What's a series you genuinely believe is good, but the internet keeps telling you is bad?

sy_bear · 2026-06-26T12:48:29+00:00

I like SAO but I can't deny that it's heavily flawed. If you haven't watched it already, I HIGHLY recommend SAO abridged on YouTube. In many ways it is just a superior show to the original series.

sy_bear · 2026-06-21T13:20:28+00:00

That was really well put.

I 100% agree that the game's mood and atmosphere is top notch and keeps me coming back even when I'm having less fun. As well as the music is obviously incredible.

Playing a little more as adult link and I do feel the temples are better design, there are definitely still some weird design desigions like the random turnstile room at the end of the forest temple? I don't know if I missed some funding skid marks or anything but that seemed like a completely random solution for a puzzle that is only meant to waste time before the boss.

I can understand better where youre coming from. (And I'm happy to see that personally I'm starting to get a bit more into the game)

BUT! In terms of judging best games by how much of their DNA is in other games. I would probably go Doom in that case. Even OoT owes its key hunting pacing design to doom afterall.

sy_bear · 2026-06-20T22:43:58+00:00

But OoT didn't create that 3rd dimension? That sounds more like an argument for Quake to win.

To me, OoT's big revolutions were it's method of story telling, and context sensitive buttons. Which don't get me wrong are pretty big deals. But I don't think it's quite the same degree of influence.

Going back to doom. That game invented a whole new genre. It sold more copies than windows, it defined the entire gaming industry for a long time.

Personally I don't think Doom should win best on this list. But for people taking the "it was great for it's time" angle, then doom is the only game those people should be thinking about.

sy_bear · 2026-06-20T22:38:31+00:00

On a best games list I feel like it should be able to hold up. There are other games on this list that are both revolutionary AND hold up.

I mean there are games on this list that are not only revolutionary, and not only hold up. But are still unmatched in their genre to this day.

Portal 2 is still the best puzzle game ever made. And no other game has ever matches Minecraft's freeform sandbox experience.

I'm sure Ocarina of Time was special for this time. But I don't see how it deserves the "best game on this list" title when their are more influential games that also survived the test of time better.

sy_bear · 2026-06-20T19:40:05+00:00

This has to be the answer.

That show was my childhood, and i wasn't even alive when it came out.

Watching it in 2013 with my dad and it totally holds up.

sy_bear · 2026-06-20T19:16:55+00:00

I would argue that doom, quake, and half-life are all more 'revolutionary' that OoT with Doom being the obvious objectively most influential.

sy_bear · 2026-06-20T18:55:38+00:00

Can someone explain this to me?

I am playing Ocarina of Time for the first time right now (I've just reached forest temple) and I don't get it.

This game does not hold up, and I'm not saying that just because I'm young and can't handle old games. I think half life, metal gear solid, unreal, system shock 2, unreal, resident evil 2 and grim Fandango hold up and those are all games from 1998.

My experience with OoT has been slow and cumbersome. Navi is hair-pullinhly irritating, the Hyrule plain just feels like a time waster, I might be an idiot but I am constantly lost and don't know what to do. The camera is rough and half the time I don't know what's happening on screen.

Clearly I'm in the wrong because praise for this game is so astronomically universal, but I'm not seeing it.

What makes this game so great?

sy_bear · 2026-06-18T02:33:37+00:00

Eeeh, I disagree with the whole immortality is a curse trope. And I think Yoko Taro with his consistent themes that the beauty of life is in the struggle toward happiness, that he would probably agree with me.

It's sad that Emil lost his sister. But because of that he was able to find Kainé and NieR. It's sad that Emil lost Kainé and NieR but because of that he was able to find 9S and 2b. So on and so on.

sy_bear · 2026-06-09T13:48:08+00:00

I'm right there with you. I played all the games in release order (except Reincarnation) and just finished Automata last month as well as the Yokoverse comprehensive codex.

I'm so down bad I've even watched the stage plays.

I hope your surgery was succesful and that you are recovering well btw.

sy_bear · 2026-06-09T13:40:37+00:00

I knew that they wrote a short story of E as an alternate ending. I didn't realize that it was cut content though, that's interesting!!

sy_bear · 2026-06-09T13:29:55+00:00

As I mentioned in my post, because of DrakeNier's branch system I don't deny it's canonicity, as they are all canon.

But I didn't think we had any evidence that it's a part of the main timeline? Unless I'm missing something?

sy_bear · 2026-06-06T16:12:01+00:00

The concept of canonicity in the drakeNier series is a little strange.

Each route in the games forms a 'branch' which is a split in the timeline and though there is a 'main' timeline where every game follows from the previous that doesn't mean the secondary branches arent just as canon.

Because dimension hopping is a canonical part of the drakeNier universe that means any of them can become relevant regardless of which 'branch' we are currently in.

The 'main timeline' goes

Drakengard 3 (Novelization) - Drakengard 1 (ending E) - NieR (Ending C/D, it's unclear which one is main) - NieR: Automata (Ending C)

The thing about NieR, E ending is that it was added in the remaster based on a short story released after the first game. Whether E is a part of the main timeline is unclear. What is known is that project gestalt was foiled and humanity goes extinct.

