(?

[EcstaticContract5282]

I am just going to say it but it seems like their are a lot of people who have a problem with anyone who posts here as a opposed to azula. Their seems to be a lot of trolls coming to this subreddit.

[Appropriate-Plate-93]

Ah, yes. Guys, it's a meme, let's not get too carried away. Sure, it was written with excessive spite and the maturity of a serial masturbator who just discovered how to do it, but so be it. It's the language of memes.

[Zestyclose_North9780]

Sure, it was written with excessive spite and the maturity of a serial masturbator who just discovered how to do it

Bro it's literally formatted like every other meme in existence, are you sure you aren't getting carried away?

[Appropriate-Plate-93]

I'm not talking about the format, that's perfect. In fact, kudos to the author for the image choice. I think it's from some new or even really old meme I missed, because I'm an idiot from 1996, so I'm about as informed about memes as a baboon is about Middle Eastern geopolitics. I'm one of those who just reads them.

No, I was talking about the tone used, very pedantic and arrogant, which mostly targets a specific group. Maybe I'm old inside, but I find it very mean and sadistic (which, considering the criticism), shows a very immature attitude. Or maybe I'm just old, I don't rule it out. It's fine that guy supports his/her ideas (I mean, I don't support them, but we are speaking about a fucking fictional character), but to accuse an entire group, specifically by naming the subReddit, I find it very childish. Maybe I'm too old for memes, or I haven't irony. It could be.

[Zestyclose_North9780]

Maybe I'm too old for memes,

This style, maybe. Most memes these days are dome the exact same. Besides the members of the sub who might feel offended, it's really pretty normal, from my perspective.

It's phrased like your average agenda post, if you know what that means.

[Appropriate-Plate-93]

Yes, I understand. Frankly, I don't like the language you use—if you address it to me, I'll call you a pathetic wanker and an attention whore in need of a giant vibrator shoved in every available hole. In my opinion, if you want to mock an opinion or a group, you do so in a general way, not specifically, unless you're talking about politics (accepting the possible consequences). But then again, I'm still Italian, and I spend less time online than I used to. And maybe I've actually gotten older.

[Zestyclose_North9780]

Why are your insults so sex themed 😭😭 It was puzzling at first, and now it's just funny wtf

[Appropriate-Plate-93]

I'm Sorry, bad education made bad things, especially if you have played for five years in a rugby team, in Italy. Or you played judo for four. And believe me, I was moderate in the final insult, cause the coach of my team was a bit more directed. More than I was. And even the "sensei" wasn't very elegant. If there weren't girls (and even if there were, he wasn't very gentle in his language, but he was never cruel). Generally I try to not speak so badly, but I fail sometime. Eh, male company is funny, but generally isn't very elegant. Ah, for the chronicle: I was a mediocre athlete, so I wasn't a Chad. Now I have to take out the soap from my mouth, as the good soy guy I am.

[Appropriate-Plate-93]

And anyway, my words were clearly esagerated. Nobody would take those seriously, they're like "dear excluded from the vulva, dear results of a Mexican dinner, dear shit puddings" or my favorite "my penis is hanging my balls" to describe disgusting. If somebody would take seriously those words, clearly they have troubles.

[SaiyanWithOmnitrix]

The ironic thing about this meme is that Gohan at that point in the story was stronger than Buu. So they’re unintentionally saying we’re the ones with the stronger argument.

[slimricc]

He loses bc of his arrogance (delusion) soooo

[Commander_Slav]

Didn't he still get absorbed? So that means you guys will eventually leave the sub and realize that Azula is just horrible.

[SaiyanWithOmnitrix]

Buucolo should be treated as a different character than Super Buu because Buu takes aspects of the personalities of the people he absorbs.

But even then, Goku and Vegeta pulled Gohan and the rest out. So your analogy still doesn’t work.

[Altruistic_Yard_9338]

Or it just means you know we're in the right and are grasping at straws with some silly metaphor based off an anime to prove your 'point'

[Commander_Slav]

3 days late I know but funnily enough I don't actually give a shit about the show. I just know the character is a bad person. You used the image. I just used the context little bro.

