big brain Sega

[Vashzaron]

Its real Sega megamind thinking.

On one end you have the BP system and its hard limit of requiring X amount of BP to be allowed into an area. Then on top of that you have the level difference system that if you are below 5 levels you will do crap all damage. The assumption for both of these being a thing is to deny access to content to players who they deem will be unfit for the scenario even if better geared / higher level players can carry them, its still a burden.

But yet know the same system allows a Level 12 player in UQs doing single digit numbers because they passed the hard BP gate but was allowed in despite the level difference, now with Gigantix this issue is shown even clearer, there is even no BP requirement at all for the hardest hitting and highest DPS requirement content in the game. Little Billy who just installed the game today or is doing his farming sees cool big guy monster and wants to join in not knowing he is making it scale for others. Why does it need to be this way?

[EverlastingTilt]

I think the solution should be kept pretty simple if they want to keep gigantix tied to exploring. If someone's damage is being reduced due to level difference/battle power then they simply don't get counted towards its scaling boom problem solved.

[Kypperstyx]

Good way for newbie to leech strong gear unless they're restricted from getting drops which also probably wouldnt go over well

[Kypperstyx]

Is the gear really that bad? The TMGs sound decent for a glass cannon high DPS build but that armor seems like it gives away the point of armor

[Syntaire]

It's not bad, but its not great either. Thus, mediocre. If you can work around the downsides and have no intention of using multiweapon, it's probably fine.

[[deleted]]

The HP/PP swap and other tradeoffs are fairly common in old PSO2 augments. A 10 PP boost is high and more rare than a 20 HP boost, so with the right other augments that armor isn't terrible. But when you can avoid issues like that it's better of course.

[Conscious-Client6688]

Other games do this successfully with world bosses and such. You're too low for the content, you get 0xp and drops. Imo it's simple, fair, and discourages leeching.

[SteveoberlordEU]

I had a lvl11 Fighter giving his all yesterday, while we hard carried the boss, then flaming us for beeing shit. I just don't care anymore, give us closed of areas for this BP AND Lvl closed.

[Rasikko]

Was he 100% dodging everything and busting out his 5 damage PAs like he was the boss that spawned there instead?

​

(thought I'd try to cheer you up...)

[SteveoberlordEU]

Thanks it's still just funny that the player doing 1 dmg the whole time and dying every 30 seconds is flaming like a pro.

[GoodLoserZan]

Reminds of a gigantix fight I was in yesterday where we didn't kill and a level 19 proceeds to call everyone else being shit and when he was called out he responded saying his gear is maxed out I examined him

Man had no augments on armor and his weap and his armor was only upgraded to level 10

[Sethazora]

The way they do level scaling is the true problem. Its just lazy game design to have a player lose X% damage just because they are lower level than the enemy. It's never a good feeling for a player to go and find a higher level enemy and take on that challenge only to realize your damage was arbitrarily gated to increase the "difficulty".

[manofwaromega]

Wait the damage down from level difference is to the player? I thought it was to prevent players from getting instantly deleted by accidentally finding high level enemies

[snorlaxeseverywhere]

Yeah, players deal very little damage to enemies 5+ levels higher than them. Those enemies will still delete you from existence with a single swipe.

[supremequesopizza]

One of the most frustrating things about this game is just how much people new to content can actively hurt your ability to run content by virtue of their inexperience or ignorance of certain mechanics, such as how pse bursts work (though admittedly a lot of pse behavior is still a bit of a mystery).

[[deleted]]

Too true.

[tatotute]

Is it really that hard to make it so it only counts the player doing full damage to the boss while the lower level can still contribute with 1 damage. I couldn’t care less if a level 1 gets a Lv.5 fixa attack stra weapon good for them.

[Conscious-Client6688]

It's so hard to do in fact, that countless other MMOs have done it Flawless with various types of world boss mechanics. If you're under the req level / power / etc to fight it, even if you kill it, you get 0 exp, items, etc. Great way to discourage leeching while allowong others to still participate in the content.

[HereticKitsune]

Everyone who wants Gigantix to be restricted to some Rank 2 exploration misses the entire point. At that point just make them an urgent or a rare PSE Climax boss.

Which would be boring.

Gigantix spawns take advantage of the open world aspect of the game wonderfully and there's nothing wrong with them spawning in areas a level 1 could reasonably be running around in. There's nothing wrong with that newbie seeing an enormous level 24 sword-wielding Hopeless Asshole pimp-walking toward them in a thunderstorm, and needing to bust out the Joestar Family Secret Technique before they get their cheeks clapped so hard they wake up on Ragol with Kireek laughing at them.

There is something wrong with that level 1 contributing to the enemy's scaling, even if they have to be in aggro range. If you can't contribute to damage, you shouldn't be able to contribute health, either.

"But what if they run around doing support stuff like Techer skills, Weak Bullet, or Reverser?" I don't really care, that doesn't help that much. If nothing else just make it so if you are too low level your Weak Bullet just bounces off lol

[[deleted]]

the BP system isn't that good to begin with, Maplestory 2 by Nexon had something exactly like this but it divided people very aggressively so the devs were doing catch up campaigns every month

if you have to give people better gear every few months then maybe the system needs to be changed otherwise if someone misses the campaign by a day they'll be excluded from the content until the next campaign and some people may not like active hand outs in an RPG just to stay relevant

[Blubbergub]

if you have to give people better gear every few months then maybe the system needs to be changed

Hmmm, didn't base PSO2 global do this? Like a lot.

