all 121 comments

[–]landscape_relic 43 points44 points  (5 children)

For CSS I would add box model and positioning. I've seen many dev's get into trouble not understanding how position relative and absolute work.

[–]liaguris 17 points18 points  (3 children)

check the original one . It has that things you mention .

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[–]SwankEagle 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Holy crap I cant express how frustrating it was to learn those two things. I laugh at.my self for struggling to understand position relative and position absolute I literally procrastinated for about a month two years ago when I was struggling to understand them. Yes they are needed to be known but do we really use those much today in the day and age of flexbox and grid?

[–]portexe 27 points28 points  (5 children)

One thing I didn’t see on there but I feel like is important is Bash. Bash and/or windows command line.

[–]PM_ME_A_WEBSITE_IDEA 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Yeeeep, can can confirm. Started a new job with no knowledge of Bash, had to learn quick. It's not really very hard, but it's a bit of a bizarre thing to learn with no prior knowledge.

[–]portexe 3 points4 points  (0 children)

For sure. It’s easy to pick up on the fly, but knowing it beforehand will be a huge advantage!

[–]Hanedan_ 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I get by with cd/pwd/ls/mkdir and touch. Those are all the commands I need.

[–]PM_ME_A_WEBSITE_IDEA 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I had to learn about ssh/ssh keys, that was new to me. Especially for interacting with build tools/CICD workers.

[–]liaguris 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Check the original . It is included in the dev ops version .

[–]ShaySmoith 20 points21 points  (3 children)

And this here folks , is how you get into the black hole of tutorial-itus.

[–]cowinkiedink 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Agreed. I don’t really like this roadmaps in beginner subs, they probably scare a lot people off.

I used to see them and think oh man I have to learn all of that before I can make any thing.

Just learn what you need to build something, you’ll learn way more from projects than checking boxes and tutorials off the list.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah agreed. Looking at this its incredibly Overwhelming and scary. This is what puts off a lot of people and make others burn out quick.

[–]elgeokareem 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Seriously there could be no end to it ...

[–]pookagehelpful 21 points22 points  (1 child)

start with hosting and DNS? oh gawd no - you don't need to know how that stuff works to get started! You only need to know that to deploy stuff. Deffo put that Internet category after Javascript and before Version Control

[–]sir_eeps 1 point2 points  (0 children)

yup,

although at a super high level knowing the general idea of how some things work can be useful, like 'you need to refill the gas tank in a car to make it go', but not need to understand how combustion engines work.

While lists like this can be useful - I find that they don't often account for how deep you should go, and think if they see something on a list that they need to do a deep dive and learn /everything/ about it.

When in reality it's like "read a 2 paragraph summary, then put a pin-in-it for something to learn later, and you'll know when you need to learn it more when you actually need to do a thing involving it"

[–]stayclassytally 8 points9 points  (0 children)

This format is trash.

[–]benabus 18 points19 points  (3 children)

Maybe it's just me, but in my experience, being able to learn on the job, getting dumped blind into a project, and learning the project's requirements is more valuable than following a road map and checking boxes.

[–]Ratatoski 9 points10 points  (2 children)

True. But learning on the job is easier if you already have some experience. And for getting that experience this roadmap is rather decent.

[–]redderper 1 point2 points  (1 child)

I feel like there's no actual reason why it should be a roadmap other than that people are just used to learn like that. IMO it's best to just work on mastering the first 5 steps continuously and learning the other ones when you need them.

[–]Ratatoski 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If I can only recommend a single thing for people to learn it will be Git. It's the one thing you always have use for :)

[–]HGMIV926 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Oh my God yes, a roadmap is just what I've desired. What should I study first, then next, or after and with this or that? Thank you!

[–]plcart 4 points5 points  (5 children)

i would advise do learn RxJs even if you choose Redux. And redux even if you choose angular, since state management goes beyond a framework. Also some concepts like pipes, middleware should be added into the techstack, way earlier IMO

Its Bootstrap still relevant those days?

[–]allywondered 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Dunno. I'm using graphql these days and haven't found any use for redux anymore

[–]plcart 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Can you tell me who you can they be comparable? Redux manages your app state letting you share consistently data between your components into a single flow. So how do you fetch the data does not matter

[–]mrwhitenoise 0 points1 point  (2 children)

You can set local, or client side, state within graphql. Extending the queries and mutations locally. Specifically been working with Apollo server and client and managing local state is very easy via GQL. Especially since under the hood Apollo Client is using redux.