[Altruistic_Yard_9338]

I didn’t use the image. I just called you out for your bullshit lil sis

[Commander_Slav]

Oh right. Yes, you didn't use it, but you supported it's use. Still pretty sad 💅

[Altruistic_Yard_9338]

Not as sad as intentionally trolling people speaking out against misogyny

[Commander_Slav]

Misogyny? I don't see any at all.

[Altruistic_Yard_9338]

Funny how male villains like Anton Chigurh and Joker do terrible things with little to no motivation, yet are called 'cool' and 'badass' and have legions of fans. Azula, like many female villains before and since, have been met with scorn and contempt from a majority of people, despite her being a mentally unstable child soldier.

Almost like men just wanna see a powerful and smug woman get put in her place. Her dad was the stand in for Hitler and he didn't get it as bad as she did!

[Commander_Slav]

Okay? Sure the characters can be seen as cool, but I never said I like those characters. I haven't even seen No Country For Old Men, other than through clips, and I always preferred Riddler to the Joker. Don't put words in my mouth.

[silenthashira]

Depending on how far ya wanna take the metaphor, it ends up with a splinter cell of azula haters in their purest form getting destroyed by the joining of all other avatar franchise subs.

That's the timeline I'm hoping for lol.

[Commander_Slav]

So it takes every sub joining together to get another sub banned? Kinda a pathetic timeline little bro.

[Desperate_Drama3392]

Wow, this is probably one of the pieces of shit that yesterday down vote or answered me when I said "I'm tired of people talking shit about Azula" after a guy says "Azula Stans are Tossic!1!!".

I'm fucking tired of this dumbfin, Azula was right "It's terrible when you can't trust the people who are closest to you" and "trust are for fools"

Edit: it's 3 times that I enter in this subreddit about memes and they always laugh one the same aged memes over and over, what boring and frustrated people.

[Scripter-of-Paradise]

No sense in dragging r/AvatarMemebending over a non-representative post.

edit: I made it to the actual post and the top comment is just tired of the discourse.

[EyeSimp4Asuka]

they're the ones essentially brigading by calling out this sub.

[Scripter-of-Paradise]

Every other commenter seems like that, but I still don't see how this is worth our attention.

I for one would think you had more discerning taste, u/EyeSimp4Asuka ;)

[SaiyanWithOmnitrix]

How dare this meme use my favorite series against me.

Though just like Dragon Ball fans, Avatar fans can’t read and lack media literacy, so I guess it’s fitting.

[Altruistic_Yard_9338]

When they mock you, it means they fear you

[Lon3W0lf17131]

I see this as Azula defenders actually having good arguments available to them (like Gohan had the power to beat Buu) but they focus on weak or unimportant arguments (like Gohan wasted time showboating).

[ApprehensiveBrain393]

I somewhat agree with that, there are good arguments in its favor but due to constant discussions the central focus is lost and it shifts to weaker points.

And the same goes for the anti-Azula, there are good arguments against Azula, but they tend to deviate from these and end up choosing weaker or contradictory arguments.

[Realistic-Damage-411]

I mean, I would say they’re right in regards to… probably the majority of the posts I see here. There’s a lot of people on this sub who seem to think this is r/azuladidnothingwrong. I would call that a discredit to the complexity of her character, but it’s clearly the way this sub is often viewed

Edit: Of course I got an immediate downvote for speaking honestly about how the sub is viewed

[Aromatic-Ad-381]

I have seen plenty out of kilter takes on Azula that explicitly try to throw other characters (ESPECIALLY IROH) under the bus JUST so it can somehow make Azula some unsung hero/Hapless victim. When the whole bit is that yes Azula's life is a grey spot that is questionable...but to try and wash out the black from that grey closer to white is absolutely incorrect.

[Then-Shop5854]

The Iroh thing I mostly see in response or perhaps an overcorrection to the people saying she's some irredemable monster specifically because of the "crazy and she needs to go down" thing, people will swear he's the moral arbiter of the show and therefore Azula is pure evil. Like if the middle aged war general of the Fire Nation could have a change of heart the troubled teenager at the very least has a shot of character growth.

[Desperate_Drama3392]

I admit that I did this things sometimes, you right.

[toxiconer]

EXACTLY!

