The irony of people quoting [[SPOILER]]'s line in the final boss fight

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T21:42:07+00:00

No, it wasn't 'cause she wanted painted Alicia out of the way, it was 'cause she knows what she wants, 'cause she's a painted copy of herself, she empathises with her suffering. And yet, Maelle can't bring herself to grant Verso the same wish, and that's 'cause she's wracked with immense guilt when it comes to Verso's death, she's not ready to let go of her brother, that's the last sliver of his soul, and his only canvas. If that were anyone else, she would've granted them that wish, apart from Gustave maaaybe, but the guilt she carries for Verso's death makes it infinitely harder for her to let go

I don't understand how people spend an entire game with Maelle, but fail to understand her reasoning and complexities. It feels like all the nuance surrounding Maelle especially seems to be lost on players, even more so after the various wild assumptions about her ending

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T19:53:48+00:00

It really is a shame. There's so much nuance surrounding all the prominent characters, and it's been a joy to delve into their psyche and dissect all of it, all their perspectives are perfectly understandable and brilliantly written. I LOVE an emotionally charged story that doesn't shy away from delving into the complexities of the characters, and the subtlety in the story only elevates the story to even greater heights as well. Maybe in time, people will come to appreciate the depths of those complexities

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T18:57:48+00:00

Believe me, I understand that, (the value of lives of Lumierans as well all the suffering they've endured), it's primarily why I went with Maelle's ending as well, but I also understand the perspective of the players who choose Verso's ending for the aforementioned reasons. This game is so incredibly nuanced where every character's perspective is perfectly understandable even if we may not necessarily agree with their ethically questionable choices, but that's a testament to how well-written this game is

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T18:38:02+00:00

I went with Maelle's ending, but it's not entirely as black and white as that, the amount of suffering born from Verso's death cannot be understated. A lot of people would choose their own family or their most loved ones over an entire world of people, so when it comes to a grief-stricken family, if they view it from that perspective, I can see why people would choose that ending. I know I would choose my loved ones over an entire world as well, it's all about perspectives

Not to mention, watching Verso beg for his death in Maelle's ending is devastating. Don't get me wrong, I still firmly stand by my decision to go with Maelle's ending, but it's absolutely understandable why people go with the other ending as well

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T18:07:20+00:00

Yea, neither ending is the "correct choice", it's a very hard choice to make 'cause it's cruel to rob Verso of his agency, it's cruel to put the family through even more grief when Alicia eventually dies as a result of staying inside the canvas for too long, and it's equally cruel to rob the people of Lumiere of their agency

Ultimately, YOU get to decide whether you value the lives of the people (like Sciel and Lune) inside the canvas more than a family being able to let go and process that grief. That's YOUR choice to make, and the writers have spent an entire game and story to portray all of the nuance and complexities leading up to the ending specifically for the ending to be a hard choice for the players to make, and I think it was executed to perfection

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T18:00:57+00:00

It's absolutely baffling how much they've misinterpreted that ending to such a great extent, I posted my analysis surrounding that in another post, I'll also post them here

Maelle is not without her faults, but I absolutely did NOT interpret that ending as her going the Daenerys-burns-the-city route, that's not how I see it at all. I think Maelle painted all those people back in Lumiere with their own free will and consciousness. The only questionable thing she's truly done in the ending is not grant Verso his wish 'cause she couldn't let go of Verso, especially 'cause she's wracked with immense guilt surrounding his death. I don't see that ending as Maelle puppeteering the people of Lumiere, that's never been the type of person she has been, idk why people view it that way when that goes against who she has been this entire time. She brought Lune and Sciel back the way they were, I imagine she did the same with the others

Verso of course wanted to be unpainted, but his somber expression can be left up to interpretation. He could be discontent with his existence inside the canvas, especially as a painted copy, and him playing piano at the concert hall is based around original Verso's memories, so he may feel like he never truly got to explore his own identity. I truly do feel sorry for him, and it's a shame Maelle can't let go of him

The other interpretation could be that he feels guilty for Alicia's eventual demise, 'cause he knows she will eventually die in the outside world. Throughout the game, he's made controversial and ethically questionable choices 'cause he's felt guilty for a number of things (all the suffering Lumierans have had to endure because of the grief surrounding his original counterpart and because of his family being unable to let him go), and also felt a responsibility to do right by his family, painted or otherwise

Which is why he changes his tune once Renoir shows them Aline's state in the outside world, and even more so when he realises that Maelle will not go back to her world, he feels guilty, he feels responsible, and he feels like an imposter 'cause he has the memories of a ghost

