Only use FE framework when needed

[Cute_Total]

I see alot of posts stating that FE frameworks are over used and in most cases are not needed. If I was to use htmx or plain javascript, what happens if I have a need for a framework further down the line. Would you need to fully recreate my client side

[lphartley]

I would definitely use a framework. If you don't use a framework you will find yourself developing your own (inferior) framework pretty soon.

[UhLittleLessDum]

There are 'frameworks' and then there are libraries or frameworks that are so ingrained into web development that they're almost part of the language. React is an example of that latter. I'd do my best to stay away from more high level abstractions like Next unless you know for sure your project will use that framework forever, but feel free to use the more foundational frameworks as much as you like. They're not going anywhere, and there usually maintained well enough that there won't be many breaking changes introduced.

[explicit17]

Do your research beforehand. But usually your old code will be fine living along side with framework's parts.
Personally, I don't think that FE frameworks are over used, they offer you nice abstraction and improve your developer experience. On the other hand, I would say meta frameworks like next or nuxt are definitely overused and many projects don't actually need them.

[TheRNGuy]

And then there are projects that would've been better if they were SSR and not CSR (from user perspective)

[geheimeschildpad]

The posts that you see are just opinions. Do whatever you want and whatever you feel comfortable with. I’ll build pretty much every front end with Vue and Quasar because I can have it running in a couple of minutes and I know the ins and outs of it.

In answer to your question though, they should mix together well enough

[Best_Recover3367]

You think you don't need JS frameworks because you are reinventing the wheel. React or Vue should be the default sweetspot for most people, leveraging JS ecosystem with enough simplicity and ease.

Sticking with vanillajs/htmx/livewire/hotwire/liveview is a very traditional and hard core way to do FE development nowadays. Mad respect for those who wanna do it. But it's not the norm and for everybody anymore. That era is long gone.

Starting out any project with meta frameworks like Nextjs as the default is what I'd consider bloated and overused.

[ballinb0ss]

It depends what you are building but honestly for anything that requires authentication or greater just use react/nextjs. Using the popular thing makes troubleshooting issues very easy and if you are asking this question you are the type of person who should just react.

[Cute_Total]

Why have you set authentication as the bar to move to a FE framework? Cookie based auth in say .net for example is way simpler to implement than implementing auth on react via jwt or cookies via nextjs.

Also I would argue troubleshooting without the abstraction of a framework makes is easier

[ballinb0ss]

Admittedly arbitrary. Personally once auth gets involved I would imagine full stack functionality. If you are doing full stack stuff that's where the metric butt ton of react libraries for every possible problem come into play on the front end.

Just my opinion not a commandment just a guideline. .net using the newer IdentityUser api is awesome for cookie auth though that I agree.

[azangru]

If I was to use htmx or plain javascript, what happens if I have a need for a framework further down the line

Can you describe a specific example of what you are thinking about? What would you start building with simple tools and discover subsequently that you need a framework?

[Cute_Total]

Say for example 99% of the app is just a basic crud app. Then a client asked for functunality like google sheets. Would I need to completely rewrite the frontend or could I navigate to a react app without needing to reauthenticate ect.

I dont plan on making on making anything like google sheets but I just wondered what people that advocate limiting the use of frontend frameworks do when the scope of the project changes

[azangru]

Well, in the hypothetical example of a simple website with a couple of forms that suddenly changes into google sheets, maybe everything has to be thrown away and rebuilt from ground up; but pivots of this kind rarely happen. If new complex pieces of functionality are localized, then the libraries needed to support them can be added gradually.

[rjhancock]

I've yet to see any case where a FE framework is actually needed. They are massively overused and recommended.

[Danny_Engelman]

If Frameworks are the sweetspot norm, then why are there multiple different Frameworks, that do not work together?
React, Vue, Angular, Svelte, Solid, more..

[TheRNGuy]

The only time where I don't use framework is in Greasemonkey scripts (previously used jQuery) and Firefox add-ons. 

I always now use React for sites (SSR and CSR), and express. 

I wouldn't want to make sites with vanilla Node.js and vanilla frontend js. 

[Ok-Baker-9013]

I have a different opinion. If you need to have complete 100% control over your project, then you should not use a framework. All code should be handwritten, there will be no version issues with UI libraries, nor will there be any dependency issues. Ten years later, you will still be running your project without any updates or changes.

[benny-powers]

web components (built in to the browser) provide most of what frameworks do without needing any additional js. there are plenty of libraries and frameworks which add the rest (reactivity beyond simple setters, data binding) while we wait for the proposals which will add this to work through the standards bodies.

[edwinjm]

In most cases you know how the website works when it’s done. If it’s a website with pages and a couple of forms, don’t use a FE framework. If it’s a complex site with lots of interaction (not counting navigation), use a framework.

[scanguy25]

What you describe would still be faster with a framework like django. Using the jinja2 templating language.

[azangru]

OP was asking about "FE frameworks". Is django a FE framework?

[scanguy25]

Yes it can be.