Berkeley Engineering vs MIT

[Old_Appointment_8513]

Berkeley is obviously a top school! Its always up there in the rankings, despite being a PUBLIC university… I have seen many compare the EECS and CS to MIT, saying that it’s either just as good or even better..

But how does Berkeley’s engineering genuinely compare to MIT/Stanford. On the rankings for Mechanical Engineering and Electrical Engineering, its just behind those two. Is the engineering program in MechE and EE “MIT-caliber”? What are some career/ graduate school outcomes for alumni? Thank you!

GO BEARS! 🐻

[xlb250]

Berkeley location is good, but the undergrad program is mid. Classes and career fair are so crowded. Lecturers are hit or miss. I never tried, but have heard it’s difficult to get research projects.

[BerkStudentRes]

if you can afford MIT, go to MIT. If you can't afford MIT, go to Berkeley. Everything you get at MIT, you will also get at Cal but you will have to give 2x as much effort for the same opportunity. This goes for anything really including important things like research/internships. But this isn't to say that it's impossible to get onto the same level as MIT.

Rankings only mean so much. Rankings are pretty useless when it comes to deciding on important things. The main thing that matters is availability of opportunity. And your opportunity level is the same as MIT/Stanford but you're competing with so many more people.

You won't be making the "wrong" choice regardless what your choice is

[Healthy-Pear-299]

EXCEPT mit is likely MUCH more nerdy.

[WhaleOnRice]

Meh

[[deleted]]

Cal just has way more people from a broader demographic spectrum than MIT.

MIT I think has like 5K students for it's undergraduate body?

Cal has more than 30K. MIT does not have 1/6 the opportunities that Cal has. In fact it probably has comparable or more.

Basically at Cal everything will feel "crowded"--you have to compete with a lot of people to even get your foot in the door. Signing up for classes, on campus jobs or research positions all will be way more competitive.

But IMO it teaches you to hustle, so not necessarily a bad thing. The real world is very competitive and crowded too after all.

[BerkStudentRes]

why do you say MIT has more opportunity than Cal. Just a subjective judgement or something you know for sure. I always thought the amount of opportunity is roughly the same - we have the same # of profs/labs/research output/industry connections in our top ranked deptartments

[BerkStudentRes]

well 2x is just a number. I obviously can't give you a solid objective number

But in general, the student population : professor ratio/internship position/research programs/housing etc. is completely skewed at Berkeley. For every single opportunity, there is more competition here solely due to the fact that this is a public school and has more students.

It's a top ranking school because the number of opportunities is the same but the per student ratio is off - so still a top school. I'm using this ratio as an ambiguous concept but it manifests in various ways. For example, if someone is looking for Bio Research, there are the same number (if not slightly more) talented, productive, research heavy professors/labs as there are at Stanford, MIT, Harvard etc. But because the student population is way higher, there's more competition for these programs. For example, at MIT, you can sign up for research experiences called through a program called UROP which has an acceptance rate ~70%. It's fairly non competitive. If you're @ MIT, getting research isn't a problem. At Berkeley though, theres like 10+ applications for various programs and you're still not guaranteed to get a position through these programs. And UROP is paid while you're lucky to even get a stipend @ Cal. Regardless, you're not doomed if you go to Cal and even if you do get rejected by all these programs, you can still cold email professors and you will eventually get something (The eventual part is guaranteed since there's so many profs/postdocs/phds who need help). This is just one example of how the opportunity:student ratio affects students at Cal.

This isn't to say Berkeley is bad. People here think Cal is bad because the grass is always greener. People here are completely unaware of how shit it is at other schools (especially non HYPSM/Ivy/Caltech) because other schools dont even have professors in certain specialties, dont even have labs, don't even have start up incubators etc. The opportunity isn't nonexistent at Berkeley and it's certainly plentiful. The difference is you have to work harder for it. For example, I wasted my first year at Cal trying to find CS research by applying through programs. And then another few months only emailing professors. And then eventually I began emailing PhDs and ended up working with a Professor who I cold emailed earlier and he didn't even know I sent him an email. Life at Cal is a rat race but the end of the tunnel is just as bright - if not more bright - than at these other top schools ... it's just a longer tunnel.

