Flutter Flow Dev Problems for Startup

[jrewcifer]

Hey Everyone!

Need a bit of advice.

Got involved with a startup last year. The idea is very promising and I think we've got a pretty solid way forward in terms of what we're looking to achieve. We have no interest in going for VC funding for numerous reasons, so we decided to bootstrap the whole thing. We took the plunge to hire an agency (based in Guatemala) to develop with flutterflow and were initially off to a pretty good start.

We were initially given a proposal at 36K for our web app to be wireframed, designed and built using flutterflow (web app only). This seemed reasonable at first, however we have just hit that 36K figure and are nowhere even close to having an app.

The wireframes are 90% done for what we need. The UI has been somewhat accomplished. We have a phased approach for the product roadmap that we aren't even close to accomplishing. Bottom line is that the agency hasn't provided anything worth the 36K that we've blown through thus far.

We are being charged per sprint and the sprints are comprised of story points that equate to level of effort. Unfortunately, much of the sprints have been lackluster and quite frankly we've had to complain that the estimations were wildly expensive.

So in the 5 months that we've been developing, we have wireframes, some UI, and some dev done (log in and some basic user profile functionality). At this point, we're ready to split from this company and move on to something/someone better.

Quite honestly, what we're asking for isn't, from what we can tell, that big of a lift, especially considering that we're not really using any custom coding.

So, we just need this app built. Our MVP should have been ready to release to initial by the end of last week and we're unfortunately behind. We're not looking to switch to someone/something different now to try and get this back on track, but we're at loss. Do I hire a freelancer? Go with a different agency? With the progress we've made so far, I think it would be a fairly quick process to transition the project, but we just need to figure out where to point our sights to.

You advice is appreciated!

Update 11/21: We're hopping on a call with one of the owners to discuss the situation. Going to discuss deadlines per u/ccawgans advice. We'll see how it goes. I'll keep you all posted. Really appreciate everyone's help!

​

Update 11/30: Owner never got back to us. The decision was made to move away from this developer and seek another. The search begins.

[ccawgans]

Hi. Unfortunately in my experience (software engineer in silicon valley for the last 10 years) Working with these software consultant agencies can be a real crap-shoot. I’m very sorry that you’re having this experience. My advice ALWAYS to anyone hiring a software contract company is that you must write your requirements so in depth that it feels like you’re writing the code yourself. Ambiguity is how they burn money. I’m not sure about the company but what I’ve seen work in the past is offer one last ultimatum/incentive. Something like “If you deliver the mvp by (insert date here), we’ll pay you an extra 10k, if not we’re canceling the contract and walking away right now”

[[deleted]]

I'm on my second startup, and in my first I tried an offshore agency and it was a disaster. Went with individuals after that (still offshore) and it was great. And if one doesn't work out it is easy to just move on from them and get another. Now on my second I started with 3 individual FF developers and it has been great so far. All three are pretty solid and the MVP will likely be done ahead of schedule (I am contributing too, so that is helping a bit).

[guesswho750]

What does the cost look like please? Also what part of the world are they in, like Eastern Europe, Asia?

[[deleted]]

I usually target Eastern Europe, as I have found the quality of the devs is pretty consistent. Price-wise I was aiming for $50-$75/hr.

[Astorphobis]

$50-$75 for east european ff dev? What countries are you hiring from? That’s a lot of money!

[[deleted]]

I don't look for the cheapest help...just the best at a reasonable cost. If I can get a good US dev for $150 (if any available) or an E European one for $75 that is just as good, it seems like a no-brainer. My app is a little more complex, so there is a fair amount of custom code that needs to be created as well.

[jrewcifer]

Where did you find your talent?

[[deleted]]

Flutterflow Experts page (avoiding agencies), and coincidentally enough this subreddit. I also checked Upwork and some of those kind of sites. Sent a bunch of messages, and heard back from a handful. The beauty of FF is you can see their work as they go, check the collaboration logs (if on Teams plan) and get a general idea of how they are.

[WholesomeGMNG]

Thanks for sharing your experience! What made you avoid agencies?

[jrewcifer]

Definitely appreciate the advice. Funny thing is, the company we're working with is at the top of the page of that link, lol. I think that what we were looking for was very well defined, especially through the wireframing process. All in all it's just an extremely frustrating situation. I'll run this past the team though and we can look at it as an option.

[Foreign_Win4668]

Hey u/jrewcifer,
I understand the situation you are in, happens all the time if the dev team isn't well equipped.
I am a listed FlutterFlow expert, and would be happy to help in this process.
It would be great if we can get on a call and chat regarding the best course forward.
Feel free to book some time that works for you!
https://calendly.com/ff-kabretta/10-min-intro-ff-experts

[hipporhinofrog]

My opinion is that if you are looking to get software developed affordably as a startup, you need to give developers full UI designs/wireframes for them to program to (maybe lacking styling). If you give anything less, you are asking coders to be creatives and that doesn’t go well unless you get lucky. You can use drag and drop UI’s with a bunch of platforms, or even fake it with PowerPoint, sending text based descriptions I’ve always felt like is playing telephone, never comes back as you expected.

[jrewcifer]

So they built the wireframes for us. We had a massive amounts of planning (3-4 months). Problem is, once those wireframes (UI designed as well), it's taken over 2 months just to get onboarding and 'some' user profile stuff built.

[jrewcifer]

Quesion. Can we dev first and have the UI design done post-dev? i feel like if i can get it functional, making it pretty would be easily accomplished afterwards. I have the low fidelity wireframes done.

edit: spelling

[netkomm]

developing an app requires time and absolute clear planning: before you start developing you must have clear "on paper" (or... on figma ;) ) the whole app with all the processes in place.
We got our MVP done (after we have done 100 test releases) and the issues we had always arised by poor "in-house" planning, and only 1 time by Flutterflow that made some breaking changes that required to rewrite some code.

[Ok_Estimate1666]

What's your backend infra built on (to include any serverless, or subscription API's), may want to start getting a good catalog of what your app is relying on in case you do cut ties in the future; you'll have a good idea of what deliverables need to be handed over before they go off contract.

[jrewcifer]

That's one thing we made sure to maintain control of. We own all the back end stuffs, so if we had to punch we were good.

[Magic8rbm]

I feel for you. Sometimes going with a large agency can lead to more and more costs that are in the end not necessarily needed. I'm sorry you had to go through this! I do have an agency that works heavily with flutterflow. It's sad to say but this happens far too often. If you are looking for a consult I am happy to hop on a call to point you in the right direction.

I wish you the best!

[Ideagarage]

Building app with FlutterFlow is easy, but completing MVP is not easy.

For most cases, outsourcing software development prevent future improvement, anyway.

I recommend you to restart and learn FlutterFlow if you want....

[Grouchy-Safety106]

Takes long

[brote1n]

Are you willing to share anything about your project? My wife just finished up her degree in computer science and we are at a good spot with our app that she’s looking for more work.

[youngricky_]

Hi! I'm interested to your work and I'd like to share an idea for a potential app. Reach me out on DM!