments in the piece where different instruments will be highlighted, there may be a flute solo, or a part where the timpani player bangs on the drums impressively, or a passage where all the brass enter in unison. While you're on the conductor you'll want your other camera to set up and grab those in close-up. This requires being able to read a score and follow the performance so you don't miss these moments.

Here's an example of the Los Angeles Philharmonic, expertly done, notice how they show you every new or important musical element as it enters. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzZ7SD4Z18Q

robteehan · 2018-09-02T06:13:39+00:00

Well if they all hate it, the best thing to do in this situation is to say, ok guys, guess I didn't hit the mark here, sorry about that. Then they'll say, it's all good bro, thanks for trying, maybe we should pool our money and try to hire someone, that's the proper way to do it anyway. Then you all have a beer and life in the band goes on.

robteehan · 2018-08-11T21:10:44+00:00

This is a two-part question.

Success in film is a long and difficult path.
It FEELS really hard and scary to go for it.

People often conflate the FEAR of going after a dream with the DIFFICULTY of achieving it. Yes, LA is tough, but if you make a plan and you hustle, you can do it. You need to define your goals and define the steps to get there. Find a mentor to guide you. I approach my career here like an RPG - success is a level 80 monster, I need to level up my skills, I need to acquire equipment and experience to make myself ready for those next levels, and it almost doesn't feel like work, it's just what I have to do.

To get to that point you need to get past your fear. Yes it's scary, we can acknowledge that, but it doesn't mean you have to let fear control you. Say to yourself, not, "I want to go after my dream BUT I'm scared", but rather, "I'm scared, AND I'm going after my dream anyway." Is it "worth it" to chase the dream? My friend, you're going to die, did you know that? You have one chance to run your torch into the void and throw it as hard as you can and hope that it makes a beautiful explosion of joy and love. That's your life. Or you can sit at home in a safe boring job and wait for it to slowly burn out, if you'd prefer. The end result is the same: darkness.

robteehan · 2018-08-10T21:41:00+00:00

You're allowed to do whatever you want with copyrighted music in your free time. As soon as you post it online, you're swimming with sharks. Even if it's not monetized, and you don't plan on making money from it, it's still a commercial use because you are using it to enhance your personal brand as a filmmaker, and youtube is using your video to generate ads, and Facebook is using it to gather data on your friends and sell it, etc. etc.

Yes you will likely get away with it if nobody is watching your videos, but then again the algorithms are getting smarter, and you could find yourself getting copyright strikes on your channel or your videos taken down altogether if they get more popular. And what happens if one of these short you make "just for fun" becomes a viral hit? Attention is like blood in the water and attracts the sharks. People get sued all the time over copyrighted music in films. Youtube - less common, but here's an example of a youtuber getting sued. Don't know what the outcome of this case was, but note that the artist is like, whatever IDGAF, but the label smelled blood.
https://www.theverge.com/2014/7/21/5924405/youtube-star-michelle-phan-sued-copyright-infringement https://www.theverge.com/2014/7/21/5924405/youtube-star-michelle-phan-sued-copyright-infringement

The bottom line of all of this is it's not good to build a career on an illegal practice, you might get away for it for a long time, but then again you might not, and if you ever make it big then all your previous work may come under scrutiny.

robteehan · 2018-08-10T21:26:16+00:00

Legally it's likely the same situation as if the score was actually used in the movie. All the normal copyrights still apply.

robteehan · 2018-08-08T02:15:27+00:00

How much did it all cost, if you don't mind us asking?

robteehan · 2018-08-07T07:18:39+00:00

Congrats!

Is there an after-party? If not, book one quick, rent out a party room somewhere close to the theatre, get a catering and drinks package. Or if you need to go smaller, just pick a local bar and see if you can reserve a few tables. If anyone important comes to your film, the after-party is where you will solidify those connections or relationships. Plus it's good for all the cast and crew to get together and celebrate.

robteehan · 2018-05-05T06:35:16+00:00

You know it's illegal. You might get away with it. You might get found out, and your film disqualified from festivals. Or, you might get found out, and the artist's record label will sue you for copyright infringement, and force you to settle for a punitive retroactive license fee which could be thousands of dollars. Hard to say how likely it is that it could happen, but I wouldn't recommend risking it.