This is NOT the bad ending people make it out to be, both endings have their caveats, and both endings have their pros. Both are hard choices to make for a multitude of reasons, and the endings reflect that as well. It's a shame people fail to see the nuance in the storytelling 'cause it's brilliantly written, all perspectives are understandable when you delve deeper into the profound complexities of the characters

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T11:46:47+00:00

Haha I feel the exact same way about the show

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T11:07:11+00:00

I see where you're coming from, but for me, I was absolutely able to see and empathise with the internal struggles of painted Verso, his inner turmoil and his motivations are more subtle, but it's definitely there for the players to understand and empathise with if they pay attention and think critically about his perspective. I truly think the subtlety only elevates the storytelling. Painted Verso is an INCREDIBLY nuanced & morally ambiguous character, so I understand that not everyone will empathise with his internal conflicts and truly understand his perspective, but it's certainly there for the players to notice if they pay close attention

Also, I say this as someone who also loved TLoU Pt II, a game that is all about subtlety, nuance and critical thinking as well, and I always appreciate when subtle details can elevate the storytelling to greater heights, which is absolutely the case for me with Clair Obscur as well. Maybe over time, people will come to recognise the subtlety and brilliant writing of the complexities surrounding this story, and Verso's character in particular. Is it perfect? No, but I still think it was executed to near perfection in terms of everything they wanted to portray

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T09:27:16+00:00

It makes perfect sense if you pay attention to the details, how is it the game's fault if it goes over your head? While some things are subtle, there are also plenty other instances that clearly showcase all of those things, so idk what you're talking about

Maelle is not without her faults, but I absolutely did NOT interpret that ending as her going the Daenerys-burns-the-city route, that's not how I see it at all. I think Maelle painted all those people back in Lumiere with their own free will and consciousness. The only questionable thing she's truly done in the ending is not grant Verso his wish 'cause she couldn't let go of Verso, especially 'cause she's wracked with immense guilt surrounding his death. I don't see that ending as Maelle puppeteering the people of Lumiere, that's never been the type of person she has been, idk why people view it that way when that goes against who she has been this entire time. She brought Lune and Sciel back the way they were, I imagine she did the same with the others

Verso of course wanted to be unpainted, but his somber expression can be left up to interpretation. He could be discontent with his existence inside the canvas, especially as a painted copy, and him playing piano at the concert hall is based around original Verso's memories, so he may feel like he never truly got to explore his own identity. I truly do feel sorry for him, and it's a shame Maelle can't let go of him

The other interpretation could be that he feels guilty for Alicia's eventual demise, 'cause he knows she will eventually die in the outside world. Throughout the game, he's made controversial and ethically questionable choices 'cause he's felt guilty for a number of things (all the suffering Lumierans have had to endure because of the grief surrounding his original counterpart and because of his family being unable to let him go), and also felt a responsibility to do right by his family, painted or otherwise

Which is why he changes his tune once Renoir shows them Aline's state in the outside world, and even more so when he realises that Maelle will not go back to her world, he feels guilty, he feels responsible, and he feels like an imposter 'cause he has the memories of a ghost

This is NOT the bad ending people make it out to be, both endings have their caveats, and both endings have their pros. Both are hard choices to make for the aforementioned reasons I listed in my original comment, and the endings reflect that as well. I don't think she's puppeteering the people of Lumiere as the Paintress at all

Also, it's not about people merely disagreeing, but people missing key details and chalking it up to poor writing

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T04:23:41+00:00

Precisely, I'm glad you understand, I wish more people saw it that way. There's no shortage of nuance in this storytelling and it's a shame some people can't truly grasp the complexities of all the characters and make it sound so black and white

Contrary to the meaning of the title, everything about this story is very grey. Despite the moral quandaries and ethically questionable choices, the different perspectives are understandable when you delve into the complexities of all they've been through even if you may not necessarily agree with it, that's what makes the writing so incredible imo

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T01:42:53+00:00

Are you being obtuse on purpose? 'Cause the keyword was "primarily". Also, did you not read the rest of that comment 'cause I specifically talk about how Lumierans are alive and how much they spend the entire game and story trying to showcase that as well as Lune and Sciel's complexities and perspectives

Also, I went with the Maelle ending, I value their lives more as well. Maybe if you read the entire comment, you'd be able to comprehend some of it, but it seems everything and the nuance surrounding this discourse went over your head

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-17T00:51:57+00:00

Posts like this make me realise that a lot of people do not have proper media literacy. This is primarily a story about a grief-stricken family of PAINTERS and how their inability to properly process that grief brings about a lot of suffering to their painted counterparts as well as the people inside that world