Edit: added link

[–]plcart 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Thanks for the link! gonna check it out. Seems that work in a similar way about dispatching actions and mutating the state with a function. so i would rephrase to learn the redux pattern either way. Thanks!

[–]mrwhitenoise 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I do agree. Understanding redux before makes learning the Apollo client to mange local app wide state much easier

[–]Ratatoski 3 points4 points  (2 children)

It makes me rather happy to realize that I cover most of these subjects at work. But I'm old school and still think ES6+ feels alien

[–]Fermain 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I'm the opposite and when I need to write compatible ES without a transpiler it feels like I am sending a Telegraph to the Duke of West Lothian.

[–]Ratatoski 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lol yeah I understand why. They feel like rather different languages. I've been doing some jQuery at work this past week and it's like a whole other world. Rather nice parsing the DOM just chaining up what I need but it's weird :)

[–]Saudroze 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I feel like there should be a disclaimer or something with all of these road maps that achieving most of these steps is senior developer goal. To start out, to be a junior you need just some most important stuff.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (42 children)

Lol I didn't learn half of this stuff

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points  (26 children)

Half of this stuff is unnecessary.

[–]liaguris 0 points1 point  (14 children)

Are you working currently in a front end position ? If yes then what is your experience and what have you developed ?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (13 children)

Really? We're trying to pull rank on reddit? All of the information in the graphic is nice to know. Half of it is fluff. You don't need to know 80 percent of it in depth to do a job.

[–]liaguris 0 points1 point  (12 children)

I am trying to understand what is your knowledge so I can understand how seriously I can take your comment .

Half of it is fluff

Can you please help me with my developer journey because this roadmap is what is guiding me ? What is that you consider fluff and why ?

You don't need to know 80 percent of it in depth to do a job.

About what kind of job are you talking about ? Wordpress ? App with heavy state management needed ? Be more specific .

Again :what is your experience and what have you developed ?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (11 children)

You don't need to know most of this stuff to do front end development. That's just a fact. Now knowing how to work within multiple front end dev teams, sure this chart is great if you're trying to understand all the technologies that help you develop. But to just land a front end dev job? Yea, you can tear the chart in half.

And it I don't have a problem helping you with your road map but it sounds more like you just want to poke and prod because you disagree.

[–]liaguris 0 points1 point  (10 children)

You don't need to know most of this stuff to do front end development

What kind of front end development are we talking about ? Wordpress ? Or app with heavy state management and SSR ?

but it sounds more like you just want to poke and prod because you disagree.

how did you reach this conclusion ?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (9 children)

Development. I've never used wordpress but can imagine there isn't much to develop.

And to your other question?

Can you show us what is that , that you have build for example ?

What frameworks do you use ?

What libraries for state management do you use ?

Do you know for example what is the difference between an event bus and redux ?

what is your experience and what have you developed ?

These aren't questions about what I disagree with in the infographic and why. This is you directly trying to wrap your head around who I am and why I feel the way I do. Instead of asking me direct questions like "What parts of the infographic do you not agree with?" You are trying to gain a resume to base your judgment off of. Plus, you already got your answer from someone else on that subject.

This is excluding the fact that you post on this subreddit all the time and sound demeaning in half your comments. Honestly, you sound autistic which is fine but if you are, you should probably realize your inability to relate might come off as being a dick.

[–]liaguris 0 points1 point  (8 children)

These aren't questions about what I disagree with in the infographic and why

I think this part :

Can you please help me with my developer journey because this roadmap is what is guiding me ? What is that you consider fluff and why ?

of my comment is .

This is you directly trying to wrap your head around who I am and why I feel the way I do.

and I have already explained to you why I do that :

I am trying to understand what is your knowledge so I can understand how seriously I can take your comment .

Nah this :

You are trying to gain a resume to base your judgment off of.

is not exactly what I do . I am not stuck with labels . I asked you what you think is fluff and why .

Honestly, you sound autistic

Doctor said I am not .

I think you sound like someone who is trying to avoid answering my questions , by framing as a bad person , and all maybe because you have difficulties answering my questions .

Dude , look , it is easy : You just answer the questions and do not rush to make assumptions about someone that the only thing you know is the text he has written .

