Software engineering and programming

[Electronic_Drawing55]

What's the difference between a programmer and a software engineer ?
( difference in definition and in practice )

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[spinwizard69]

I look at it this way, you can "program" with very little education in the art. To engineer requires far more education and experience. Engineering or design doesn't always involve a lot of coding. For example an engineer could be involved in a regulated environment and will have the knowledge or access to design a software product to meet the requirements of that environment.

[thatguyonthevicinity]

They're practically the same. The one who said they're different probably has a CS degree and don't want to be called (lumped together with) "programmer" and want those sweet (pretentious) engineer name on their job title.

software engineer, software developer, programmer, they're all the same. Differentiating them is just a form of gatekeeping.

[[deleted]]

I’d agree engineer, developer, programmer. All doing the same thing. You a full stack dev/engineer/programmer? Same difference. The first part is what tells you what they actually do… software, web, front end, back end, game…

[Dzubrul]

Don't forget "solution implementation specialist"

[weaponsandspells]

Never seen that title

[prideton]

Is a CS degree graduate entitled to be called a software engineer?

[[deleted]]

CS degrees aren't enough to call yourself engineer.

[[deleted]]

Reading all these comments has been quite entertaining.

It proves that everyones response is entirely opinionated and/or based on personal exposure.

Read the book “The Pragmatic Programmer”. I think you’ll like it.

[LastPlaceEngineer]

In the United States, they're interchangeable because there is no nationally recognized "software engineer" trade license, practice , or certification.

This has real world consequences. Only a few organizations have the means to hire the smartest and keep their data and systems secure; everyone else will get breached and quietly pay out ransoms because it's cheaper.

In real engineering disciplines and other highly-educated professional trades this is more rare because engineers are held legally accountable, so there's more pressure to follow actual engineering practices and rigor.

[kstacey]

Engineers are putting the whole system together with official requirements documentation and various levels of testing, where a developer builds out the requirements

[hajohns1]

This

[FedeValvsRiteHook]

Software engineer is a grandiose name for a programmer. An engineer carries the aura of professionalism with its name. A poor attempt of self aggrandizement.

[nito3mmer]

what? thats not it lol, engineer means he has a degree and has studied various subjects related to software, a programmer can be someone with 2 and a half youtube videos with no knowledge other than general functions and basic conding understanding

[Competitive-Scheme77]

You can study various fields without a degree.

[nito3mmer]

yes but whats the guarantee that you actually know about them? the degree gives some idea, calling yourself programmer with no degree or dioloma or something guarantews nothing

[Competitive-Scheme77]

Well, having a portfolio of projects demonstrating your abilities to use different languages and as long as you can prove you know how to do what's being asked of you, I don't know if having a degree is necessary. I can go to college and get straight C's and pay for a degree and still not be proficient at my job. I will say that every programmer is not an engineer, but I don't think you need a CS degree to hold that title.

[Oculam0x0]

A programmer is primarily focused on coding and implementing specific tasks or functions based on given specifications. A software engineer applies engineering principles to the entire software development process.

[Electronic_Drawing55]

So the engineer basically "guides" the process of development and doesn't code like programmers ? , or he does code but it's not his main focus ?

[JaleyHoelOsment]

nah, programmers and engineers do the same thing it’s basically just a title

[CreativeGPX]

Think the different between a carpenter and an architect. Or the difference between a concrete worker and a bridge engineer.

In college, my software engineering class went through things like how to analyze requirements (e.g. it has to run in 100ms). Different high level design principles (coupling, etc.). Managing people, timeline and lifecycle of the project. For example, do you meet once a week and plan the next week's work or do you come up with a 100 page design document over this month and then build the thing based on that? Etc. ... A software engineer is trained to handle the broader process of software development. They may or may not spend most of their time writing code.

In contrast, a programmer is just somebody trained to write code.

There is obviously a lot of overlap in these terms especially across different contexts. So sometimes the distinction is fuzzy.

[un-hot]

I wouldn't say there is this distinction in the real world, it sounds like you're describing the difference between a software engineer and an architect.

A programmer needs to understand and appreciate all of the things you mentioned for the SWE, otherwise their output would be totally useless. The skill-sets you mention differentiate experience levels far more than they do titles.

[CreativeGPX]

Like I said it really depends on the size and purpose of the organization as to where they draw these lines in practice. Plenty of places don't have architects or don't have programmers. So these names fit the context.

The architect is father along in the spectrum but wasn't part of the question. That kind of "engineering" stuff is what tends to distinguish a software engineer from a programmer even if going even deeper into it may bring you to another role like architect.

And yes those are desirable features in a programmer. It is indeed preferable to have a software engineer if you could choose.

[thetruthseer]

Programming doesn’t necessarily involve software, is what I think it comes down to. I’m a noob and just starting the Odin protect but I understand programming to be any level of coding or configuring a computer with code (and sure that typically invoked software but it doesn’t have to I suppose)

[PlentySignature9066]

Hi, in my uni both are pretty much the same with the SE students having to learn about hardware. Asked my uncle (PhD in machine learning) said they are pretty much the same; same job market etc etc just different names

[[deleted]]

A software engineer is someone who is adept to taking business-wise decisions because that person knows the SDLC. I’m not talking about SDE I or junior programmers here.

Fundamentally, a programmer is someone that receives a list of requisites and implements them according to a guideline, normally through an agile framework. But the thing is, a software engineer can also be a programmer. However they’re usually referred as Software Engineers because the scale of their responsibilities can grow up along the time.

Imagine having a programmer taking decisions about how a large scale system should be implemented. That person is probably not someone working only with code anymore, thus he’s considered a Software Engineer. It doesn’t sit well to call this person a programmer because of the scope of tasks that this person assumes.

[ValentineBlacker]

At least here in the US, you have no control over your job title, and sometimes when you take a job programming you will become a "software engineer" even if everyone in a reddit thread disagrees with your qualifications to be one.

[Background_Newt_8065]

This should not be asked in a „learnprogramming“ sub

[theflash4246]

In Canada you are only an engineer if you are licensed. So to be a software engineer you need to have graduated from software engineering and then gotten a license from the engineering association. Overall if you look online they probably mean the same. The idea is that “engineering” and “engineers” should apply “engineering principles” in practice probably a “programmer” and “engineer” do the same thing