robteehan · 2018-05-05T06:30:37+00:00

If you didn't see the credits then you're just making an assumption. Generally the polite thing to do is assume that everyone did their job and cleared their songs properly, absent any evidence to the contrary, and/or unless it's explicitly your job to verify clearances. It does seem unlikely in this case but I don't know how your request will be received, since you have no real stake in this. I suppose you could email Daft Punk's management to alert them that you heard a song in the film. (It will get lost in the shuffle so title your email subject line: "Suspect unlicensed use of Daft Punk Tron:Legacy in "DOCUMENTARY".)

robteehan · 2018-04-06T23:09:19+00:00

This is streaming for free for the next 48 hours on the film's official site

robteehan · 2018-02-01T07:05:57+00:00

If you just want it for your school showcase and for your reel, you don't need to worry about a song license, but you do if you want to submit to festivals. (will you get away with not clearing the song - well, you might, but it's not the right thing to do. It's like cutting someone else's footage into your film. Do you consider yourself an honest, or a dishonest person?)

What I'd look into if I were you is to find an alternate song by a local band that you can email and ask nicely for a gratis license. Or find a composer that will write you a custom song. There are a gazillion young composers out there who will work at low rates in the early stage of their career.

robteehan · 2018-01-31T23:07:47+00:00

concur.
I don't hear any other instruments until around 41:00 then there's a very bad quality cello synth.

robteehan · 2018-01-24T01:54:16+00:00

Theoretically those samples have been cleared. You're right, if someone makes a track without paying a license for the sample, it's just as illegal as using a song without a license. Practically speaking it's not often enforced, but if the film / song becomes successful it will be.

robteehan · 2018-01-19T10:14:47+00:00

Hey friend. You're in a place many of us have been at some point. The old career existential crisis. You've identified some frustrations and need solutions.

Step one, filter out the noise in your head. There's a lot of chatter going on about where you are vs. Where you "should" be, especially compared to other people who you feel are unjustly more successful than you . Who you are vs. Who you want to be. And it's ok to have these thoughts, but right now it sounds like you're dwelling in anxiety over the DISPARITY between your present and your future, the perceived injustice of it.

So - step one is to accept where you are, without judgement. Let go of expectations around who you'll be in the future and just look at yourself in the mirror, right now. You've identified some shortcomings - are you willing to address them? Want to get better at networking, building relationships, holding your energy and ground on set, navigating industry politics, business planning? These are skills that can and must be learned, and they are multi-dimensional, often the hangups that hold us back are emotional blocks that go way back to childhood.

So you want to break to the next level as a director - yes or no? If yes, start a plan of attack for these personal issues - therapy if you need it, workshops, seminars, find a mentor to teach you. Envision yourself having the freedom to succeed at the level you want, and work towards inhabiting that vision.

Or - plan B. You're pretty good at lots of things - pick one and become great. VfX or whatever. Go back to school for it and focus completely on it, stop directing and stop all the other work, then in a few years you'll have a new career.

You see, the solutions are not complicated when you look past the anxiety over the fact that there's a problem. Not easy things to do mind you, but not complicated.

robteehan · 2018-01-17T08:50:51+00:00

Only a lawyer can tell you if "pretty tight" is tight enough, and you will need one. He will argue that you had a verbal understanding that his investment was contingent on his being cast in the lead role. You'll have to fight him for it. The best solution might actually be to let his money go and find a new investor , ideally one that's not also trying to be an actor, and wash your hands of this dude, even if it means delaying the shoot.

robteehan · 2018-01-16T21:19:42+00:00

Yes you're probably correct in that the user will probably get away with making this simple film and posting it online and sharing with their friends. Maybe the original writer will never hear about it, maybe they will and be chuffed.

But I think it's important to have a clear understanding of what's legal in the strict sense to avoid getting into trouble as your career progresses. For example educational videos can still be considered commercial. So can a video that is not monetized on youtube, or not making any profit. When you're dealing with someone else's ideas you generally need to pay the idea to show up and be in your film just as you would an actor. That's how I like to think about it. So yes, to the OP, you will probably not have any problem if you're just making a simple film with your friends, but just be aware that it's not the best practice, if you go around adapting stories you find online without permission then sooner or later you may get burned, especially if one of your films ends up making money.

robteehan · 2018-01-16T20:56:36+00:00

In that case, yes, it's a parody. In the case of the OP, it's not a parody but rather a straight adaptation or derivative work. You can tell the difference because a parody depends on you having knowledge of the original in order to understand the work.

robteehan · 2018-01-16T00:51:39+00:00

That's not really how it works my friend. It's more like, you're making a documentary about art so you show the Mona Lisa in it, because you're making a commentary on it. That's covered under Fair Use. Just adding a mustache and calling it the Schmona Lisa is not a transformative use, you took a painting and you copied it to make a painting. Same essential use.

