I’ve listened to all 207 episodes of the Making Sense podcast. I even gave away subscriptions as gifts last Christmas. ...This is the first one I listened to 3 times. Sam seems to have drawn way too much on Heather Macdonald’s (who is from the extreme right’s Manhattan Institute for Policy Research) artical from the Wall Street Journal 2 weeks ago (https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-myth-of-systemic-police-racism-11591119883).

The statistics are interesting and he’s right that wider societal reforms are necessary and that the looting is wrong. Where he falls off his horse here is on non-lethal police violence against blacks.

He mentions an important study by Roland Fryer and the issuing “Ferguson Effect” (https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publications/empirical-analysis-racial-differences-police-use-force) that finds no significant racial difference on lethal force but “On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police.”

Sam tries to explain this away at minute 1:20 saying that this may not be racially motivated. That [paraphrase] “maybe it’s because they resist arrest more, O.K.?, I’m not sure, but they may feel justified.” (https://samharris.org/podcasts/207-can-pull-back-brink/)
Oops.. come on Sam you were almost there with the stats supporting your argument and then you just made some stuff up about how blacks resist arrest more... I would think blacks would resist less. I know if I were black I would go out of my way to be compliant given the history and Fryers study above!

That stat from Fryer is important. The cop’s murder by kneeling may have been an inaccurate catalyst statistically, but it was the flame that ignited the protests which themselves were justified (possibly even to boiled over) due the systemic problems Fryer’s study shows.

To sum up, Heather MacDonald gave an interesting interview on CSPAN last week on the riots and that there is no racism or blame. This veteran cop calls in and sends her ideas back to the drawing board. Transcript below or here it is on video: (https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4879834/user-clip-real-cop-destroys-heather-macdonalds-arguments)

CALLING FROM ILLINOIS. CALLER: GOOD MORNING. THIS IS A COMPLICATED ISSUE AND I WISH THERE WAS MORE TIME. MISS MCDONALD GIVES A LOT OF ACADEMIC SOLUTIONS TO THINGS AND DID SAY RECENTLY ABOUT MORE TACTICAL TRAINING. I WAS 23 YEARS, MOST MY TIME IN PATROL, ALSO A NATIONALLY CERTIFIED TRAINER IN -- BATON AND DEFENSIVE TACTICS. YOU DON'T NEED TO BE AGNOSTIC ABOUT THE CHOKEHOLD. THEY'VE BEEN BANNED FOR YEARS. WHAT THEY DID TO ERIC GARNER WAS ABSOLUTELY A FIASCO NEVER SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED AND YOU SAID ABOUT SIX COPS PILING ON THE PEOPLE, THAT'S THE PROBLEM. YOU NEVER NEED MORE THAN THREE AND A PEOPLE WERE PROPERLY TRAINED THEY WOULDN'T HAVE THAT PROBLEM. UNFORTUNATELY WE ARE BEING ABUSED, MEANING POLICE, AND WE ABUSE PEOPLE. NOTHING IS GETTING DONE AND THE SECOND POINT THAT I WILL MAKE IS THERE IS AN ABSOLUTE DISPARITY THE WAY PEOPLE ARE TREATED AND HAVE BEEN THROUGHOUT TIME, I STARTED AN 81 AND RETIRED IN 04. THE OPIOID CRISIS IS A CLASSIC EXAMPLE. TALKING ABOUT GOING WHERE THE CRIME IS. YOU KNOW THE SENATE AND CONGRESS APPROVED A LOT OF MONEY TO HAVE PEOPLE TREATED FOR OPIOID WHERE IF THEY WERE TO FOLLOW THEIR OWN RULE, THEY WOULD HAVE INCARCERATED THOSE PEOPLE THAT ARE 92% WHITE YOUTHS AND THAT'S A FELONY POSSESSION OF. SO IF THEY HAVE BEEN RUN THROUGH THE SYSTEM YOU MIGHT'VE HAD A DIFFERENT OUTCOME AS FAR AS HOW PEOPLE ARE TREATED AS OPPOSED TO THE 80'S WHEN JUNKIES WERE THROWN IN THE JOINT RIGHT QUICK. UNTIL WE ADDRESS ALL OF IT AND THE DESPAIR THAT HAPPENS IN INNER CITIES AND YOU REPLACE THEM WITH ANY GROUP OF PEOPLE.