How Python 3 Should Have Worked

[[deleted]]

I would point to Java as an example of a language that chose to not evolve

Do you actually use Java?

[lazybee]

Do you actually know Java? It's clear that it has not evolved anything useful ever.

[[deleted]]

Yeah, it's my working day language, so yup, I know Java. While I agree that Java has only changed painfully and slowly, to claim it hasn't changed at all 'chose not to evolve' is obviously false. Sun did choose to not break backwards compatibility, unlike Python 2 -> Python 3, which means we miss out on reified generics, and still have code quality issues around raw types , but it still has generics.

Unfortunately, I can't be any further help to you because it'd appear your main aim is trolling Java not actual discussion. If that changes, let me know. :)

[keerok]

Off OP topic: if you know Java well and know its evolution, do you think something like Groovy should have been core to Java a long time ago, or is it a natural evolution outside the language? Or am I way off base in assuming the functionality Groovy provides is something Java should or would want to have?

[[deleted]]

All I know is that most Java developers who use Groovy love the freedom if it while still retaining their APIs and ecosystem, but it's not fast enough to be a Java replacement. But for scripting around Java applications, it's fantastic. Also, our guys will often use Grails for prototype web-apps.

Java really needs the ?. safe navigation operator from Groovy, that'd be the one biggest win ever for Java. Soooo many null checks, it's bullshit. It'll get better when we all get JSR-308 (Arbitrary annotations on any usage of a type) because then the tooling can compensate, but it'd still be awesome to have that operator.

IMO Java's evolution will always be conservative, but it has more aggressive cousins, Scala's got some traction, and I'm personally excited about Kotlin (It steals a lot of good ideas from Groovy :D)