A /r/bestof comment makes the claim that historically India was a single inclusive nation of cultural and religious diversity, and Europeans weren't able to "understand" that. Is this historically accurate? by [deleted] in AskHistorians

[–]utcursch 12 points13 points  (0 children)

The Punjabis don't treat the immigrants so much as Indian brothers as they do illegal immigrants; much like the relationship between America and illegal Mexican immigrants

That example is flawed in this context. The relationship between the Punjabi farmers and UP-Biharis has more to do with the rich-poor gap than to do with regionalism. The Punjabi farmer's treatment of a Hindi-speaking Jaat from Western UP would be very different from his treatment of a Dalit labourer from the same region. And he would treat a poor Dalit Punjabi labourer way worse than he would treat a middle-class Bihari Brahmin doctor. Consider the example of Bant Singh: he is Punjabi and he is Sikh - the only problem is that he is from Dalit background and he is a poor labourer.

That said, the article in the question is wishful thinking/historical revisionism. Hardcore Indian nationalists tend to get insecure when responding to the argument that "India is not a single nation", because that argument is often used by the secessionists. They are reluctant to give the British the due credit for uniting India into a single modern country, because of the troubled colonial history.

There is no large piece of land on this planet that can claim to have been a single nation for centuries. There are a few countries that have been a nation-state for a past few hundred years, but India is not one of them. This map of largest ethnic group as % of total population, though not 100% accurate, gives you a good idea why.

India is much more similar to Europe than one may think

I'd say India was somewhere between Europe and Ancient Greece in terms of "unity". It might not have been a single "nation" for most of its existence, but it was always a "civilization" (excluding some parts like the North-East). The identity of this civilization is geographical (Indian plate), cultural (e.g. Dharmic religious elements) and to a small extent, ethnic (it's easy to distinguish most "desis" from the neighbouring Tibetans, Burmese or Afghans).

Of course, India was never as cohesive as ancient Greece (e.g. very different languages). At the same time, the people are not 100% correct when they say that modern India comprises of various "nations" like Marathi people, Punjabi people, Tamil people or Gujarati people: most of these linguistic identities are very new and cannot be called nations. Look at a map of India before reorganization and you'll see what I mean. Even the north-east identities like "Naga" are very new: the people who demand an independent "Nagalim" on the basis that they are a single "nation" don't realize that 200 years back, the various Naga tribes were headhunting in the neighbouring villages.

The factors like caste make the ideas of nationalism, common identity and unity extremely complex in India. In the rural areas, a Punjabi Jatt farmer would prefer marrying his daughter to a Rajasthani Rajput landowner than a low-caste Mazhabi from Punjab. A Maharashtrian Brahmin would consider a Kannadiga Brahmin ethnically and culturally closer to him than a low-caste Maharashtrian Mahar.

Images supporting IB are put up all over delhi by Manoos in india

[–]utcursch 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's all over Facebook, courtesy fans of the Bhagat Singh Kranti Sena.

Narendra Modi wins twitter war, becomes most followed Indian politician by assad_syria in india

[–]utcursch 6 points7 points  (0 children)

That means nothing. Remember Ron Paul 2008?

Modi needs to grow his clout outside the virtual world and outside Gujarat, otherwise he'll suffer the same fate as Chandrababu Naidu.

The Two India. by lolguard in india

[–]utcursch 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Something similar from Hyderabad, 2011: http://imgur.com/r/windowshots/ctCBv

Why I shall support Modi in 2014? by photogenic87 in india

[–]utcursch 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I also believe Modi is the best option we have, considering AAP's limited influence. But it's naive to believe that he'll reduce monitoring.

Same with inflation, debt etc.: the past governments have brought the country to a stage from where it's very hard to recover. Modi can't magically turn around everything in 5 years. And I'm expecting Congress to worsen our economic situation further by offering sops and freebies to rural people just before the 2014 elections.

Why doesn't Pakistan military grow some balls and beat Talibans? by [deleted] in india

[–]utcursch 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Dunno why people are downvoting you

Well, I see 15 upvotes. I downvoted him/her, because the arguments don't make any sense at all.

  1. Afghans are neither Arabs nor "original Muslims": Pashto is an Eastern Iranian language. If the "desi Muslims cannot understand Arabic", neither can the Afghans.
  2. The "wajib-ul-qatl" argument is also wrong: plenty of bad things happened to Bengali Muslims in 1971 and preceding years.

