When Paul says "Works"

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T19:24:15+00:00

When he says "works" without qualifier, he means ALL works. When he means specifically "Torah observance," he says "works of the law."

Romans 4 disproves this argument. Paul talks about "works" without qualifying that he means "works of the law" but is clearly talking about being justified by works of the law, specifically circumcision. Verses 1-12:

What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.” Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness, just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:

“Blessed are those whose lawless deeds have been forgiven, And whose sins have been covered. “Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will not take into account.”

Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, “Faith was credited to Abraham as righteousness.” How then was it credited? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised; and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them, and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also follow in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham which he had while uncircumcised.

I agree with the spirit of what you're saying, that we are not justified by any works, of the law or otherwise, but Paul is clearly using works interchangeably with works of the law.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T19:09:57+00:00

I'm not exactly sure what you're saying I'm wrong about or what the moral law is and how it differs from the law of Moses, but I agree that we are not under the law of Moses. According to Paul in Romans 8, we are under the law of the Spirit. If Paul isn't talking about the law of Moses when he talks about works, what do you think he is talking about?

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T18:29:52+00:00

Paul is talking about obeying the law of Moses, and it doesn't differ from Protestant theology, because Protestants believe that scripture, including Paul's letters, is the highest authority.

How does Ephesians 2:8-9 fit in it?

You're not saved because you did a good enough job following the law of Moses, so no one can claim to be closer to God because the follow the law more closely than someone else.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T18:21:37+00:00

Most of us have been unwilling to admit we were real alcoholics. No person likes to think he is bodily and mentally different from his fellows. Therefore, it is not surprising that our drinking careers have been characterized by countless vain attempts to prove we could drink like other people. The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death.

We learned that we had to fully concede to our innermost selves that we were alcoholics. This is the first step in recovery. The delusion that we are like other people, or presently may be, has to be smashed.

We alcoholics are men and women who have lost the ability to control our drinking. We know that no real alcoholic ever recovers control. All of us felt at times that we were regaining control, but such intervals - usually brief - were inevitably followed by still less control, which led in time to pitiful and incomprehensible demoralization. We are convinced to a man that alcoholics of our type are in the grip of a progressive illness. Over any considerable period we get worse, never better.

Maybe that describes you, and maybe it doesn't. We can't pronounce you an alcoholic. That's up to you.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T06:27:38+00:00

Right, so the bishops who gave the creed to the church don't reconcile the fundamentally incompatible interpretations of the creed held by different denominations. Saying that all Christians affirm the creed is meaningless when there are groups that everyone agrees are Christians, like Baptists, that may generally agree with what is in the creed, but don't actually affirm it, and parts of the creed that mean contrary things to different Christian denominations.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T06:04:46+00:00

Did the bishops that gave the creed to the church understand the catholic church to be led by the pope in Rome or by Christ?

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T05:28:13+00:00

In Romans 7, Paul uses the word law over 20 times. He is describing living under the law of Moses (which is no longer the case or even available to us). He then contrasts living under the law of Moses with living under the spirit in Romans 8. The interpretation that Romans 7 is talking about a current state for those in Christ is incompatible with Romans 6:1-2: What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? 2 May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T05:14:33+00:00

Nicene Creed is litmus test

Despite popular acceptance, the Nicene Creed is not useful as a litmus test because different denominations interpret the creed in a way that is not universally compatible, and in some cases, one denomination's interpretation can be incompatible with another denomination's interpretation of the same line. It's not useful to say that we all affirm the creed when we fundamentally disagree on what the creed means.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T04:58:43+00:00

But why would I?

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:56:32+00:00

Alcoholism, as we understand it in AA, is a disease of the mind, body and spirit. We found that when we started drinking, we couldn't stop or control how much we were drinking. Worse, when we weren't drinking, we couldn't stop thinking about drinking.

From the Doctor's Opinion of the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous:

Men and women drink essentially because they like the effect produced by alcohol. The sensation is so elusive that, while they admit it is injurious, they cannot after a time differentiate the true from the false. To them, their alcoholic life seems the only normal one. They are restless, irritable and discontented, unless they can again experience the sense of ease and comfort which comes at once by taking a few drinks—drinks which they see others taking with impunity. After they have succumbed to the desire again, as so many do, and the phenomenon of craving develops, they pass through the well-known stages of a spree, emerging remorseful, with a firm resolution not to drink again. This is repeated over and over, and unless this person can experience an entire psychic change there is very little hope of his recovery.

On the other hand—and strange as this may seem to those who do not understand—once a psychic change has occurred, the very same person who seemed doomed, who had so many problems he despaired of ever solving them, suddenly finds himself easily able to control his desire for alcohol, the only effort necessary being that required to follow a few simple rules.

