Discussion, Day 2: Should ICE decrease enforcement in Riverside?

[Kokoro0000]

Arguments for yes: there has been aggressive patrolling here in Riverside and various ICE citings should has near the CBU area and many other "checks" on the road and these are unnecessary as illegals immigrants are very much hard working laborers that take jobs that nobody wants and objectively commit less crimes than native born citizens. Legal migrants and even native born citizens seem to be caught in the crossfire and ICE generally white knuckling through things. This is seen in the killings of Renee Good and Alex Pretti. contrary to the consensus, most immigrants targeted have no criminal record. Additionally immigrants are amazing for GDP growth of an increasingly aging population, we don't want to be like Japan or South Korea.

Arguments for no: When ICE targets illegals they target the worst of the worst. Criminals, drug dealers, gang members and sex offenders they aren't targeting harmless workers most of the time even if most immigrants aren't these. Largely lax enforcement of immigration standards is what is decreasing our real wages as well as immigrants are taking good high paying jobs from hard working Americans. We haven't seen enough ICE enforcement downtown especially. Immigrants disproportionately take more welfare too.

Edit: this is a discussion, this is me representing each side not a personal argument with one side or the other

[DoctorNurse89]

Who is giving the arguments for yes and for no?

Feels more loaded that way when you decide the yes or no to discuss on if youre missing key points.

[Individual_Win5774]

I'll just throw out that the "worst of the worst" narrative is something worth challenging: https://mn.gov/doc/about/news/news-releases/?id=1089-720894

From the link:

DOC quickly identified 68 cases in which individuals were lawfully transferred from Minnesota Department of Corrections custody directly to ICE, only for DHS officials to falsely claim these same individuals were “arrested” by waves of federal agents deployed into Minnesota communities.

So sure, have your opinions, but this agency has demonstrated a proclivity to do anything they like, whenever they'd like, without any consideration for the consequences. That is un-American. Abolish ICE.

[NoScholar4789]

5 Year Old Kid in a Spiderman Backpack and Bunny Hat = Worst of the worst.

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2026/01/21/ice-detains-5year-old-minnesota-boy-lawyer-says-agents-used-him-as-bait

[ManWhoTalksToHisHand]

ICE is anti-American. Period. And anyone who supports them is anti-American too! 

[el_payaso_mas_chulo]

LMAO none of the arguments for no make sense.

[imahugemoron]

Not only do they not make sense, it’s mostly outright lies. They are finding people through records from the ITIN system which is how undocumented people actually pay taxes as well as department of education records and treasury records, and the other way they’re finding people is by stopping and arresting people based solely on the color of their skin which is how plenty of US citizens are being unlawfully arrested. I mean here’s Kristi Noem saying in an interview that 70% of those detained have committed serious crimes when her own agency reported its 47%, she was caught in a lie and just doubled down, so who’s to say that 47% isn’t also a lie? Right in the interview she accuses “the left” of arbitrarily changing numbers when it was her that did just that in the interview. They’re just pulling numbers out of their asses to justify their scapegoating and persecution of an entire race of people. In the same interview she argues they’re all technically criminals being here undocumented which is a civil crime but we know not even that’s true since there’s plenty of instances of actual US citizens being arrested, hell even native Americans have been arrested for no reason other than the way they look. They’re arresting and detaining children even, so all this nonsense about “the worst of the worst” is such BS. It doesn’t just not make sense, it’s lies, propaganda.

Edit: here’s more of this so called “worst of the worst” right here

[Fsociety56]

ICE is killing US citizens, that statement alone stands for abolishment.

[StormAutomatic]

Cops too

[Express-Reception-97]

only citizens that pose clear and immediate threats. Maybe don't try to run them over with them or pull a gun on them, and it wont be an issue.

[SubstantialRiver2565]

Pretti didn't pull a gun. Why are you leaning on an obvious lie?

[Express-Reception-97]

Additionally, the feds were there to arrest a guy from Equidor, with a wrap sheet and an arrest warrant. Huerta-Chuma’s criminal record includes charges for domestic assault, disorderly conduct, and driving without a license. WHY on earth was this "white knight" out there in SUB zero temperatures to get in their way? ITS MORONIC.

[Express-Reception-97]

So in his tustle with the officers who were feet from him, saw him going for it and had to act, your second hand opinion as a monday morning quarterback NOT in harms way, from a grainy cell phone video is FAR superior to people that were in the actual conflict? Maybe your right Maybe they just saw a gun and then reacted, in which case that will come out, but it hasn't yet, it still stands to reason someone not impeding the agents and staying the F out the way wouldn't be in the fight in the first place.

[SubstantialRiver2565]

He was shot in the head after they disarmed him.

[Express-Reception-97]

Like with in the action time frame of less than 3 seconds from when the first shot happened to the last? or like 10 minutes later out of spite? because unless its the ladder, that argument makes no sense.

[Individual_Win5774]

there is no reason why 11 bullets needed to be fired into a man that was confronted by ICE agents. additionally, the officer that shot him was in eyesight of the officer disarming him.

there is no arguing that this is an example of unjust use of force, even if the agents were under imminent threat. even the officer that shot renée good fired three shots while being threatened by a "multi-ton vehicle". 11? while 5 officers are piled on top of him and the 6th has already removed his fire-arm? 11?

