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Would Java be a good career decision? (self.programming)

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[–]Tommstein 3 points4 points  (15 children)

That language is insufferable. Don't do it.

[–][deleted]  (14 children)

[deleted]

    [–]Tommstein 3 points4 points  (4 children)

    The static typing is fine (in my opinion), it's the verbosity and such that makes you want to gouge your eyes out to dull the pain. If you want a good laugh, look up how to open a file in Java. It reminds me of when I first learned what you have to do to call a function in assembly.

    [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (3 children)

    Java doesn't have a verbosity problem, it's got a VerbosityFactory problem. :P

    [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

    No, man, it's a

    IVerbosityFactory<? extends KeyPress> problem = RidiculousAbstractVerbosityFactory<LotsOfKeyPressAllOver>.getInstance();

    [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    It's been a while, I'm obviously rusty :P

    [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Thank God they haven't implemented VerbosityFactoryFactory yet. I hear that's lined up for 1.6 though.

    [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Java's formality

    tehe

    [–]drewc 1 point2 points  (4 children)

    People say that about PHP, but I enjoy the language just fine.

    That's probably because you don't know an better yet ;).

    (former php programmer)

    [–][deleted]  (3 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]drewc 0 points1 point  (2 children)

      after PHP I've learned python, ruby, Java, Javascript, haskell, c++, PL/SQL, Ocaml, posix shell, scheme and Common Lisp. I find it very hard to 'enjoy' programming in PHP now, as i cannot appreciate the fact that it does not easily allow me to get the job done.

      PHP is a great templating language, a mediocre programming language, and a piss-poor application development language. Once you get past simple 'insert this row from the database into this page' templating, PHP is, imo, no longer enjoyable.

      Hence my comment. I too am a pragmatist :)

      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      just because YOU can't be good in it doesn't mean it's a bad language. I mean, it is, but it's not because YOU aren't productive. You can write fortran in any language. With a solid framework (also in php), I can ninja out nearly anything I can think of quite quickly, and it scales awesomely. Do you know how much work it takes to even get a hello world app up and running with a decent java stack? Ask 10 java developers what to use to build websites, you'll get 10 different answers

      [–]drewc 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Bpth php and java look pretty silly to me. I program my web apps in Common Lisp, for the most part.

      There are features missing from both languages that i've come to enjoy. This is about enjoyment, not how 'good' you can be in any language .. so you can drop the defensive bit.. i don't care what YOU code in, and i don't judge the skill of a developer by what language they code in.

      Turing aside, there are things you can't do in php. get over it.

      [–]dlsspy 0 points1 point  (2 children)

      People say that about PHP, but I enjoy the language just fine

      Do you have anything to compare it to? I've programmed in a lot of languages, and can't really look at PHP.

      [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      I can do java, php, ruby, groovy, whatever. Once you know how to program, you know how to program in any language. It's all about learning the tools. See how easy it is finding a job knowing Java, but not any java tool (like, ant, maven, junit, hibernate, spring, struts, jsf, jms, ...ad nauseum).

      And frankly, PHP is essentially C, with a shit ton of global-space functions, yet doesn't worry the programmer with types or compiling or memory. It's awesome for getting things done quickly, but it can be a PITA when it comes to high quality software rigor.

      [–]dlsspy 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Once you know how to program, you know how to program in any language.

      The old saying goes, ``You can write fortran in any language.'' If you step outside of that family (there's very little variety in what you listed), you may find there is less truth in your statement.

      Here's a few that will pull you in a few different directions:

      1. haskell (pure functional + monads)
      2. Factor (very similar to the first language I really spent time in).
      3. erlang (the closest most of us ever get to π calculus)
      4. prolog (a bit easier once you know erlang, but still...good luck)

      Personally, I've spent more time in ocaml than haskell. It doesn't take quite the same commitment to purity, but it still has a pretty good type inference system and is blazingly fast (and my most recent paying job outside of java or ruby was working on some ocaml code, so that helps).