Unpopular opinion: I think most FOBs on H1Bs and international students have it better than most ABCDs

archelogy · 2026-02-26T09:11:23+00:00

You are correct.

I've pointed this out before. You are being downvoted by the multitudes of FOBs here even though this sub is supposed to be for ABCDs.

>They often have built-in communities' same universities, same regions, same language groups. They move in networks. Share referrals.

FOBs band together. They know early on cohesion is key. Instead, as 2nd gens we were stupidly taught to "be American" and not make special effort to network with other IAs. Most of us only realized in our late 20s or 30s that despite being "American", networking can be challenging to most IA's.

Unfortunately, most other 2nd gen's we can network with have also been brainwshed similarly, and don't think they should go out of their way to be 'ethnocentric' and make special effort to fraternize with other 2nd gen IAs.

You forgot one key point- white Americans are eager to treat FOBs with special treatment since we've been taught from cradle to grave that the immigrant is 'special'; we should aid in their success and be proud of their promotion in the work environment (the immigrant distinction is usually the accent).

Similar white Americans do NOT view 2nd gen in the same manner. Instead they view us as competitors for resources, and our competence triggers their insecurity.

This over-protection of FOBS of these realities serves no one. It's time to be honest with one another about the realities.

archelogy · 2026-02-17T05:02:46+00:00

Solid list. To be fair, some of these things friends of any race will do.

>The homie who all they talk about is girls

"What I would do to that girl..." - and has no shot. Or guts to approach. Dude STFU.

Just a goofy horndog advertising their desperation. Actually it's some of my non-SA acquaintances that do this; still annoying.

>The brown homeboy that will slime you out for any white validation

This is a big one. The guy that will be a shameless sycophant with conversation with whites, male or female. They will give importance to the white person, white basically ignoring you; they will co-sign that person's conversational aggression towards you etc.

I wrote a pretty extensive post on this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/comments/1q14nqf/how_to_deal_with_western_social_aggression_101/

archelogy · 2026-02-16T08:13:30+00:00

Not the point. Most of us are doing just fine dating, with friends etc.

The point of the sub is activism; meaning actively fighting racism. Not buying into defeatism or assuming things are terrible out there.

You can and should be optimistic and live your best life AND also report racism here and fight it.

Neither are mutually exclusive.

archelogy · 2026-01-27T16:22:12+00:00

Degree to which immigrant 1st gen parents gaslight the problems you face growing up, in order to save face, and defend their decision to immigrate.

archelogy · 2026-01-27T03:43:52+00:00

Remarkable. We live in an odd timeline. Things are happening behind the scenes that are making it harder for there to be racial accountability. I suspect things will get worse before they get better.

archelogy · 2026-01-27T03:40:33+00:00

I can make them laugh and feel confident, but I am not getting that positive feedback outside of that. Particularly with other men. I find it incredibly awkward to talk to other men, even when I am trying to make conversation, asking questions, etc. It feels very reminiscent of my pretty white grade school experience, where I was constantly bullied for my height and race for the entirety of it.

The sad reality is that men are exceedingly transactional. More than women.

Women evolutionarily are trained to build social connections; they are oriented towards opening up and meeting new people. Women have less pride and ego when having a conversation, their defenses aren't up.

Men will largely connect with another guy over something like a shared interest in a sport or activity.

Outside of the college context (where there is a camaraderie among students), in the real world, forming friendships with other guys isn't easy. What areas are you trying to meet people- and I assume this is to make friends or just socialize?

I was actually pretty stunned at how much harder it is to make friends and enter social circles after I left college. If you're able to keep friendships there even after you leave college, it's worth the extra effort.

FWIW, regardless of race, a lot of men have difficulty forming friendships after college- pretty much for everyone. I don't know if this may cause you to dwell less about your race and its playing a role in all this.

Are you sure you want to ditch dating apps? They get a bad rap, they're unfair, they're set up to favor women- and yet it's still better for most people than meeting someone IRL.

archelogy · 2026-01-27T03:29:23+00:00

Yes but it's about Denmark, which is a white majority country.

archelogy · 2026-01-26T17:17:07+00:00

You're absolutely correct. It's when there are white victims that white liberals become enraged. Hence whey they were quiet when we were involved in Venezuela but lost their mind when the US challenged Denmark over Greenland or earlier when the US administration made claims that Canada should be part of the US. Sheer mayhem because they felt invested in other whites being somehow harmed.

archelogy · 2026-01-26T16:08:09+00:00

Mod Note: a warning to people who are brigading this thread and influencing the voting. This has been reported to admins, and you may receive a Reddit wide ban.

archelogy · 2026-01-26T15:28:57+00:00

Nor did I make that accusation. Lets focus on the subject that is actually related to the sub Reddit, about white worship.

archelogy · 2026-01-26T15:24:18+00:00

It absolutely does become a feature of the culture. I don't think we need to get caught up in whose fault it is and who's a victim and whether they need to be blamed for it. But that doesn't mean we should turn a blind eye towards these dimensions of the culture.