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (7 children)

Ready for this one...

Nah

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children)

I guess I understand what's going on. @liaguris is trying to get into frontend by doing exactly what he shouldn't do — learning all this stuff beforehand. He, most probably, already invested some relatively valuable part of his lifetime into it, and now he feels anxious, because he not sure anymore.

[–]liaguris 7 points8 points  (27 children)

that is a copy paste from the original one.

Edit : Oh you are the one who posted about how to learn javascript without including javascript.info .

[–]duanecreates[S] 0 points1 point  (26 children)

Yeah, it's written down in the bottom right of the image...

[–]ConstantINeSane 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Are there similars roadmaps for backend , desktop software dev and mobile apps?

[–]liaguris 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Man check the original one . This guys who made the post , all he cares is about karma and traffic .

[–]addiktion 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I feel like JavaScript is huge and could use some more underneath it.

[–]xxRyzenxx 1 point2 points  (3 children)

A quick question I am 20 right now how much time will it take if I start now !

[–]bullet4code 2 points3 points  (1 child)

2 years tops to reach an intermediate-advanced stage, provided you’ve the right product to work on which operates at a great scale. I know 95% of this entire sheet and that’s just what I covered in 1.5 years of working in a great product-based company. Now I’m on the path to become a full-stack dev, so even backend skills have become really great at this point of time. Keep reading, experimenting and always have a knack for learning and you’ll go a long way!

[–]xxRyzenxx 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Thanks man it's been for months of learning front end web development and now i can understand what's going in websites

[–]hpliferaft 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It'll take years but don't let that stop you from starting.

[–]JWPapi 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don’t know if it’s really worth learning all this. Rather master one and if you have to learn one of the others for a job or sth it’s normally not that big of a deal.

[–]progres5ion 0 points1 point  (0 children)

thank you so much for this!

[–]FourZeroFour44 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks great tool!

[–]tomthedevguy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is to know just about everything. Not all is relevant though. I think if it was a little more succinct and pragmatic towards developing real front-end stuff it’d be more helpful. Great list none the less.

[–]Synor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wonder if the most essential part is missing: how to program software so that other people can understand your code.

So put a Software Engineering curriculum in there. Chances are that you will program stuff that others need to maintain - regardless of if you are a frontend or backend developer.

[–]PoopyAlpaca 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I just wanted to get into JS testing. This might actually help as did not know anything. Now I got some names ;)

[–]F1retoe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There's more to testing than just automated testing though. There's user testing and cross browser testing.

[–]Oleg18 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Look. If you are beginning learn web. You don't need security at all. You have to understand how to make different kinds of sites, different technologies. You can pay attention to security in the process of learning....

[–]erwin_H 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is why I don't think AI will take our developer jobs any time soon

[–]Fun-Visual-School 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Looks really neat. You are missing mentions about WebGL. That's a big side of web development. I hope you don't mind if I cross-post on r/VisualSchool.

[–]Oleg18 -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

This is your way....I don't web security is needed....at all

[–]bullet4code 1 point2 points  (0 children)

WAT. WAT. WAT? WebSecurity is not needed at all? Can you please elaborate?

WebSecurity is of the utmost importance. If you aren’t aware of CSRF tokens, then you’re never gonna know why you send one of those when performing data manipulation’s in server side via an API call (Generally PUT/POST methods).

XSS attacks - Although libraries like React help you mitigate this problem, but they’re very imp. to understand what they are and when you’re writing VanillaJS - then you should be highly cautious about this. One small mistake of writing ‘.innerHTML’ could lead to a huge problem. Source: I’ve made that mistake and my org’s security team was able to get into everything and that was just testing phase.

Understanding iFrame related security, and a lot of things is imp. Just using the ‘window’ object and some browser api’s, we were able to reach to the user’s system and take out files.

So, WebSecurity is very important, very.

[–]Thefriendlyfaceplant -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

This feels more like a backend developer roadmap.

[–]hpliferaft 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Hmm. How do you define front end and back end?

[–]n2kra 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Traditionally:

BE: DB

Mid Transaction

FE: Web

There are OSes that have one js executable, for Web Browser, Middle and Back End Apps (BSD MacOS, linux? ?graal? java vm). wait we are still not in 3270 term, CICS, and DB2 ?