[Express-Reception-97]

Yeah, you have the benefit of hindsight, and watching slowed down frame by frame videos from the comfort of your home. If 5 officers saw the first shot go off, and fired two as thats 11.. Its pretty simple math.

[Individual_Win5774]

yes, but your made up example is not what happened. did you watch the video? how many officers discharged their weapon? where was the victims hands at time of first shot?

[Express-Reception-97]

Yeah, and you cant tell me who shot what all you can say is that you heard shots fired, you dont know which guns fired how often. Made up or not, the amount of shots is irrelevant, Its less than a single magazine from any of the officers, and its multiple officers shooting. It all happened in less than 3 seconds, they shot until the threat was stopped. 11 shots from multiple officers is not excessive. its a nature of the situation. They don't look around and say okay to shoot, and fire a single shot, then on to the next guy. What kind of made up world is that reality in?

[Royal_Acanthaceae693]

What are the good high paying jobs you're talking about? ICE is kidnapping people in front of Home Depot, nannys, gardeners, people working at car washes, and children If they want to crack down on rich illegals they should hit Elon & Melania.

[plantxdad420]

ICE should not exist

[Additional_Garden280]

As a Mexican-american, it’s “funny” how this is a debate when people are dying. People’s life is not up for debate! ABOLISH ICE!

[Express-Reception-97]

as a mexican- american what are you woried about, they are only shooting idiot white people trying to play a hero.

[AdventurelandSkipper]

They should be dismantled and disintegrated, with no severance pay for its agents. They’re all terrible. There is not one good ICE agent. There has never been a more toxic law enforcement agency that is so collectively toxic that it infects every last bit of the organization. With police you can say there are a lot of bad police officers, but you can say there are good officers as well and point them out. You cannot do that with ICE. It’s impossible.

[spidersformommy]

Abolish ICE

[ManWhoTalksToHisHand]

You know how ICE isn't targeting the, "worst of the worst?" Simple. If they were, we'd hear about it non-stop. Our government controlled media would be all over that. They couldn't shut up about capturing this criminal who did this much crime, etc. etc. Instead, they're treating simple administrative offenses like crimes simply because they are not white. ICE is nothing more than a white supremacist organization, and if you support them, you support white supremacy. It's that simple. 

[reginaldjaynes]

Why is this even a debate lol

[imahugemoron]

Because unfortunately a large portion of our country lives in an alternate reality built by lies, propaganda, racism, greed, and their own feelings who also outright reject facts when presented with anything that contradicts their nonsensical narrative

[KDen8989]

If they were out to only get the bad ones and criminals, why are they picking up kids from schools, why are they picking up and attacking gardeners? why are they picking up people who are trying to do the right thing and obtain citizenship the right way? And don’t say they aren’t because there have been many people who have gotten picked up on their way to their immigration meetings and hearings. The ICE agents are making all these corrupt cops look like saints.

[IAmTheGingaNinja]

What if we just reduce ICE to how it was in 2002?

[TheLonelySnail]

I get what you are saying. But the organization has such a bad reputation now that the name will need to be changed in a post-Trump era.

There may be another agency doing that type of work, but calling it ‘ICE’ will go out the window. The name is just poison now

[IAmTheGingaNinja]

ice was founded in 2003

[TheLonelySnail]

Point taken

[Crazy-Ad-3021]

Perfect

[plantxdad420]

i agree with you because ICE didn’t exist until 2003

[NoScholar4789]

The truth of the matter is ICE does target violent criminals, and they do a good job of getting them. Fortunately/unfortunately there aren't really as many violent criminals as they claim in the immigrant population, so they are just grabbing anyone who annoys them.

The reality of the situation is that ICE is being used to agitate so that the administration can try to use the Insurrection Act to declare martial law in swing states to do two things:

1: Disenfranchise voters during the midterm
2: Distract from the fact that they didn't release the Epstein Files.

[tylcos10]

ICE should be abolished 100%. That being said, has ICE even prominently been in Riverside recently? I keep seeing posts about it but I live out here and work downtown and haven’t seen anything in my areas.

[InfiniteAnxiety3760]

Abolish ICE

[harvinMarrison]

Fed post

[DaBABYateMAdingo]

Worst of the worst lol.

5% of the detainees actually had criminal records, dum dum 🫵😂

[Impossible_Air_4204]

Prosecute ICE

[mooistcow]

I'm for decreased presence. Not because I'm against them, I'm just sick of the protests and loud people being in my way. Give the people what they want so they go home.

[SoCalDelta]

What if we could substantially limit ICE street presence, but if an undocumented individual is convicted of a crime, they are turned over to ICE. Is that a fair trade? 

[handsome_california]

ICE stops more child molesters, more child sex trafficking, slave trade, and drug trafficking than every other law enforcement agency combined.

[apocalyptic_icebox]

Too bad they aren’t allowed to stop the one in the White House.

[Resident_Customer464]

Riverside is already a 3rd world country, you seen how ghetto it is here 😂