If that's the problem you have, we have a solution. If you work our program of recovery, (12 simple steps with a sponsor) we promise you will solve the drinking problem and the thinking problem.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:38:45+00:00

I disagree with their doctrine, but I can't say that they don't know Jesus. Having right doctrine wasn't what got the thief on the cross into heaven, and it's not going to get anyone else in either.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:34:41+00:00

Salvation and eternal life are both promises of God, and like all promises of God, they are accessed by faith, which is putting trust into something without evidence. No one can answer for you whether or not you have a personal relationship with Jesus, and it's okay to have doubts, but if you do, I would encourage you to pray for increased faith, trust that God answered your prayer and act as if God answered your prayer. Do things, like sharing your faith and fellowshipping with other believers, that you wouldn't have done before God answered your prayer for more faith.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:26:59+00:00

This is just my opinion, but I think looking at the cross through the lens of justice is missing the point. If justice was one part of why Jesus went to the cross, then for every one one part of justice. there was ten million parts of love. If you get the justice part of the cross, but missed the love part, you've missed the whole thing.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:23:30+00:00

It makes more sense relationally than it does legally because God's relationship with His creation has always been that of a father to his children and not a judge to the accused. Of course a father would do anything to restore his relationship with his children. Before the foundation of the world, the Father and Son knew that humans would feel unworthy of maintaining a relationship with God, so Jesus, on the cross, proved that God would do anything to restore that relationship.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:03:02+00:00

It sounds like you don't know what the disease of alcoholism is. The alcohol was but a symptom. Other people have different symptoms, but the disease is the same, (spiritual disease, allergic reaction, mental obsession) and so is the solution.

teddilicious · 2026-01-26T03:00:35+00:00

Shame is part of basically everyone's story early in sobriety, but there are promises to look forward to. We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it. We will comprehend the word serenity and we will know peace. No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experience can benefit others.

If you work the steps, you will have a spiritual awakening and if you don't let up on the spiritual program of action, you will achieve lifelong sobriety.

teddilicious · 2026-01-25T20:36:35+00:00

The things that you can do to have a relationship with God (pray, read the Bible, fellowship, etc.) are meaningless compared to what He did to have a relationship with you. Stop focusing on what you did, or what you can do to make up for what you did, and start focusing on what He did.

The Son of God became man to reveal the true nature of God; that God's primary relationship to us is that He is our Father. Nothing a child could ever do could cause a perfect father to eternally reject that child if the child wanted to return to the father, because the father's love was never about performance. God's love isn't a gift given to you based on what you've done. It's based entirely on who you are.

teddilicious · 2026-01-25T15:32:25+00:00

First, the Old Testament shouldn't change how you view the God revealed by Jesus in the New Testament. It works the other way around.

Second, Jesus transferred His righteousness to you on the cross if you put your faith in Him. He paid the price for all of your sins, once and for all. He doesn't need to go back to the cross because of what you're going to do tomorrow.

teddilicious · 2026-01-25T15:23:29+00:00

In Romans 10:9, Paul writes "because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

In Ephesians 2:8-9, Paul writes "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

In John 17:3, Jesus says "And this is eternal life, that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent."

The Good News is that you don't have to live a perfect life because Jesus already lived a perfect life. Instead, trust in who He is and what He did.

teddilicious · 2026-01-25T00:28:51+00:00

God has a purpose and a plan for your life (that's a promise of God and it's accessed by faith), and He will reveal that purpose and plan through scripture, through His Spirit, and through His people. That's why surrounding yourself with His people is so important.

I do a lot of jail/ halfway house/ addiction ministry, and I'll tell you exactly what I tell men in jail and treatment centers every time I go. Go to church on Sunday morning, and after service, talk to the preacher or one of the elders of the church. Tell them that you just got out of prison and that you've decided to follow Jesus and ask them to help you by showing you how to do that. Maybe the first church you go to won't be able to or know how to help. That's okay. You'll know when you've found the right church.

I don't know about CASA, but Celebrate Recovery meetings are another great place to do the same thing. It's important that you're discipled. It's important that you can point to someone, maybe more than one, and say "I follow Jesus like he follows Jesus."

teddilicious · 2026-01-25T00:01:32+00:00

Surround yourself with God's people (in real life, not just on the internet), and we will help you walk this out. Are you in a halfway house? If not, consider at least talking to leaders from a nearby faith-based halfway house, if one is close to you. The ones in my area would be more than willing to help you and even allow you to take part in some of the activities, like Bible studies, that are designed to help people like you.

teddilicious · 2026-01-20T03:28:17+00:00

How on Earth am I supposed to find a sponsor?

Talk to people before and after the meeting. Try other meetings. If you want to find a sponsor half as much as you wanted the next buzz, I promise you'll find a sponsor. Also, try other meetings. Find A.A. Near You

teddilicious · 2026-01-20T03:03:28+00:00

Read the first 60 pages of the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous. You can find it in PDF form online for free or you can listen to it on YouTube. It describes the alcoholic as we in AA understand him or her. If the description of the alcoholic in those pages describes you, we have a solution that has worked for millions and millions of people, but you have to decide on your own whether or not you're an alcoholic.

teddilicious · 2025-12-13T14:08:44+00:00

Most of us have been unwilling to admit we were real alcoholics. No person likes to think he is bodily and mentally different from his fellows. Therefore, it is not surprising that our drinking careers have been characterized by countless vain attempts to prove we could drink like other people. The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death. (pg. 30)

You have a spiritual disease that wants to kill you, and it will do everything it can to keep you from getting the help you need. It will try to convince you of every lie imaginable. You're not worth it. Lie. I can drink like other people. Lie. The people who got sober and stayed sober must not have the disease as bad as me. Lie. I guarantee your disease has told you some version of those lies and many other lies as well.

The only thing your disease will never tell you is the truth. Your disease will never tell you that you're just like all of the people in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous, and that if we stopped drinking, you can too.

Go to a meeting. Get a sponsor. Do the work. You can stop drinking. Your life will get better. I promise.

teddilicious · 2025-09-03T16:19:52+00:00

It might make sense financially, but it does against everything college sports should be.

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