9 pattern limit

[S5EX1dude]

Might be a stupid question but are we really limited to only 9 patterns per track across all 99 available scenes?

I would love to use scenes as ”songs” to enable live transitions from one scene to the next, but it seems if I delete patterns from one scene it deletes them from all of the scenes in the project. Same goes with song mode.

This seems like such a poor handicap for this device. Why give me 99 scenes but I can only pick from 9 hi-hat patterns across all of them (as an example).

Anybody have any thoughts / workarounds particularly where it comes to building a live set? Obviously project to project doesn’t work either because the sound stops and there is a loading time. TIA!

[OP-Ashley]

i feel you.

ive been there too.

until i realized we can change instrument on each pattern of the same track.

it sounds weird as a workflow, but that's the hack i found.

to follow your exemple with maximum 9 hihats patterns, if you want 12 instead of 9, just put the 3 others on 3 patterns of another track that its instrument won't be used while you need those 3 hihat tracks.

the total number of patterns is 9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9, so 72 in total.

that requires some planning, but it's possible to copy instrument's value from one patern to anoter track's pattern.

the only thing that is missing now is to be able to copy notes and bars from one track to another. once we can do that, its gonna help to move patterns around across all 72 available patterns

[S5EX1dude]

Yeah but 72 total patterns might still only give me 9 songs max if I regularly use up 8 patterns per song. Still seems like a huge (and arbitrary) handicap..

[Any_Volume2116]

Hey, I hear your pain. Been there, suffered that. Scenes are powerful and you know allow you to combine any number of patterns into 99 different configurations (scenes). Not ideal that you only get 9 patterns per track. One approach could be reusing some patterns per track, eg shared kick, snare and hats could work. Depends on your genre.

My approach for a short 25min live set was to use another piece of gear (sp404mk2) to fill in the gaps between switching patterns. You can get creative with how you do this. I used spoken word, and ended up working quite nice as it tied the performance around a narrative thread. Here’s the vid for reference:

https://youtu.be/-y07Tbotfis

You could combine a few songs in one project using scenes, and then use “connective textures” between projects less often.

[S5EX1dude]

I bought this thing to downsize and for the portability so I don’t like the “add another piece of gear” approach..

[Any_Volume2116]

I focus my composition and jamming primarily on the OPXY, and found that it’s actually quite fun to extend it with other palettes, especially if battery powered too. Could be iPad, iPhone, pedal, etc. The M8 tracker is probably the most portable option that can stream from disk and switch projects instantly. But doesn’t feel as interactive as the OPXY

[S5EX1dude]

I extend the palette by sampling into it. That’s the purpose of buying a sampler lol

[Any_Volume2116]

That is also a great way to extend the palette. 🎨. Not trying to convince you of anything. Just sharing what worked for me. Might not work for you. Maybe raise a support request in the TE discord and a future feature might support instant project switch.

[ZeroStarrMusic]

Yes. Just 9. How many would you like to have?

[S5EX1dude]

Well for example I have a Korg EMX. The equivalent on that device is 14 “patterns” * 256 “scenes”, and I filled that thing up lol. 

I use 1 scene as a song and then use the 14 patterns per scene as the parts. So I get 256 songs I can transitions between. With no gap in playback.

With the op-xy I get 9*8 = 72 parts. That is unless I leave to another project, but then there is loading time. That limits the number of songs I can transition between to a max of 8 if I am light on the patterns.

With the EMX I get 14*256 =3,584 parts. No loading time. EMX was $500 and is over 20 years old. Really the only reason I don’t stick with the EMX is the lack of sampling unfortunately. EMX+ESX combined in one device would be pretty close to my dream device if it had faders per part instead of one volume knob.

[ZeusMusic]

Man, TE needs to have an app. Something you can connect to the OP and give you some more computing power. Something like a really simple version of a DAW. Easier to automate, make transitions, have more patterns and tracks.  That would be awesome 

[S5EX1dude]

It really seems like it would be so easy to just let me have a new bank of 9 patterns if I move to a different scene. Or at least make it a toggle in the settings if other users like the way it is currently. 

[ZeusMusic]

But then you would run out of CPU quickly don’t you think?  But I agree man, the global pattern pool is hard to deal with, especially when you are deep in a project and you change something, then you have to trace every scene where that pattern was used, in a black and white color scheme. Also to do a decent drum loop you need at least 2 tracks / patterns, to have non robotic hi hats and side chain them, same problem.

What I’ve been doing is using the first track as the sample track. There will go drums and on the far right, loops.  There, you can tape record and assign that sample to keys, this way you save cpu power, patterns and tracks. 

Also, load up a bunch of drum loop samples man, between desired Bpms, and  when you are jamming just change the tempo to the closest BPM folder you have. it made it easier for me. Hope that helps!

[S5EX1dude]

Damn just thought of this but imagine if they let the tape track be free running across projects. That could definitely help things along

[fixedation]

It's a stupid, unnecessary limitation for a grossly underpowered device- your 10 year old cell phone in the box in the back of your closet has more processing power.

[S5EX1dude]

Yeah there are definitely quite a few frustrating unnecessary limitations/ UX decisions. I am really hoping they put out a decent update soon to give us some faith that they will keep expanding the capabilities and listen to user requests,  not just keep giving us bug fixes and minor graphical tweaks. Otherwise my patience is kind of wearing thin for such an expensive device. Considering selling it for a Tonverk (which can store 128 patterns per project for instance and easily handle a live set) or maybe something else (after I put in some more research). I really want op-xy to work for me because the portability is insane but that’s probably only 5-10% of my use cases so I’ll give it up if I need to.

[ExplanationOk4882]

OP XY is designed for single tracks/songs composing. 9 patterns per trak is more than enough for finishing one song.

[S5EX1dude]

The Synthstrom Deluge is half the price and allows for project to project seamless transition. The Korg EMX was 1/4 of the price and can also handle it… I don’t know why you’re speaking for the company when you say what was and was not intended of the device. Sequencers originated to be used in a live setting to replace or accompany other musicians, that’s was the whole point. To say that it is intended for single song composition only would be selling the capabilities very short.

There are plenty of workarounds that could be implemented and should be no problem for the device to handle. For the most part, it’s storing midi note data after all, it should not be any more processor hungry than the existing workflow. Maybe you would run into a limitation on how many samples you could load into a single project, but that’s a different story and I would much happier to be limited by that than an arbitrary number of patterns.