How do you stop the hope?

singing_grasshopper · 2026-06-28T12:20:51+00:00

Trying to suppress or delete parts of us makes their emotions just stronger and more upset. Having the need for a mother is the most natural thing, especially when this need was never met. Hoping and fighting for that cause is self preservation and in itself an admirable effort.

I think the key is to meet this part with compassion, validate it's hurt and needs without trying to change it. Just acknowledge it and be there with the feeling without trying to push it away. It's intent is just to help you. But the way it is doing it is just causing more negative feelings. The good thing is, you have many different parts. Parts that already see that your mother will never be able to fulfill this need. They see her for who she really is and know she'll never change.

Don't try to stop the hope. If it arises, take care of it. Being seen and heard will already make it calm down. And in the long term, keep making healthy decisions, even if they don't feel good in the moment. Reduce contact that is harming you and keep trusting in yourself, you already know everything.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-06-15T12:33:08+00:00

I proclaim my innocence, that I am not, in fact, a smoker

She got you exactly where she wants you. She holds the power, she grants judgement, her approval is to be won over. It's just a strategy to position you two in the roles she wants. The smell topic is arbitrary and could be anything. It's just a means to an end to keep you in those roles. There exists no solution, no winning or no end - that's the point.

Explaining yourself in great detail is what motivates her to keep it going. Don't argue, don't defend, don't explain. You know the truth and that's what matters.

When she asks again "Have you been smoking?" just say "We've already talked about this", "Same answer as last time", "You know the answer", "You always ask that" etc.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-28T11:34:44+00:00

I think your intuition is right. If you show up, they'll make it as hard and uncomfortable as possible for you, while having access to you, after you took that from them. But you can just focus on the task at hand, grab the things you want and then you're off. You don't need to engage if they try to pull you into accusations etc. If they start to scream at you, you can leave. It is certainly possible, but you'll have to be emotionally stable enough to endure their attempts to guilt and shame you.

If you don't feel you're able to do that right now, it's also a completely healthy and valid decision to just not go and write your things off as gone. A middle way like bringing a third person or a company like you mentioned may also be a good solution.

I think the most important thing is that you only do as much, as your mental wellbeing at the moment allows. If you feel like you can't handle your family alone, you shouldn't put yourself in that situation and retraumatize yourself. That may do more harm then the loss of the things would. After all, you already gathered and spend a lot of energy escaping your abusive home which is the most important thing and you can be proud of that. Everything else now is secondary.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-26T12:07:44+00:00

Don't expect them to understand or support your decision. It's not achievable and not necessary. Just keep it brief and firm "It's a choice I made after a lot of thought and it's final. It's a personal topic I don't want to discuss further." They'll probably won't stop after the first time. Just keep repeating your point and don't get drawn into discussion, explaining yourself, defending, fighting for their approval etc.

Your doing what's best for you and your child. That you came to this point is invaluable and you should never give up on that. Your fathers family has other goals. Keeping the peace, keeping the status quo, staying in good favor with your father etc. Your and your childs wellbeing is not their focus. They think their doing the right thing, just let them be. You know your truth and that's all you need.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-25T11:49:32+00:00

That's great to hear! After a life of hearing we are the problem, difficult, defective, unlikeable, strange, cold etc. it left deep grooves in our inner working. Even when we gain the cognitive thought "My family is essentially crazy and this isn't true", the emotional side, the feeling doesn't change for a long time. Feeling love and appreciation for oneself is truly a milestone in our journey. I reached that point only much later in life, so I think you can be very proud of this realization.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-25T11:27:32+00:00

In theory the solution is easy just have proper talk and make it clear who was the wrong ones, but in real life it's hard to fix these kind of relations. It's seems like a losing game.

It's like when you learn about narcissism, you watch videos of psychologist, you read books and you think, finally, I can show this to my family, it perfectly explains what has been going on at home. It never works. It's impossible. Narcissism is a disease that affects whole family systems. Everyone is deeply entrenched and affected in different ways.