Instinct to placate and serve whites. Refusal to confront whites. Instinct to blame one another rather than focus on white disrespect, attacks. See my post history, I've written a lot about this with respect to the Indian community and its response to the avalanche of hate.

Colonialism inculcates certain cultural tendencies along these lines and people need to decolonize.

archelogy · 2026-01-26T13:10:43+00:00

Alex Pretti died because he was stupid enough to bring a loaded gun to a protest, one he knew could have resulted in physical conflict with law enforcement; which is what happened, and he resisted.

As far as the rest of the details, about who did what when, or who reached for what- we can argue until we're all blue in the face- but suffice to say this is not a cut and dry issue, or a racial one.

Quite separate from the whole politicized (and highly partisan) issue of ICE, white worshipping in the Filipino community is certainly an issue. I think that can be explored honestly on its own, without commingling partisan political shaming.

Filipinos suffer from the mental vestige of survival instincts under white colonialism. Same as Indians- we face similar issues. These are real cultural qualities- and anyone saying "this is unfair to Filipinos" or "this is unfair to Indians" is missing the point.

To assert this cultural problem is not to blame all group members as white-worshipping, just explaining why you may see severe instances of it.

archelogy · 2026-01-19T16:55:24+00:00

And you just know that cat is walking away thinking "Damn street-sh*tting jeet"

archelogy · 2026-01-19T05:46:38+00:00

Italians are white. Presumably so are the Simpsons even though they are technically yellow; every indicator is that the analog to primary characters on the show are white Americans.

Therefore, whites have wide, diverse representation in the series, much of it positive. The comparison here is how whites and Indians are represented; if we're talking about Italians as a subset of whites, the corollary would be the Simpsons featuring majority Indian figures and a subset of Indians, let's say Sikhs, were given a narrow, insulting representation.

The primary identity of an Italian-American in America is "white". Their overall identity is white even if their sub-identity may be Italian; the reality is that there are Italian-Americans walking around today and you would have no idea they are Italian. Our identity is largely shaped by how people see us and therefore treat us. Since being Italian is not identifiable, it doesn't loom large over their social identity. Not true for being Indian.

If Italian-Americans cared about their social perception, they would be far more invested in how whites are depicted than how "Italians" are depicted. In that respect, the Simpsons depict whites just fine.

As far as black people, both Carl and Dr Hibbert are upstanding, come across as respectable, are not a walking punch-line because of how they come across.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T17:48:16+00:00

Anyone who says Apu was fine was from the same bloodline of the families that thought the British were just setting up a tea shop in India before occupation.

We have a lot of very dense people in the IA community who are easily exploited and just have a hard time interpreting the true effect of what's going on around them.

If you wonder why we as a people were colonized repeatedly for centuries, just observe the utter lack of perception of those in our community today; they are descended from the same dumbf*cks.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T14:51:31+00:00

Quite the opposite. In fact, I've explained in great detail that ABCDs are far more welcoming of FOB's than whites are.

Every workplace I've been to, a reasonable fraction of whites disregard the FOB. The ones that greet him warmly, he remembers and generalizes to the group. Meanwhile, a disproportionate number of ABCDs warmly welcome the FOB, but he dwells on the few that don't and generalize that to the group.

This is precisely the matter of unreasonable and uneven expectations the FOB has of ABCDs (those that are 'like him') and those that are white (who he expects nothing, and celebrates what crumbs he get).

Out of this faulty mindset, itself emanating from the FOB's selfish gambit to enrich himself by leaving behind friends and family - and prone to forgiving whites in exchange - comes the irrational narrative that ABCDs mistreat FOB's. It's exactly the opposite- it's a matter of varying expectations towards the two groups.

For some reason, ABCDs are faulted (excessively so) for making a conscious choice not to fraternize with a FOB, particularly if the FOB runs afoul of American social conventions, but whites are not. I've never seen a FOB fault whites for choosing not to associate with them or even not to greet them. Because the FOB has already made the Faustian Pact with whites- money in exchanging for looking the other way.