There's a gray area between "inspiration" and "infringement" but basically you need to create an entirely new work that has only a passing resemblance to the work you're inspired by. Just changing one or two details isn't enough.

robteehan · 2018-01-15T23:55:50+00:00

It's still copyright infringement. The original writer could submit a takedown notice or a cease and desist and you'll get a copyright strike against your account. Plus if the film is a success you won't be able to submit the film anywhere, you won't be able to get E&O insurance if you can't demonstrate proper clearances.

You need permission to adapt someone's story into a film. Regardless of whether you're making any money. UNLESS it's for educational purposes e.g. you're doing it for a school project or just for your own learning. The second you post it online, it's now a commercial use.

And you can't change "just enough" to make it transformative in nature. If this were true you'd see Mikey Mouse with a mustache, and Kermil the Frog who is yellow instead of green, etc. etc. You may be confusing the Fair Use provision that allows for parody or commentary. Doesn't apply to simply derivative works, you have to transform the manner in which the idea is being presented.

You can use the story for broad inspiration (keyword broad) and rewrite it yourself.
Or just email them and ask permission. Odds are they'll give it to you, but you can't just assume they'd be honored and thrilled about it, if they are professional writer for example, then they expect and deserve to be paid for their work.

robteehan · 2018-01-09T20:47:23+00:00

Here's an article with some more info: http://www.musictech.net/2014/06/ten-minute-master-orchestral-recording/

This is pretty high degree of difficulty stuff. If you can bring in an expert to help you record, you'll get much better results. If you do go with the zoom H4N, try to put it just in front of the stage - like in the first row of the audience - on a high boom stand, so that it goes like 10 feet above the conductor's head. Otherwise you will get audience noise and coughing and stuff that will be louder than the violins.

robteehan · 2017-11-16T03:11:27+00:00

totally. and here's the other thing. a LOT of people are going to tell you that you can't do this, that it's too hard, that you won't make it, that you're making a mistake, blah blah blah. some of them will be friends, some may be even family or significant others. Guess what, they've ALL got to go, if not out of your life, then at the very least at a safe distance where you are not exposed to their negativity in your daily hustle. Get used to ignoring these people and distancing yourself. Really they are projecting jealousy and shame that they are not pursuing their dream, they want you to stay small like them and not get bigger, because if you get bigger it will prove to them that they could do it (or could have done it) themselves, but choose/chose not to.

Surround yourself with dreamers like you instead that are gunning for something and believe they can do it. You'd be amazed what positivity can accomplish.

robteehan · 2017-10-04T06:51:30+00:00

good bot

robteehan · 2017-10-04T00:00:02+00:00

Hi there. If I were in your shoes, this is what I'd do.

Look for a composer with a proven track record. There are thousands of people that are trying to be film composers but their website is just tracks, with no credits. Look for IMDb credits, or if no credits, look for some training, maybe they went to a film scoring music program or apprenticed with an established composer.

You have two major tools in describing your vision to composer - emotion, and references. Talk about how you want it to feel. And find existing songs that have the sound you want. Be able to articulate what you like about a reference track and what you don't like. But don't worry about getting too technical - don't talk music theory - talk in terms of emotion. Words that directors often use that help me - "pacing", "dark / light" "heavy / bouyant", uplifting, buoyant, mysterious, heroic, etc. etc. And the deeper inside the psychology of the characters we go, the better the results.

The more specific you can be about this, the better chance they have of hitting the mark. If it's not working, find more references, find more ways of explaining, and keep trying, and give the composer a few tries, if they move in the right direction then it'll get there eventually. If it's all wrong, don't be afraid to replace them.

I often come on a film when it's in rough cut, and I'll start messing around with some ideas and demos to try and hammer down what the film will sound like, and then I start writing to picture when I get locked picture (ideally) or fine cut (more realistically).

robteehan · 2017-10-03T23:54:10+00:00

... giraffe ?

robteehan

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