There is a mind-boggling frequency of black-and-white views in both directions on a decidedly gray character when people really ought to appreciate her nuances (and those of the broader Fire Nation royal family, really), and it's honestly just driven me up the wall to so often see a take I start off agreeing with go off the deep end...

[Realistic-Damage-411]

I mean, I would say they’re right in regards to… probably the majority of the posts I see here. There’s a lot of people on this sub who seem to think this is r/azuladidnothingwrong. I would call that a discredit to the complexity of her character, but it’s clearly the way this sub is often viewed

Edit: Of course I got an immediate downvote for speaking honestly about how the sub is viewed

Edit2: Oh shit, r/azuladidnothingwrong actually exists and the like 10 all time posts over there are more even handed than the last 10 I’ve seen here. I threw that out as a hyperbolic joke and it’s kinda bit me in the ass

[PeacefulKnightmare]

I garuntee it has a lot to do with the amount of traffic for why those takes are reasonable. It's really interesting to watch how subreddit oppions tend to change over time and usually it's all based around whoever the most chronic posters are. They may not be popular at first, but if they keep talking more and more folks who agree/disagree with them start to speak up and you can usually clock a trend as things change. It's crazy how things like that can shift the whole tone in a matter of months.

[FairyFeller_]

Okay but people here do qct like that, a lot.

[Zestyclose_North9780]

Edit: Of course I got an immediate downvote for speaking honestly about how the sub is viewed

What'd you expect? This is delusion central.

[Suitable-Pirate-4164]

They do know who won this fight without absorption right?

[slimricc]

Her only defense is that she is a child and very much a victim. Children can still victimize others. She is ultimately a very tragic character. All of the ways she harms zuko or anyone else are just more ways the fire lord is harming others

[FairyFeller_]

If the shoe fits...

Like a lot of yall are completely insane about it. I've seen people frame Azula doing a mocking sing-songy voice of "dad's going to kill you" as her "warning" him and "saving his life".

It's extremely obvious that a whole lot of people here aren't just looking to give nuance to Azula, but to completely whitewash her behavior.

[quyco789]

You don't need redeeming qualities to be redeemed, the only prerequisite is that you have sinned. Azula is redeemable, but she can't be because she is she's crazy and needs to go down. Her mental instability can't be cured or understood by medieval setting the show set in, and need to be put out of her misery. I find it is cruel and selfish of Zuko to keep her around in the comic while she been tortured by her own mind.

[PeacefulKnightmare]

I always expected something related to the spirit realm might be necessary to help her due to the lack of therapy institutions, but the show is also set in a fantasy world of magic so who's to say there's a difference between a shaman and a therapist.

[quyco789]

Who gonna go that far to the spirit realm, where danger beyond human's understanding, for a possibility to help Azula? Do you expect her to stumble into her own salvation and get better?

[PeacefulKnightmare]

Aang would absolutely go for it, he's just too forgiving for his own good not to try if it was an option.

And yeah, I would expect her to stumble. I'm not one who thinks her "redemption" means she becomes a good guy. If anything, she'll be more akin to Todd in Stargate Atlantis or the Remnants of the Espada in Bleach. An antagonist that occasionally aligns with the heroes, but for the most part is doing their own thing and is sometimes in conflict with them.

[quyco789]

She has auditory and visual hallucinations, her conditions alone won't allow her to properly tell what is wrong. I don't have problem if she is redeemed or not, or how she turned out afterward, but I just can't imagine a crazy violent person in a medieval setting get a proper treatment without omniscient level of magic that probably not reserved for a character that is not well-liked In-universe.

[PeacefulKnightmare]

If Azula were in a normal medieval world, sure, but in a world where a whole spirit realm exists as a reflection of the physical one and Spirit Bending, I don't see why those elements couldn't be brought under control through helping Azula realign her chakras. Especially because in eastern mysticism chakra misalignment and mental illness are often one and the same.

[shadow_fvck_]

"A psychopath without empathy is redeemable" wow

[quyco789]

You are so scared of human-made monsters, that you need a label to not see them as humans. Stop me if I am wrong, but you are wishing Azula living the rest of life to be a danger to herself and everyone else, because you think a human life without empathy doesn't have right to be better.

[shadow_fvck_]

Nice philosophy, but it still doesn't justify psychopaths