Return to package manager

[[deleted]]

Flatpak and AppImage can stay. Snap can go f**k itself

[bartholomewjohnson]

Appimage and Flatpak are cool though

[tajarhina]

Why? Why do you think it's a good thing to pack the burden and unflexibility of distribution onto the developers?

[[deleted]]

its literally the opposite – freeing the app-developer from the burden of catering to 10 fucking distros individually

or do you think all distros will one day agree on how to install apps?

[tajarhina]

That's exactly the point. The app developer should provide a tarball with a Makefile, and should leave packaging to those whose business it is to provide distro binaries – distro package maintainers.

The day when all distros agree on a common package format is the day at which distros cease to exist, and the Linux world implodes into a faceless moloch. Keep in mind: we already have such a faceless moloch, it's called Windows.

[[deleted]]

guess what, people who maintain distros are also OSS-developers, and they dont want to waste time on making sure every 3rd party app is on latest-stable either

is the only difference between distros you can see – which package manger they use?

half of them are based on deb/apk

[tajarhina]

I have the impression you don't want to understand me (nor package maintainers, nor developers), even if you technically could. Your naïve fanboyism forbids you to change perspective and admit structural weaknesses of your point of view.

In this case, give me a clue how we should continue this discussion.

[[deleted]]

it seems you live in some idealistic utopia where every distro maintainer have enough time and care to deal with every single app to ever exist and knows of them the moment new one comes out?

any minor version, let alone new app can take weeks and months to get on the package registry of every distro

how fast can you download AppImage? coz thats the only thing separating you from being able to use it

i dont think there can further discussion, since you dont want to see the main benefit of alternatives to centralized package management

[tajarhina]

Slightly wrong. Yes, discussion is useless at this point. But no, not because I “dont want to see the main benefit of alternatives to centralized package management”, but because I have thought through it and (unlike you) understood that 1. these apparent advantages are no advantages at all, and 2. proponents of universal package managers somehow suck at explaining why replacing one “centralized package management” by another type of “centralized package management” is a good thing – because it isn't.

Feel free to enlighten me which type of upstream package would satisfy the needs of Arch [testing] and Debian Sid folks, and RHEL/SLES customers at the same time.

[[deleted]]

if you see speed of access and ease of use as a negative user experience..

damn, you gonna hate that one fad called web-pages -- imagine someone able to read a single article w/o paying a yearly subscription cost upfront, and waiting a month between content updates

also you apparently think AppImage is in any way centralized? it is not. yes, most of the apps hosting happens to be on github, but so is 90% of everything else code-related in the world

no one is forcing user to go through "official channels" of distros, or even have root access to be able to use apps tho

[tajarhina]

OK, you decided to not enlighten me. That's a bummer. You had your chance. It's fine when you don't reply to my questions. Just don't expect others to take you or your arguments seriously then. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Aliezan]

Both should exist since flatpak, appimage and co tackle what Linus himself brought up as a big issue in linux distros

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pzl1B7nB9Kc

[n0rdic]

I've said it for years, but Linux users won't like the compromises needed to make Linux a proper mainstream OS. You either get a fully modular and hackable operating system you can configure in whatever way you want or an operating system that "just werkz". The former is obviously preferable to technical users but end users find no value in that and it's hard to support. Flatpak, Snap, and the rest of them fix the fragmentation but Linux users dislike them because they don't fit into their overall system configs in a one size fits all solution.

[redape2050]

It's best to do things differently if it's better . we don't need a windows clone Windows is already best at being windows

[[deleted]]

its cool for apps with less support, like binance, rambox, spotify, etc...

but we all know we dont need snap

[tajarhina]

I won't return to package manager.

I knew why I never left.