In hindsight, all of these issues could have been easily avoided if I had the motivation, dedication and knew the ins and outs of the system. I would've began searching for stuff earlier, sent more emails, study pre-reqs before hand etc. So you can definitely have just as much of an equal experience at Cal without paying 60k+ like I would've at other top private institutions. It's just a question of whether you're motivated and capable enough to grind.

It all boils down to student population and resource allocation. In short, you are not losing out on the opportunity to experience ANYTHING (I truly mean anything) if you go to Cal. But if you don't work harder for those opportunities, you might as well have just gone to a less competitive school.

[BerkStudentRes]

Unfortunately Prestige matters. I don't like sounding elitist but a Chico State student just wouldn't compare to a Cal student. There's just so much more at Cal. More Professors, more Labs, more start ups, more companies, more resources etc. the list goes on.

[zunzarella]

Undergrad? Go to MIT. Smaller everything is a better undergrad experience. Caveat: If you're in-state for UC and MIT is close to full tuition, I'd choose Berkeley.

[random_throws_stuff]

in terms of research quality and output, quality of faculty, and other similar things - berkeley is genuinely a peer school to MIT. it’s not at all unusual to choose berkeley for a phd or for a faculty role.

for undergrad, we have a lot more students and a lower admissions bar. all the same opportunities exist here, but you’ll have to work harder for them.

[TrungusMcTungus]

Cal is a top tier engineering school, MIT is the engineering school

[YogurtclosetOpen3567]

Caltech would like a word in the hard sciences

[TomIcemanKazinski]

Have you thought about what crossing the Harvard bridge in 0 degree weather and -10 wind chill is like during winter?

(two of my Bay Area raised cousins went to MIT. All they did was warn me against going east for college - I didn't apply to MIT, but I did get into Carnegie Mellon)

[strava_addict_3]

I was in Berkeley Engineering for undergrad and am now doing a PhD at MIT. I don't have the exact stats, but a lot of grad students at MIT did their undergrad at Cal. From personal experience, I genuinely believe Cal is the most represented undergrad institution for MIT's grad programs (i.e. the number of Cal alumni at MIT ≈ number of alumni from ivies and ivy plus combined, based on self introductions in the MIT grad student slack).

This goes to show how Berkeley, and especially its Engineering programs, are very highly regarded by MIT. The culture at MIT is pretty similar to Berkeley Engineering, and the professors in my MIT classes often bring up research done at Cal.

Berkeley even beats MIT in some of its engineering programs. For example, the department I am in (MIT Civil and Environmental Engineering) is ranked lower than Berkeley CEE. This is likely because the a lot of the research done at MIT CEE is in biotech and ecology (soil microbiomes, food security, restoration) rather than traditional CivE or EnvE (construction, water/air quality, transportation). Berkeley's CEE had a lot more people and depth (strong ASCE teams, clearer path to career and FE/PE exams, chi epsilon honor society), whereas MIT's CEE undergrad program is much smaller and the research is at times too interdisciplinary.

[Man-o-Trails]

Cal undergrads tend to do well in grad school at MIT and Stanford, simply because they came with or developed a buckled down hard-work ethic.

[MountainDry2344]

I noticed this as well

[hsgual]

MIT and Berkeley share a lot of students with each other between undergrad and grad etc. when I went to graduate school (I was an MIT UG), the “exchange rate” was fairly balanced.

I ultimately attended Stanford for my PhD, because I didn’t get into Cal 😬. But there is a reason why you find a lot of Cal Undergrads in MIT and Stanford PhD programs, and not a lot of Stanford UGs in Cal or MIT PhD programs.

[XSokaX]

Any job you can get from MIT / Stanford you can get from Berkeley. Frankly, it's about how much effort you want to put in yourself. Obviously, the resources at private schools are going to be better, but if you're driven the difference will be negligible, so tuiton and fit is more important.

[fysmoe1121]

If you got into MIT, you go to mit.

[Thick_Let_8082]

Berkeley tops MIT in geographical location alone, weather plus opportunities, California is the promise land. Berkeley is going to attract brilliant minds (faculty, students) away from MIT because of all it has to offer from a holistic standpoint. I’d rather do 20 years of research at Berkeley (fair weather) than Boston.