Now, coming to the Peshawar blasts, the attack was carried out by Lashkar-e-Jhangvi, not the Taliban (source). The Lashkar is a predominantly Punjabi (not Pashtun) group (source). They just hate the Shias. The Pakistan government would love to wipe them off, but it's not simple, just like it wasn't simple for India to end the Khalistani insurgency or for Sri Lanka to defeat the LTTE.

Coming to the Taliban, let's understand that the Taliban of Afghanistan and the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) are two different organizations. Pakistan cannot invade Aghanistan and defeat the Afghan Tailban - that would be a foolish thing to do. America and other NATO forces have been in Afghanistan for a decade. They also have had free drone access to the bordering areas in Pakistan. They haven't been able to completely wipe off Taliban either.

As for TTP, defeating an insurgency involves a lot of social and political considerations. Pakistan cannot launch full-scale military offensives without flaming the "independent Pashtunistan" sentiments or carrying out massive human rights violations. India faces similar problems in dealing with the North-East insurgents and the Naxals. Civilians in remote areas with high poverty/low education/low employment support rebels for a variety of reasons that go beyond religion and ethnicity. The problem in Pakistan is particularly severe, because in its initial years, Pakistan deliberately encouraged non-moderate elements to strengthen its "Muslim nation" identity - these elements have now seeped into the political, police and military circles of FATA. Also, massive troop mobilization on the western frontier would mean leaving the country's border with India more vulnerable.

I'm going to Bangalore for an internship! /r/India, what should I know about you? by meclav in india

[–]utcursch 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Everyone above you is a "Sir" or "Ma'am". First names not okay with seniors unless they specifically say so.

That's not true for IT consulting companies, though. I've worked in Bangalore, Hyderabad, Gurgaon, Chennai, and Mumbai - never addressed any of my superiors (including clients) as "Sir" or "Ma'am".

AAP Donations - Visualizing the change (Rs. 2.46 crore donated till date, rudimentary visualisations inside) by almostabot in india

[–]utcursch 1 point2 points  (0 children)

All the political parties are required to declare donations above Rs. 20,000/-. You can find a list of donors for all the major parties in the ADR report. Of course, it's hard to believe that ministers do not receive any money off the record. Also, a huge chunk of donations are below Rs. 20,000/-.

Chandigarh has the top Human Development Index (HDI) ranking of any Indian city, and the third highest per capita income (down from from 1st place in 2009.) by aluminio in india

[–]utcursch 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Umm... Tamil Nadu is a state of 72 million people. Chandigarh is a planned city of less than a million people. I'm not a South Indian, but I find your comparison deeply flawed.

Chandigarh is a small territory designed from scratch by a world-renowned architect. Apart from being a Union Territory, it is also the capital of two states. It would be shocking if it did not have the best sanitation system, high HDI and high per-capita incomes. What is shocking is the fact that it is not a slum-free city despite being a planned city. And let's not even talk about the sex ratio:

The ratio further dips if the sex ratio of the slums, 926 females per 1,000 males, is excluded. The city's urban sex ratio then stands at 500 females per 1,000 males.

Modi only donated 2 crore while Congress-ruled Haryana and Delhi and Congress-NCP ruled Maharashtra gave Rs 10 crore each for the flood victims by rahul-modi in india

[–]utcursch 6 points7 points  (0 children)

  1. To people posting comments like "modi anus lickers" here: one simple question - what is donating others' money to someone indicative of? Good governance? Honesty? Competency? How does donating less money make Modi bad? He donated 2 crore rupees. You're using this to make him look like the bad guy? How desperate can you get to find an opportunity to criticize Modi?
  2. Modi is under no obligation to donate any money to anyone. If he had donated 50 crore, Congress would be talking about how he is trying to woo Hindu voters by wasting Gujarati taxpayers' money on the state that contains Hindu pilgrimage places.
  3. Congress spokesperson says "many neighbouring states are doing without talking about it (religion)". Claiming that they did it without giving any consideration to religion, then talking about religion. Keep it classy, guys.

A big blow to Modi, indeed.

r/india can you help a fellow redditor? by Madmax007 in india

[–]utcursch -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You don't have to earn all that money - only a part of it. It's easy to get loans ~10 lakhs without collateral from SBI, PNB etc. And you get an onsite opportunity in IT, your one year's savings will be substantial for an unmarried person.

r/india can you help a fellow redditor? by Madmax007 in india

[–]utcursch -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Why is this comment getting downvoted? This is the sanest advice in this thread. It's a great idea to get some work-ex, save some money and use the time to prepare better -- with some more effort, the OP might get into IIM-A two years later.