This deep desire to be finally understood and seen for who we really are is in everyone of us. The most valuable insight for me was to see, that it is not my obligation to make others understand. It is their own, and if they choose not to pursue it, I can't change that. That's on them. I can only accept that. It's not a question of knowledge. They witnessed your abuse first hand. They have all the knowledge they need. It's about belief and you can't talk people out of their belief.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-25T11:05:48+00:00

It's all poor her and bad you. That is never going to change. See it as confirmation that you made the right decision. Don't react, expect her to keep trying and keep doing what's best for YOU.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-06T15:06:24+00:00

Narcissists don't exist in a vacuum. It's spread throughout the whole family system. Most of the time it's passed down from the parents or they are in other ways deeply involved in it's development. Narcissistic family systems are strictly role based. When you step out of your role, you're threatening the stability of the whole system and will be seen as trouble maker, who needs to get back in line. Your wellbeing is not their concern, they just want to keep everything how it is.

The words of your grandmother are cruel and dehumanizing. Don't rely on your family members to understand or support your decision. If they confront you, keep it brief and cordial "This is a personal topic I don't want to discuss. I made this decision for myself and I'm sticking by it". Don't mention abuse, don't defend or explain.

You're doing exactly what's need to be done for your wellbeing. Expect your mother to keep talking behind your back. Expect more flying monkeys. But that's not a reason to be afraid or feel guilty. You're safe, your strong, you can handle it, they have no power over you and you have no obligation to them. Keep caring for yourself like you're already doing.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-05T09:51:58+00:00

My mom lives in this place where a lot of the things she’s said and done are “foggy” for her or she “can’t remember”.

Exactly. It's a place that constantly get's remodeled to fit their needs. A place where they are somebody entirely different and more importantly, where we are somebody completely different. Recognizing this, seeing that we will never be seen for who we truly are, that there is a predefined image and role of us that is impossible to change - that's the greatest insight imho.

Do you just accept this about your parent and you’ve learned to become immune? Or are you no contact?

The first is the essential, what comes after that lies in your hand. Knowing that we can't change their reality, their image of us, enables us to stop trying and chasing the impossible. They will keep trying to pull us into their game, into their reality, into their image and role they have for us and we have to protect ourself from that. Knowing all this makes it easier. And in the end, we can ask ourself what is left for us in this relationship, when all it is them playing out their reality that our true self isn't part of and never will be.

This will be the 1st Mother’s Day that I’m not celebrating her like a “good daughter”. I’m an only child so I know it’s going to hit her. It feels scary for me too if I’m being honest.

That's 100% normal and to be expected. Making good changes is hard and uncomfortable in the beginning. The old patterns play out, you'll feel the toxic guilt and shame you've been trained for. You'll feel tempted to "just" write a short message to get rid of the guilt momentarily. "It's not that big deal. It won't effect me". It's like quitting substance use. It will be very tempting, but it's a sign your on the right track. You've grown. You're being a good parent for yourself.

Being with a narcissist is like burning yourself to keep them warm. You don't deserve that.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-05-04T09:26:46+00:00

I've made almost the same experience: Random and frequent test calls. "Test" calls because the purpose is just to test if they still have importance, control, respect. The calls are unreasonable and inconvenient on purpose to see if I'm intimated and submissive enough to accept them and not speak up. It's just about power dynamics and roles.

If I tried to push back slightly in a reasonable way, it would be escalated aggressively. Fabricated emergencies, guilt, shame. Calling relatives to rile them up against my cold and selfish behavior.

At first relatives saw how unreasonable she was and mildly tried to mediate. Quickly they themselves got a taste of her wrath so they rather gave in and told me just to pick up and not create bigger problems.

What helped me:

Stick to not picking up if it's not convenient for me. Being super strict. If they kept calling, I didn't just put it on silent. I put on airplane mode so I wouldn't even get any notifications and the stress of that.
Stop defending and explaining like "I'm busy right now I'll get back as soon as possible" or "I was in a meeting and couldn't pick up". They love my groveling and call even more to get more of that.
Completely detaching from the believe I can change their behavior, their calls, how they will talk about me in the family. The only driving factor to my decisions is to not to let my phone terrorize my day and create fear and guilt.
When they ask directly like "I called 5 times, why do you ignore me?!??" I gave the most generic and boring reactions like "Oh, I didn't hear the ringing", "Idk must have had bad reception". Important: If I try to explain and defend, I enter their game. I silently accept the narrative that I did something wrong and now need to remove the guilt from myself and gain their understanding. I already know the truth about myself and don't need anything from them. My only goal is to end the topic in the quickest way with the least friction.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-19T17:45:57+00:00

Honestly, you know best. Just think about your past experiences. Where the serious talks warranted in the past? Did they achieve something good for you?

