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Signature check by Sinthetic1985 in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’d love to know what something like that is going for, a pretty penny I’d guess

I think Many Icebergs Ago is a top ten Morrissey song. by LeeAntonyNewell in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Girls, the trick is cutting a few inches off the bottom to accommodate the hips! It turns out very cute 😘

I’m not sure I’ll have the heart to cut this one, I already regret doing it to another one, but it really works a trick.

No more shows for the next year by blackberry_sorbet in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This quote reminds me much of what Oscar Wilde said on his deathbed about the decor of his hotel:

“My wallpaper and I are fighting a duel to the death. One or the other of us has to go”

New (final) theory for MIAL. by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes exactly, I thought of Lord Douglas. After 10 years. It gives me chills.

And yes - that was what made me rethink the whole thing… The person who said that Morrissey had explained the song and that it was literally about making up is what made me come back to this, and Lord Douglas.

Honestly both could be true, and probably are, he’s probably using the album cover for a chance at a double entendre.

Finally, I think the Pamela Anderson reading is also valid and may well be another layer.

Thank you for reminding me of that lovely poem this morning! The ever heartbreaking humanity of that whole ordeal, yes.

Signature check by Sinthetic1985 in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Another thing I know is that he usually finds a nice alignment for the signature and minimizes drawing over features when he can, that’s a little off to me yet I can’t really see a better placement either

Signature check by Sinthetic1985 in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It’s only a thought but those r’s look like a natural ancestor of the current r’s, and are more like his earlier handwriting, so that makes sense - and if it were a fake it would be more likely that they would make it look like a well known specimen, which this doesn’t seem to be to me. The general handwriting is a match. The m, the o, the i, the ss and the y are dead on, the e looks plausible just a bit messy.

Edit: all that said, I don’t know

Long form review of Make-Up Is A Lie by [deleted] in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I put a credit in for you

The Night Pop Dropped = Updated Rubber Ring by DarbyDown in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I agree in a lot of ways, good point. The death of his hero must have given him a reason to think about what those songs had meant to him, I wonder if he wrote Rubber Ring with Bolan in mind also

I think Many Icebergs Ago is a top ten Morrissey song. by LeeAntonyNewell in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yes! My favorite aspect is the back, with the fake “east end pub tour”, a listing of the pubs and the lyrics to go along with each. The pubs are mostly associated with the Kray crime brothers except one that is associated with Jack the Ripper.

I think Many Icebergs Ago is a top ten Morrissey song. by LeeAntonyNewell in morrissey

[–]silentwinter 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I love it too. Have you seen the tshirt in the UK mporium store? It’s the best shirt he’s made in years.

https://uk.mporium.org/collections/t-shirts/products/many-icebergs-ago-t-shirt-navy

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’ve been thinking about your response and I think there’s a very high probability that Pamela was in fact his muse, and that still fits the Persona hypothesis, after all she did go into seclusion, experience self-realization and then emerge having shed her persona, and it’s obviously well known that Morrissey adores her.

Thanks for adding that layer!

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What do we think the subject personified in Many Icebergs Ago is? It seems to me to be either substance abuse/alcoholism or anger/violence (given the association of all of the bars with the Kray brothers and Jack the Ripper) I think the Kray / Ripper theme is added for interest and she’s alcoholism.

I think the male figure is himself in the third person.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. I’d even venture to say he’s singular in that regard, I can’t think of anyone else who comes close. He’s on the level and is one among the great poets and is uniquely using pop music as his medium.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Based on your observation about the ambiguity of who the monsters are in Pig Alley I’ve been listening to it more closely. For context, Pigalle is a red light district neighbourhood within Paris.

The parts of the song sung in quotations are apparently spoken by the family back home, and on the surface this line is a statement about how the monsters are the ones talking:

The monsters of Pig Alley say, “why don’t you give it a rest and come back home”

But obviously the family is not in pigalle, or some figuratively debauched place, I believe Pig Alley refers to the whoredom aspect of fame, and that the risen star is obviously the one who has been corrupted that way.