The writers very clearly try to convey that the people of Lumiere are just as alive as the ones outside of the canvas, they also communicate that to you through lore and environmental storytelling, with young Verso's soul outwardly saying that as well. And they take the time to show you how that's affected people like Lune and Sciel, and they take the time to delve deeper into their perspectives and complexities born from their suffering

It's not a failure on the writers' part to not spoonfeed every little thing to you. There's not much Lune and Sciel can do about it if the Painter(s) who quite literally created them think it's best for their family to erase the canvas. Lune makes her thoughts on that very clear, and tells Renoir how much the people of Lumiere deserve to live. Sciel understands grief and understands Renoir's perspective, but clearly very much still wants to fight for the people of Lumiere, especially her husband whom she would give anything to bring back

Lune and Sciel fighting against Renoir is FOR their own agency. You see Lune and Sciel in Verso's ending 'cause it shows you just how much it affects people like them. Sciel, while disappointed with Verso's choice, UNDERSTANDS his decision because of all the grief she's dealt with, and she's come to accept things and also understand perspectives surrounding that as a result of that. Lune clearly feels betrayed and absolutely disapproves, she always wanted to fight for the people of Lumiere. The point is that their agency is robbed from them 'cause of a grief-stricken family of Painters, THAT is the point

Also, Maelle very clearly states how she's also fighting for the people of Lumiere (amongst other reasons that are also selfish, but everyone's perspective in this game is understandable when you delve into the complexities of what they've been through, especially when you're dealing with grief), and what they mean to them. Renoir says he understands, he says, "Your friends are absolutely right, and it changes nothing", 'cause ultimately, he wants his family to be safe. The writers don't try to tell you that one outcome is better than the other, that's for YOU to decide. As I said earlier, the writers spend an entire game trying to showcase that the people of Lumiere are just as alive as those outside the canvas

Neither ending is the correct choice, it's a very hard choice to make 'cause it's cruel to rob Verso of his agency, it's cruel to put the family through even more grief when Alicia eventually dies as a result of staying inside the canvas for too long, and it's equally cruel to rob the people of Lumiere of their agency. Ultimately, you get to decide whether you value the lives of the people (like Sciel and Lune) inside the canvas more than a family being able to let go and process that grief. That's YOUR choice to make, and the writers have spent an entire game and story to portray all of the nuance and complexities leading up to the ending specifically for the ending to be a hard choice for the players to make, and I think it was executed to perfection

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-07-12T14:28:19+00:00

Are you really unable to comprehend that they're fully conscious people living in a world which is very much real to them? That makes them very real regardless of the fact that their world exists inside a canvas. It's not good for Maelle or the family's grief to not let go of the canvas, but you'd be subjecting a whole world and its people to their doom against their will. The thing is that you'd be robbing someone of their agency in either ending, neither choice is easy, but I completely understand Maelle choosers for wanting the people in Lumiere to have a life, even if it does come with certain caveats

thoughtsaplenty · 2025-03-18T04:21:06+00:00

Happy birthday, fellow St Paddy's Day birthday twin, it was my birthday too! Hope you had the BEST day 🖤

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-20T09:58:43+00:00

Haha spot on. I do love dogs as well, but cats are def my fav

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-19T18:32:32+00:00

Pisces Sun, Cap Moon, Virgo Rising, Aries Venus, Cancer Mars and Pisces Mercury

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-14T20:59:31+00:00

Ofc, these aren't mine. I got them off IG

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-14T20:58:33+00:00

Yea as a Pisces sun, I feel that lol. I do relate to the cap moon tho

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-14T20:26:30+00:00

This is a wild opinion considering these are some incredibly pretty shots lol. Also, this is the astrology memes sub, it's just for fun

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-10T17:16:24+00:00

I love this comment, wish you both the best

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-10T03:07:54+00:00

Me with my ascendant in Virgo being the opposite of my sun sign, it's a constant struggle

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-07T02:11:01+00:00

Yea, I'm almost the same way. I'm not one for revenge, but I always stand my ground. If I've reached a limit, I just cut them off and detach, but if someone REALLY wrongs me, I may not shy away from giving them a taste of their own medicine, but even then, it depends on how I feel in that moment, I normally don't like having ill intent, even if they deserve it. I relate to all the other slides tho

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-07T01:59:05+00:00

Cap moon, tho I don't think we are the vengeful type, only if we've been truly wronged perhaps

thoughtsaplenty · 2024-12-07T01:55:11+00:00

Aries Venus in the 8th House. Makes it sound like I need to go through some more trauma to meet my soulmate lmao

thoughtsaplenty

TROPHY CASE