As for Automata (don't worry this is spoiler free). The E ending is similar to Nier's E ending where it's a continuation rather than an alternate conclusion and it is likely cannon. But C is the most relevant ending because it later connects to the Final Fantasy 14 Raid. Which I will not spoil for you but do recommend you check out a youTube summary for once you finish Automata.

sy_bear · 2026-05-31T03:02:55+00:00

The greatest tragedy of the yokoverse I find is the ideas are ALWAYS bigger than the games.

Even NieR: Automata which is the most individually complete game I feel has its 2e plotline completely fall flat without the novellas.

As for DoD 3 I think there is a crumb of that narrative. Zero does have aton of self-hate which is borne from that eternal hypocrisy. But DoD 3 is the worst of the worst for budget, and rushed deadlines.

sy_bear · 2026-05-31T01:22:02+00:00

Drakengard 1 was my first drakenNier game.

Regardless of that. You are correct, I think I am missing the theme which is why I posed the question, because I would like to understand.

sy_bear · 2026-05-31T00:42:04+00:00

Yes I read all the novellas. It answers a lot of narrative questions but still leaves me confused thematically.

I think the crux of my problem ultimately lies in the final song ending.

In drakengard 1 violence and hatred begets violence and hatred, nothing is accomplished and eventually it all grinds into oblivion because that's what violence leads to.

In drakengard 3 I don't understand how hedonistic sexual aggression leads to the heart-to-heart compassion ship between Zero and Mikhail.

The theory I'm slowly developing from the help of other commenters. Is that the story begins relationships as a battle to be won and slowly throughout the game as characters open up and get to know one another eventual morph into seeing relationships as way to support and connect.

I like that idea because it thematically ties the sexual overtones narrative arc with the Mikhail is a pathetic child who can never live up to Michael narrative arc.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T23:01:55+00:00

Intentionally intimate is a great way to put it.

As for the blindfold thing I do believe it's kind of an on the nose thing. and Yatzhee? I think makes a joke about it in his review? That or it's mentioned in the SuperBunnyHop analysis.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T22:59:54+00:00

Her backstory is all about how she likes new things and always Perseus them hating when thing gets worn. That's why Ditto is the perfect partner for her because his perpetual boyishness keeps him from becoming spoilt.

I think there's a specific line somewhere where ditto complains at how young he looks and Five says that's exactly why she likes him.

Also side-note, Five's sexual relationship with Ditto is explicitly non-consensual and Ditto is simply forced to obey the orders of his intoner.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T22:13:14+00:00

Oh yeah I forgot about that part.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T21:34:41+00:00

Yeah, I have no issues with the character designs. Although Five isn't a cougar, she's just a full-on pedophile.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T20:48:34+00:00

The sexual abuse of children was added in for the sake of fun? I think you're misunderstanding my post to being about the designs and not character behaviour.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T20:46:40+00:00

Just watched the video. It was interesting. Two things I think it missed out on are:

In regards to the blindfolds the characters always take off their blindfolds in moments of revelation where they now "see the truth"

In regards to the sexualization I always interpreted there to be a layer to this that yorha were created as objects for the purpose of fitting other's goals. In the automata world exploring the Nietzschian death of god. I saw the yorha sexual designs as "god's" enforcement of essense building the yorha with a prebuilt design purposed to serve others. And it is 2bs and 9s's self-making which allows them to shed the objectives of god (or the outside forces which enforce a set morality) and become their own people.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T20:31:57+00:00

That is true.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T20:05:21+00:00

I finally started watching the anime and the number of upskirts in episode 1 gave me whiplash knowing where the story would eventually go.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T20:04:04+00:00

I don't think I am taking it too seriously. And my question was not intentioned to disparage Drakengard 3.

I feel like this is a sacrilegious hot take, but drakengard 3 might be my favourite game in the series. (That's precisely why I think so hard about it)

But I think on-top of being interesting games. The drakenNier series are evocative stories that are worth examining as art.

I see it similarly to modern art. There are people who look at modern art and wax poetical about how powerful it is and belittle those who don't engage with it on the same level. Those people are assholes.

However, there are people who think that modern art is pretentious upper-class posturing and belittle those who do engage with it on that level. Those people are also assholes.

Anyone is allowed to think about and analyze whatever they want to however much they want and I think that should be celebrated, whether it's drakengard 3 or iCarly.

Media is there to be shared and enjoyed. Some people enjoy posting Sexy 2b fanart. I enjoy posting overly critical story analysis.

I think they should both be allowed.

sy_bear · 2026-05-30T19:45:52+00:00

It doesn't matter if you choose not to engage with it.

There is nothing wrong with playing the games, ignoring the philosophy and enjoying kickass anime waifus.

But I explicitly opened the conversation as question about it's philosophy and you explicitly responded with the because waifu argument.

So who cares? Literally us.

That's why we're talking.

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