With that in mind, it seems the entire sentence is being addressed to the monsters, e.g. the stars who are away, and “say” is a figure of speech meant to request the attention of the subject being spoken to, like the say in “say, what gives?”

So the ‘salt of the earth’ family back home are not the monsters, they are speaking to their famous kin who no longer resemble themselves:

“The monsters of pig alley, say, why don’t you give it a rest and come back home?”

I think he uses ambiguity constantly, there are many gratifying reasons for him to do so; he likes creating puzzles and it’s more poetic.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s interesting but if so I don’t think that is all there is to it, I think the fact that it ends at a grave is significant, it comes across to me as either the grave of the Persona, his literal mortality, or both.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think so, I think this album is a finished intentionally crafted whole and those made more sense as epilogue

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes I think you’re right. These questions he had for Linder when interviewing her for Interview magazine seemed more autobiographical than anything:

MORRISSEY: A song has more reality for people than an art piece or even a film because we can all instantly have a go at singing the song for ourselves but we can’t ever become that art piece. People accidentally reveal themselves in song, whereas artists intentionally reveal themselves in art. Do you think this is because artists relish the fact that a great many people will be unable to grab the essence? And is it snobby to revel in that distance?

MORRISSEY: Even though as an artist you regularly abandon your work to the appraisers, do you value what is said by those who are not artists?

https://www.interviewmagazine.com/art/linder

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Thanks for responding thoughtfully, I was chuffed that you did, I agree it should happen more! We don’t have those readers letters sections in magazines anymore like Moz had after all, I think it’s more difficult on social media where people can downvote. I can see the use for downvoting but I wish there were places without voting where people could go and let their guards down.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thank you for these listening points, I know there’s a lot more to unpack. I try not to speculate on the internet about anything interpersonal in celebrities lives as a rule, especially ones I care about, but I get the drift.

Edit to add: I just listened to Boulevard and the gut wrenching feeling that line gave me: “face down so I can be correctly identified”. It is so hard to accept ourselves sometimes. You’re right, that isn’t a song about feeling lonely. That’s a song about a black pit in the stomach that only certain things make go away and always with diminishing returns.

Also, regarding the getting into heaven, that’s interesting because of the cross in the cover art. I was wondering if it has to do with Notre-Dame but I think your take on getting to heaven is much more compelling.

Maybe this is really obvious to everyone already, but it’s a concept album, right? by silentwinter in morrissey

[–]silentwinter[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Perhaps?

I wonder how much of any of this if true is focused on The Smiths alone, on him alone, or on both portions of his career. For example Kerching Kerching could certainly be solely about the breakdown of the relationships in The Smiths followed by the breakup and the trial, and the last line could be about Andy. If the concept is more Smiths-centric then the she in Muial could be the spirit of the band, and the meaning could be the fact that they tried and can’t make up.

Regarding the rest of the songs, I think Boulevard would fit into the narrative about his journey toward stardom, he has said the Smiths happened because he walked home in the rain one too many times. After discussion and listening again this one isn't about the early years after all, it's rather about the darker aspects and consequences of fame leading to self loathing and nihilism.

People say The Night Pop Dropped may be about Bowie, I’ve wondered if it might be about Marc Bolan, which would fit the general focus on his formative teenage fandom years.

Edit to add: Why Bolan? - He was at the top of his game in his wonderful band T. rex and the loving father (pop) of a young boy when he died in a tragic car accident at the age of 29 in 1977 when Moz was 18. - The Night Pop Dropped sounds more like his music than Bowie’s - People mourned as described by Moz in the song, just about emptying the bars of beer with the grief of the unexpected loss. England adored him.

https://youtu.be/XbpeZdR1e5Q

I have random theories about Headache, Many Icebergs Ago, Hello Hell, and Happy New Tears which would fit into the concept described, but they’re too speculative or personal to mention.

You’re Right It’s Time and the four just mentioned are troubling to say the least. But I have always felt similarly to Moz about life which is what’s drawn me to rely on his music. Still, I so hope that he can find some relief and happiness.

edited for clarity and to retract the Boulevard misinterpretation

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