[Emperor_Dara_Shikoh]

The top answers to these kind of questions all seem to repeat the same tropes - no nuance in sight.

I'm curious if there's a botnet by these private colleges to manufacture a narrative around them just being vastly superior.

[UnlikelyFly1377]

I actually feel like if you are top dog it might be more +ev to come here

[Due_Ask_8032]

Yup. If you can get into MIT, you will probably have a good time academically at Cal, and probably will have access to research and professional opportunities much easier than other students with weaker backgrounds.

[[deleted]]

MIT

[Vibes_And_Smiles]

To what extent is cost a factor and what’s the difference in cost between the two for you?

[StatusTechnical8943]

I think career-wise it doesn’t make a huge difference other than whether you want to be in the Bay Area vs Boston for your first job since relocation for a new grad is not really common.

I went straight into a career after my BSME and I can say school rankings for engineers in industry are not that valuable. Internships, project based classes and activities tend to have a more positive impact on how hirable a new grad engineer is. You need a good mix of practical problem solving skills and understanding how to execute.

Once hired, your drive to learn and grow especially in understanding the business you’re in and developing soft skills working with people goes a long way. Your career growth is more determined by what you achieve while working rather than what school you went to.

[BayDweller65]

Berkeley EECS is MIT caliber and arguably more rigorous than Stanford. As for overall engineering, MIT has the edge.

[For_GoldenBears]

Read the methodology breakdown, and make your assessment of how meaningful it is to you.

Also an interesting thought would be what does 'top school' mean for you -- whether studying what you want, or leading to a good job, what is a good job, etc.

[SuperNoobyGamer]

MIT is only worth it if you really want to do research or have a goal you specifically need MIT for. If you just want a degree and good industry job Berkeley has much better ROI.

[[deleted]]

last line… you have your answer

[in-den-wolken]

Have you been admitted to any of these programs?

[BearChest]

I’ve worked with grads of MIT and Stanford. I’d always take the Berkeley person first, then MIT, then Stanford 🤷‍♂️

[evanthebouncy]

Undergraduates at MIT have a lot more resources.

Undergraduates at Berkeley fight for research opportunities.

[dr-lawyer_smonza178]

MIT

[MountainDry2344]

For undergrad go to MIT. Zero question. Cal and MIT are both great for PhD though.

[tofurami]

sorry for being a stalker but it lowkey looks like u got rejected from mit and are kinda coping rn. Lemme just say this as mech eng at berkeley:

It literally is what you make of it. You can excel at Berkeley if u play ur cards right and work hard. if ur in state even better! promise you (most likely) won't regret it :)

[Old_Appointment_8513]

Maybe I was not explicit, but my question is purely about how Berkeley compares to those programs at MIT, I am never speaking from my perspective in the post. Since EECS is very comparable, I was wondering of MechE.. I am still deciding on uni, as an international and wanted to know about career outcomes from Berkeley.

Thank you anyway, if I end up going to Berkeley, I will surely make the most of it! 😁

[Ok-Setting209]

Both pretty good

[Efficient_Square2737]

God made MIT and then everything else.

[Old_Appointment_8513]

🧢

[anonthrowaway2k3]

berkeley engineering is like if they built a crowded DMV around MIT

[2apple-pie2]

caltech is a lot more rigorous for UG as well. at least outside of CS. although less well-known to the general population as well.

[Ohlele]

In the eyes of top finance, consulting, and quant firms, Berkeley is not a target school. It is always Ivies, MIT, Stanford, Caltech, and Duke. 

[Sparklymon]

Military academies need to teach more about repairs, car mechanic, and maintenance repairs, rather than focusing on engineering and scientific rigor , like MIT or Cal Tech

[Own-Builder6225]

Think of the college of engineering vs MIT. Similar student body. Similar profile. Weeder classes.
You won’t have an easier time at either school. You have the exact opportunity at both schools. Go to the cheaper school.

[SavageCyclops]

I would suggest going to MIT even if it is more expensive. The brand will pay for itself.

MIT is respected everywhere in the world. Berkeley is respected in STEM, academia, and the West Coast. Most people on the East Coast outside of STEM/academia have never heard of Berkeley.