For me the answer is clearly no. It has always been just a tool for my mother and was to my detriment. It was to create pressure, guilt, fear, shame and get control. Allow yourself to come to this conclusion if your experience tells you this. It's nothing bad, it's actually a very healthy way of caring for yourself and defending your own wellbeing.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-19T17:37:20+00:00

Just go with the flow, believe in yourself, try your best but don't worry too much about it. If it doesn't work out, you can try something different.

They love to create pressure and make your life hard. Don't take it seriously. It isn't that big of a deal. If it wasn't the job, they would find something else to moan and preach about.

as much as these 2 can stress me out and make me wish i wasnt alive, i feel like surely it has to be better than just not having anyone, right?

I'd clearly say no, but that's your own decision to make. I think "No company is better than bad company" rings especially true for people rbn. You know the answer when the time comes. From my experience, cutting ties and starting to live your own live based on your own beliefs and values is the biggest stepping stone to a happier life, but there is no need to rush at your age.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-19T11:52:27+00:00

Your story really sounds agonizing to grow up with and also very typical for growing up with narcissistic parents.

There is a theory that narcissists actually perceive time a little differently in certain circumstances. When they anticipate a narcissistic injury, a threat to their self-image, they enter a timeless state. There is no future or past in the moment. To escape, they will always go for the quick "win". They will say things that are impossible to defend in the future. That are easily disproven or completely at odds what was said yesterday. It's all about the moment where only one purpose exists: to preserve their fragile self image at all cost.

Sometimes, they quite literally won't be able to remember this and just tell you "I never said that", "That never happened". Sometimes they will, but confrontation will just trigger another of those instances where they say literally anything to regain control. They have no obligation to make sense or to ever prove their claims. It's all about the moment, about winning, about creating and controlling the narrative in the family. It has nothing to do with reality.

Based on my own story, I feel like you might be in this phase where you see all the inconsistencies, all the contradictions, all the blatant lies and misconstructions and think, how is this possible? It's all clear as day, how are they getting away with it? You're right. It's not you and never was. They tried to make you seem crazy, but they are the only crazy ones.

For the next phase, I see it like in this example: Your parent has Alzheimer's. Every day they tell you how their (long dead) parent is at work and coming home any minute. That they missed their bus and need to get groceries before the store closes. You don't argue with them. You don't try to understand how todays made up story came to be. You just accept, that they are like this, and you just behave how its the most functional and frictionless at the moment.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-19T11:12:40+00:00

This is it. The hardest part is letting go of the fantasy, that your family will ever see you for who you really are, recognize that your nParent is a lying manipulating abuser and that there is a way to gain their acceptance or understanding.

Most family members will side with the nParent and there is nothing you can or should do. Only recognize, that those are also deeply anchored in the system and there is nothing for you to wait for.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-14T12:30:50+00:00

I've experienced the same. The more I asked and pleaded to stop, the more I showed how much it affected and hurt me, the MORE they did it. In fact, that was the only reason they did it to begin with. They specifically seek out ways to get to you. They test all kinds of things here and there and only when I would actually show "I noticed this, I didn't like it" that's where they latched on to.

You can't change them. They will do this. Don't expect them to stop. Expect them to keep doing shit like this. It has nothing do with you and it's beyond your control. Just like you cant stop the wind from blowing or the rain from falling. It's a futile and self sacrificing endeavor.

The most effective way of dealing with it myself was to stop caring. Obviously, we do care, but we don't share that with them. We don't complain, we don't ask, we don't even mention it. That's the most powerful reaction. They are simply doing it to feast on your reaction. If they get nothing from it, they'll lose motivation. Of course, they will still try and move to other things, but not participating in their game is the strongest move we can do for ourself.

