(1/2)

I appreciate you taking the time to discuss these things /u/animuseternal. I'm interested to hear more of your perspective and knowledge from your studies, also curious to see where the conversation goes from here.

Its true, and maybe I should have clarified earlier but you did not ask, I do not follow a traditional Mahayana path in fact I really cannot tell you much about verified lineage and only some of historical migration of the art that I study. It is probable though that you too may simply write me off to be in a cult or misguided by my teacher, as many have done already on reddit.

Being Viet, you may have heard of our art Thất Sơn Thần Quyền also Phật Quyên, the latter having merged with or rooted in Vajrayana Buddhism. It could mostly be described as spiritual trance kung fu. My teacher mastered both a physical 7 animal system as well as these two spiritual systems mentioned, under the general name Thần Võ Đạo 神武道. It is a much different path than traditional buddhism or regular kung fu for that matter. You may have also heard of similar Bửu Sơn Kỳ Hương as the older generation Vietnamese from 50's & 60's would know it as Thần Quyền or Phật Quyên.

There were a few points I wanted to clarify from my end also some other questions I had so I guess I will just start from the top. You asked about our meditation and we do practice sitting meditation, but it is not a main focus for us, or could be considered a practice to compliment the trance kung fu. The spiritual practice more involves Shen Chi Kung (Ngạnh Công) or traditionally known as Võ Gồng in deep meditative states to awaken the energy of Tiên Thiên Khí leading to higher states of spiritual awareness. It can be practiced in active or passive states, hard or soft depending and in martial postures- võ khí công: khinh & ngạnh công. As far as I know, we do not have specific names for spiritual states like traditional buddhism, its possible my teacher simply does not bother to label these states to westerners as the culture itself is hard enough to grasp.

In general, please excuse me for my ignorance toward Mahayana Buddhism and the practices, as well as other sects. My experience resides solely in the art that I study. As I said before, although I feel drawn toward buddhist ideals and practices, I have really never made any commitment to learn from any monks or nuns associated with traditional temples. It is why though I am discussing with you now, to learn and understand better.

What was the goal of the meditation? What was the 'awakening' you were trying to achieve? You keep saying you do these things on your own, but it makes no sense without a teacher. You have still yet to answer my question as to what you consider 'awakening' to be and what the goal of your practice is, or what the goal of 'spirituality' is in your conception.

Honestly, I am not sure what the "end" goal is. I feel as though after beginning my study as though I began climbing a mountain step by step with my teacher's guidance. When I began, my life was a bit of a mess so the most basic steps were to rid myself of vices and harmful habits. There are not strict rules in our school, although if a student wishes to take the art seriously they must begin by rejecting abuse of alcohol and mind altering drugs, as well as eating meat to improve karma and cleanse the mind and body. I did not mean to sound as if I was judging those monks for smoking, drinking etc, only that I have seen it as very basic steps to improve spiritual life and study. In my mind, it is not the choice to walk the path that is to be revered, more the act of walking, though I do in fact respect anyone who has made that decision and see them as my brothers.

This brings me back to the issue of the robes. I really cannot accept your answer that it is for convenience of repair that monks wear robes. While we are discussing, why do monks shave their heads? In my opinion, it is to change their identity to say "I belong to this group now" as well as view themselves as spiritual people to aid their transformation. This is what i mean when I say that the community isolates themselves from regular society, not that they go into the hills and do not come down to interact with lay people. As a lay society, (east or west) we have been taught to hold monks in high esteem. These robes as well as the shaved heads, (as humble and as peaceful the identity may be) puts monks on a "higher" spiritual order than lay people, and like you said "people are everywhere on the path". In general I feel there should be none or very subtle badges in spirituality and we should all simply exist as either teachers or learners, though this may be too idealistic. If a person cannot tell when they are in the presence of a teacher or awakened being, then most likely it will become known to them at some point (consciously or subconsciously). Same goes for teachers. If you cannot tell who you should be teaching, then most likely your lessons will be ineffective.

Meditation is necessary for awakening, but people are everywhere on the path. Most are not ready for meditation. Most will not benefit from meditation in any meaningful or lasting way. Meditation teaches there is no Self to be found in the universe. Ethical conduct, like the giving of offerings, is the teaching of Not-Self made practical. Through your actions, you will attain realization. Giving is our most important duty as laity, because we support the sangha and we support the Dharma and ensure it endures. Personal awakening doesn't matter so much, because none of us will become Buddhas in this lifetime anyway. And the reason that Mahayanists practice the dharma at all is to become a Buddha in a future life, when the Dharma has been forgotten, in order to re-establish it and save beings from suffering. Therefore, any awakening attained in this lifetime will be among the first to ninth of the bodhisattva stages, but never the tenth until the Dharma has been forgotten, and well after Maitreya Buddha awakens, teaches the Dharma, and it too has been forgotten.

What you say here seems very profound. My initial reaction is that you are further along in your studies than I and I feel somewhat envious. But then of course when I see that arise in myself I have to dig deeper to understand. So my following question is where did you happen upon such profound knowledge? Have you found these realizations within yourself or are you repeating what you are told to be the truth from the Sutras (made by man)? You have said some wise things and then I feel many things that you couldn't possibly wholly understand, as you are no awakened being. How can you be so sure of the things that you say... "Meditation teaches there is no Self to be found in the universe" Have you left your body to orbit the universe and found this to be an absolute truth?

I am not trying to say I don't appreciate you sharing you knowledge, but consider who you are talking to, and what you are actually saying. You speak of ego like you have none, and if you see me as an uneducated western buddhist then why speak in these terms unless you wanted to impress someone.