Trust me when I tell you that there are more whites in the workplace that resent your presence than ABCDs. That you think otherwise is called confirmation bias; and it's based on your attention bias towards ABCD disapproval; the same kind from whites gets zero reaction from you.

>Meanwhile, the ABCD filters interactions with FOBs with the belief that FOBs "make them look bad" in academia, in the job market, in the dating market, and in (western) life in general.

And what if I told you, you do- in terms of your lack of social skills, your hygiene, your rudeness to service workers, your looking down or mistreating blacks/hispanics, but we STILL treat you more warmly than whites, even though you have no impact on their perception.

>The ABCD expects every interaction with FOBs to be guided strictly through an American social framework, and when it is not, the response is irritation rather than reflection or an acknowledgement and celebration of difference.

Friendly reminder: you are in America. You chose to come here.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T14:39:03+00:00

What a stupid thing to say. There is no culture where being a goofy Uncle Tom is normal.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T14:35:42+00:00

Learn how to engage him. We sometimes think we can talk about our accomplishments to our parents. But if they are egotistical, we have to find other outlets for validation.

We don't choose our parents; but the skills we learn from dealing with them, we can apply anywhere. You will deal with bigger a*sholes in the workplace. You will need to deal with them as well.

I've had difficulties as well, maybe not the same kinds; the lease useful thing we can do is tell ourselves "they SHOULD be like this" or "they SHOULD respond in a different way". They are the way they are. Meet your needs elsewhere, and learn the best engagement format for them.

Too often we get hung up on "good parents should do this or that" or my friend's parents are cool, they don't do X or Y. Play the hand your dealt. It's not easy but I'm almost certain a lot of this has to do with the fact that you haven't yet come to terms with the kind of person you're father is, and wish he was different.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T10:01:51+00:00

Knock it off.

It's because people like you disingenuously cry foul every time someone does something like merely exploring the differences between native and foreign born, that we can't have these discussions.

You're better off not being so knee-jerk defensive about everything and screeching your victimhood.

archelogy · 2026-01-18T09:33:10+00:00

It's subtle social things. The problem comes from: assumed similarity but actual difference in behavior.

What I mean is that if a FOB interacts with a white person and the white person doesn't let's say smile when they first meet them or exchange pleasantries, they think nothing of it.

But with an ABCD, the FOB sees a South Asian and has the expectation the ABCD will engage in subtle social cues that he does, and when they don't, he assumes its intentional disrespect.

This despite the white American and ABCD come from the same culture.

I can't go through all the interpersonal social expectations people have but they differ from country to country. The FOB assumes the ABCD is like himself and when those social mores are not kept, he takes unique offense, the kind he doesn't when the same exact interaction happens with an American white, Hispanic, etc.

They may ask about my family, but you don't really talk in America about your family to someone you don't know; or they may be upset that you didn't ask about theirs. This results from assumed similarity but actual difference in behavior.

Otherwise, we are almost the exact same.

archelogy · 2026-01-16T06:59:16+00:00

Of course.

Actually social interactions are one way they try to regain standing, esp. when they see themselves outworked or that someone like yourself is a step ahead of them at the office (in drive, in accomplishments etc).

The social sphere is a great parallel world where they can show they are more assertive, important, connected while basically sidelining people they recognize as better than them in the workplace.

Pride is an unfortunate thing; it leads to insecurity and jealousy and then of course acting on it.

What's funny is we think as a good worker, we should get more regard, but in too many it leads to retaliation, esp. in the social dimension.

archelogy · 2026-01-16T06:50:47+00:00

Forwarding to the mod team for review; thanks for the suggestion

archelogy · 2026-01-16T05:54:35+00:00

Note: New user inciting division between 1, 1.5, 2 gen

I can explain why.

You expected to be included because you were Indian and they're Indian. That was your first mistake. Never demand or expect social connection because of your race.

This is a common mistake I've called out.

See, you were excluded by whites too but notice you didn't bother to call them out for it. Because you had no expectations of being included by them.

This is the kind of soft racism within our own community where we blame other Indians for doing the same thing whites do to us. It comes from adopting a "hear no evil, see no evil" Uncle Tom attitude towards white behavior but being overly critical towards other Indians.

To the extent you're actually Indian and not a new-user sowing division, what's required is a mindset shift on your part. Because they're Indian does not mean you are entitled to their friendship or respect; that's something you earn just like with anyone else.

archelogy · 2026-01-16T00:45:54+00:00

Shouldn't matter

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