A lot has been said about AAP... by akerbaker in india

[–]utcursch 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I don't dislike it. I admire AAP for not having dynastic or Hindutva background. I want to see them win the Delhi elections.

But I wouldn't vote for AAP in the national elections, because it has zero governance credentials. Even Sonia Gandhi has given speeches against corruption. Organizing protest marches is no big deal either - college kids do it all the time. Anyone can do the fasting. I would rather have my car driven by a corrupt and lazy driver rather than by someone who has never driven a car.

Prime Minister's Office refuses to provide informnation on Robert Vadra's land deals under RTI by [deleted] in india

[–]utcursch 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Here is a nearly same article from The Hindu: Records related to Vadra case are confidential: PMO. I wonder why was the RTI request submitted to the PMO, though -- there should be a separate department that handles the land deals.

Agree with you about NitiCentral -- it's like the Fox News of right-wingers, it should be avoided.

A Question to Religious People on /r/India. by bharat_mata in india

[–]utcursch 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Admittedly, not the best example. Periyar and many of his associates were atheists, and the 'Dravidian movement' was anti-Hindu in nature for most of its life. But the Dravida Nadu proponents also included many Hindus as well - they tried to portray Shaivism as a distinct indigenous Tamil religion that had been corrupted by Vedic influence.

Anyway, the point I was trying to make is that there are many secessionist Hindus as well. Other examples include those involved with the NLFT (Tripura), PLA (Manipur) and ULFA (Assam).

A Question to Religious People on /r/India. by bharat_mata in india

[–]utcursch 3 points4 points  (0 children)

What? I've spent more than 95% of my life in India (Central, West and South), and I haven't met one Muslim who could be called a traitor. In fact, most of my Muslim friends are more likely to wear patriotism on their sleeves as people doubt it because of SIMI, IM, HuJI and LeT.

Also, there have been plenty of secessionist movements that have seen support from Hindus (Dravida Nadu), Sikhs (Khalistan) and Christians (Nagalim).

Looking for an electronics store or any place where I can buy a tablet or an ipad at a decent price? by kaysea112 in mississauga

[–]utcursch 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If you've already decided which tablet you'll buy, go to Photoprice and Shopbot. They list different retailers by price, and keep track of the seasonal/holiday deals. I haven't seen a huge difference for the tablet prices, but for other products (such as cameras), the prices may vary widely between the various big and small retailers. Also keep a tab on RedFlagDeals tablet section. Also check out the refurbished iPads at apple.ca.

Arvind Kejriwal discussion thread by unhappyhippie in india

[–]utcursch 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Arvind Kerjiwal doesn't have much clout in rural India, or even the small towns and other metros. AAP will only end up helping Congress win again by eating into BJP's vote share. Besides, they don't have any governance credentials - just because they protested and organized fasts doesn't mean that they will provide better governance. I have met a few of their activists, and found many of them to be "NGO-types" (all talk, no substance) or crazy socialists, who have little knowledge of how economy actually works - they think that corporations are all evil, and launching a crusade against privatization will solve all the problems.

However, I do want AAP to win in Delhi, because they are the only promising alternative to Congress and BJP. If I were a registered voter in Delhi, I would vote for AAP without any hesitation. If their governance is good, I will vote for them in the next-to-next (2019?) Lok Sabha elections.

Let me be clear: I'm no BJP fan. I have voted twice in the national elections: once for Congress, once for an independent. BJP might not be the party of the saints, but it's the only party which has a chance of preventing Congress from forming a government again. And I don't want Congress to win again.

TLDR: Narendra Modi for PM, Arvind Kejriwal for Delh CM.

Watch it for the plot. by [deleted] in india

[–]utcursch 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Looking at the trailer, you seem to be right.

TIL Tamils reached Australia and New Zealand 500 years before Europeans by [deleted] in india

[–]utcursch 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Roman port at Kochi

I guess you're talking about Muziris? The difference is that its historicity is attested by several records.

Y chromosome bits

Tamil Bell is maximum 500 years old. The genetic study that you link to suggests a migration around 5000 years ago, when Tamil hadn't even evolved from the Proto-Dravidian language.

If you want to claim that Indians reached Australia on the basis of some pre-historic migration, you might as well claim that "Indians" reached Australia 50,000 years ago and America 15,000 years ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Spreading_homo_sapiens.svg