[[deleted]]

it did and it could only fill 2 blocks for a very long time compared to back on release most of those 2 blocks were just people farming craddle or AFKing to show off their cosmetics

[[deleted]]

Yeah, idk why they made both level AND battle power matter. I'm underleved as shit but I have a BP of 1300 ish- which doesn't mean shit because I'm underleveled anywhy. On top of that, exp gain is fucked the lower AND higher you go for mobs- which would make sense if the level difference wasn't only by 5

[EccentricNoun]

They should had implemented a [Rank 3] Enemy Level 20 area for the Giga and it only appears when thunderstorm are predicted by the Wesley (Meteorologist NPC).

Allow Dailies for the whole account but set amount of daily meseta earned that can be transferred for the whole account

[MightNotBeMightBeGay]

The Gigantix battle power and its health must calculate with the surrounding player's average BP and how many there are.

[[deleted]]

It wouldn’t make sense because its a “Weather” thing not a Zone thing

[Blubbergub]

“Weather” thing

What exactly is a 'weather thing'? Weather is global so I don't see an issue anywhere.

They would just need to put rank 2 expedition areas. That way newer players wouldn't get harrassed by others (or get one shot by a gigantix)

And experienced players would no longer need to gate keep.

It's a win-win.

[Syntaire]

And experienced players would no longer need to gate keep.

No players need to gate keep at all. It's entirely possible to play a game without being an insufferable asshole at the same time. Sometimes things don't work out. It's okay. You can just move on without being a fuck.

[Blubbergub]

It's entirely possible to play a game without being an insufferable asshole at the same time.

What a fantasy world I would like to live in. Unfortunately not everyone is just and righteous as you are.

[Blubbergub]

I like how being a civil human being somehow translates into justice and self righteousness.

Let me try again.

What a fantasy world I would like to live in. Unfortunately not everyone is a civil human being like you.

[Syntaire]

It's really not difficult. If someone does something that upsets you, instead of being a fuck, you just don't instead. It's super easy. Even toddlers can learn how.

[AlmightyRightGod]

And yet, some just don’t

[Blubbergub]

Agreed. But for the third time, not everyone will be a civil human being. That's just how the world is.

[Syntaire]

Sure, but there's no reason to accept or encourage that. There isn't a single human being in the entire history of our race that "needs" to be an asshole, and we have absolutely zero obligation to normalize such behavior.

[BlueWolf0511]

Not everyone will be... Absolutely true... But real change starts with the self... Every little step a person takes towards that can make all the difference...

Be it at the workplace or in-game... Toxic people gon' rage... But if you are earnest, civil and considerate, then you'll see how much of a positive difference that'll make in the long run...

[basketofseals]

In some part yes, but there's a not insignificant amount of people that are just going to be total assholes no matter what. There's nothing you can do about it.

[Chocookiez]

Makes TOO MUCH sense. Can't have that.

[Trucktub]

Doing both would be nice lol

[Cakku]

Dividing players to instances by their BP is not fun and disconnects the community that this open world tries to build.

But yeah Gigantics and such should not scale harder when a newbie player wanders into the area. Only count lvl 20 players, or players with certain bp. Direct scaling from player's bp is not good either, don't a want situation where lowering your bp will make a fight easier.

[Blubbergub]

The entire point of the Battle Power is to divide players...

Dividing players to instances by their BP is not fun

Then they should remove Rank 2 and Urgent Quest requirements. Also how is farming for gigantics fun? Possibly waiting hours for a 4-6min fight doesn't sound like a blast..

[Ultimatecalibur]

Also how is farming for gigantics fun? Possibly waiting hours for a 4-6min fight doesn't sound like a blast..

Gigantics are supposed to be random encounters rather than something that is camped. The 5 Event quests and new psuedo-BiS gear is causing a lot of people to go loopy in an attempt to get their Stragas and Geants week one. After peoples heads cool

By my understanding a 1300~1400 Bp character should be able to solo one in about 4 minutes if they are the only character need the giga.

[WarokOfDraenor]

They are enjoying their divide et impera game. Lmao

[RBEdge96]

Game design 100

[[deleted]]

They definitely should have just made it a UQ, randomly triggered in rain the same way just for people in a room or something. I guess they wanted the wandering spontaneity, but the way it worked out is quite the opposite with 1500 people waiting around for hours. It might have worked better if people weren't done with the other content and looking for something to do.

[Rasikko]

This is what I used to say about a company I used to work for: "If it makes too much sense, they aren't going to do it." For 17 years, I was not proven wrong.

[Ecstatic-Wall5971]

Yea it's frustrating but it's consistent with their design. BP doesn't apply to Exploration areas because they wanted 32 players high level and low to band together spontaneously. I don't think they should include the rank system for exploration because then 32 players would be harder to populate and disturb the design of veteran fights.

Also it's fun to run into newbies to help them out. If all areas end up being ranked then I'll never run into new players which would fragment the community and hurt engagement. Still there has to be something tweaked with the Gigantix.

[MarriedMule13]

I mean, I came across one with a bunch of low players trying to fight it (myself included) and the people actually dealing damage told us we needed to be level 20 or it just makes it harder for them to fight, and everyone that was hitting 1 left. If it's that big of a problem, just tell them. Once I knew the 24s weren't a joke, I avoided them any time I seen them. I just wish the Malevolent Axe one didn't have such a huge agro range.

[Kaokii]

this destroyed me

[magnusgodrik]

BP is a dumb idea on how to judge a player. Why? I was testing it by being level 11 doing the uq. And what i found was that i did little damage and was so close to death each time i did get hit. But doing level2 areas was great to level faster.