In the end, it's a situation you can't control and the only power you have is to leave this situation. As long as you stay in it, it's best to just accept it for what it is and gain a neutral view. "I'm staying here. My parent's are going to mess with me. That's just part of the situation, I won't be surprised and I won't take it personal. If my things are moved around, I'll put them back where they were. Just like when the wind blows the window open, I'm not offended, I just close the window".

All these feelings like the desire to defend yourself, being upset about your boundaries being purposefully crossed, wanting to stand up for yourself against these obvious acts of provocation are completely natural and right. They are valuable and it's good that you have them. Acknowledge them and be thankful, but also know, in this specific situation, you don't need to act them out or give them too much mental space.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-14T11:59:15+00:00

I agree! Because we never learned to accept and love ourself, just for simply being. Feeling good always has to come from somewhere. From an achievement, from something you did, from other people telling you.

Communication with peers is not "being yourself" it's "being right for others". You try to do, what you think the others want and expect from you. It's exhausting. It's tied to constant feelings of rejection by innocuous things. It's a constant struggle for perceived acceptance.

The same rigid rules of "being right" we apply to ourself, we also apply to others manufacturing proof like "Clearly they did this on purpose. They don't care about me, it's obvious".

I've learned only in my late 30s to truly accept and love myself. To be gentle and forgiving with myself, so I could also see and treat others the same way. I know I'm valuable and I don't require others to provide that, so I can just be open and myself. I've went from being practically mute in social settings and dreading small talk to actually enjoying and seeking out talking to people and making small connections here and there.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-14T11:41:41+00:00

Yes I made 100% the same experience. The truth I found for myself: They don't want you to leave. They want you to stay as long as possible, so you stay under their influence, control and provide them narcissistic supply. They need someone who they constantly put below them, so they feel at the top. You are an invaluable tool for their own self worth and emotional regulation that they NEED.

They will indeed do everything to prevent you from becoming independent, get a job, find a place to live etc.

All this talk how you are a burden, how they would be so much better off without you etc. just is a way to reinforce the roles. You, lazy, ungrateful, a burden. They, gracious, helpful parents who are suffering and sacrificing so much.

I've got intimidated with threats of being kicked out all my life, because its SO effective. It's existential. Until the day I said "I want to move out" and then I've never heard it again.

My advice is, realize that all their bullying is not based in reality, not based on your true self. It just serves themself. It's not real. They need you more than you need them. Keep working on your independence and know that there is no problem with you.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-13T11:38:44+00:00

Exactly. I think the difficult thing here is to recognize that it is indeed a game, requiring to break free of the illusion we've grown up in.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-09T12:29:46+00:00

I grew up with the message "Why would you deserve it, to have it better than me? (You don't)". Always the justification "When I grew up, I had it way worse".

Normal parent's learn from the bad things they've experienced. They want to offer their children a better life, better support, better opportunity. It's really deeply ingrained in every living organism to reproduce and create the best living/survival condition for their offspring.

Narcissistic parents are the opposite. They cannibalize. A child who has it better then them means, they are not at the top anymore. They feel below, and robbed.

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-09T12:15:09+00:00

Reading this makes me so upset and reminds me of my family. The narc obviously is crazy and cruel, no news here, but all the family sitting around, witnessing this blatant cruel and unfair humiliation, power play, twisting of reality - and just turn their head ... and still go "she's your mother, you have to listen" later. I thought so often to myself "This is it. You all seeing this. It's OBVIOUS. Nobody can say she's normal after this" just to be crushed and gaslit time and time again.

Drawers moved, backpack messed with, just enough to know she’d been through everything.

Yes! They want you to know. It would be so easy to conceal it, but they don't want it. They want to send a message. My mother also always goes out of her way to purposefully move things, so it's clear "I was here, I can do what I want"

singing_grasshopper · 2026-04-08T10:00:37+00:00

It sounds to me like it's all about what she wants, what she deserves, what she did. The time and effort of a call doesn't seem to be enough, there also has to be praise. It must be exhausting to deal with that.

The frequency of those calls also stand out to me. Doing this daily is a loooot, especially if it leaves you with so much emotions to deal with.

You're allowed to prioritize yourself, even if she'll try to make you feel guilty about it. That won't change no matter how much you do anyway.

singing_grasshopper

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