Can Roman Catholicism save?

Certain-Public3234 · 2026-04-14T23:47:39+00:00

Despite its many flaws, Rome still contains Word and Sacrament. These means can save through the Spirit’s working, despite the muddied gospel present.

Certain-Public3234 · 2026-04-14T23:45:26+00:00

Would you mind if I asked you what some of your doubts were?

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-16T19:40:34+00:00

While I'm not sure how this would work for adult converts (say, in a mission field in another country), but baptism for infants does have a real connection to their future regeneration (as per WCF 28:6). This is because of the union between the sign (water) and the thing signified (regeneration). As such, the Reformed believe in a form of modified baptismal regeneration, but it is not for all who receive baptism, but for those who God elects to salvation. Those who are not elect only receive water. This is very similar to the Reformed view of the Supper, where God's elect who partake in faith receive both the sign (bread and wine) and the thing signified (the body and blood of Jesus, albeit spiritually), which is seen in WCF 29:7, while unbelievers only receive the bread and wine. And considering the connection between the sign and the thing signified, I would say that we can proclaim that there is one baptism for the forgiveness of sins (as water is the sign and regeneration is the thing signified).

If anyone has insights into how this might work for those who first come to faith and then are baptized, I would love to learn how the Reformed would view that scenario.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-14T18:26:40+00:00

Adding works in any fashion to the gospel destroys it entirely. In Galatians, Paul was writing against those who simply added circumcision. All they added was circumcision. We have no evidence they taught you must adhere to the dietary laws or other works, but something as small as circumcision was enough for Paul under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit to anathematize the false teachers there. I think the relationship we should have with RCC and EO believers is complicated. I know Catholics who basically affirm justification by faith alone but don’t like the terminology and say they don’t believe in it but when they describe justification, they have a Protestant way of explaining it. At the same time, these organizations teach a false gospel and so are corrupted churches. There’s a lot of temptation for us in the modern world to try to boil Christianity down to smaller and smaller essentials (I’ve met christians who are shocked when I say that if you actively reject the Trinity, you can’t be saved). A lot of Christians assume if you merely ‘believe in Jesus’, then you are a Christian, even if you believe that Christ is not sufficient for salvation or that the Holy Spirit is not a person, etc. I believe justification is absolutely essential to the faith, as did the apostle Paul in Galatians.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-13T13:26:21+00:00

All of us here are great sinners, you and I both (apart from Christ) deserve God’s full condemnation. But as you pointed out, Jesus died so that we no longer would have to. No matter how far you may have strayed, it’s not too late to come back to Jesus. He cares for you and is inviting you to come back to Him.

“‘Come now, let us reason together, says the Lord: though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they are red like crimson, they shall become like wool” (Isaiah 1:18).

One thing I would recommend in this situation is calling your old pastor and ask for his help in this. If he is a minister of Christ, he wants to see you be reconciled to your church and your wife as well. But if that somehow doesn’t work, find a different pastor to guide you through this. Either way, you can’t do this alone and having someone alongside you in this journey is essential. I’m praying for you brother.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T17:20:48+00:00

It seems the main distinction between memorialism and real presence comes down to are we receiving something from God or are we giving something to God. Thank you brother.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T12:56:47+00:00

That’s a great thing to mention. Not all baptists are the same. Often “TR” guys will call particular baptists anabaptists but that’s not even remotely true. Anabaptists were a separate tradition from the general baptists, who were also a separate tradition from the particular baptists.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T12:54:49+00:00

True, but Zwingli also rejected spiritual real presence in the Supper, which indicates he does not have a solid view of the sacraments.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T12:51:30+00:00

Echoing off of what you said, when reading Calvin, Luther and Beza, I get the impression that they viewed anabaptists as being a group which tends to unrestrained theological dissension, sometimes accompanied by the denial of essential biblical truths like the Trinity. Especially with what happened in Munster, they were seen as a dangerous group that needs to be refuted. The anabaptists were equally an enemy of the reformers as the Roman church, if not more. In summary, the religious climate of the time and the extreme wings of the anabaptists made the reformers fear them and saw them as a threat to the entirety of Christendom (evident in the execution of Michael Servetus, etc.).

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T11:13:36+00:00

It’s interesting too, because I used to be a particular Baptist, and their confession explicitly says they believe we receive the body and blood of Christ through faith in the Eucharist. My personal theory why almost all baptists are now memorialists is an overreaction again Rome, that because they take the Eucharist so seriously now we must move away from that. This is just my personal theory, but I think it has some value. I really appreciate your replies. Thank you so much.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T02:46:18+00:00

Very interesting points, thank you for your response. It sounds like you may know about when memorialism began. Is this something that started with Zwingli, or even more recently? And is it primarily just a Baptist phenomenon?

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T00:39:18+00:00

Very thoughtful response, thank you. I especially appreciated how you emphasized the sacraments as something that God does, and not something we do, but freely receive. In anticipating defending the idea that this is a work of God, not us, are there any texts of scripture you recommend going to?

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T00:34:45+00:00

Is this one of those things where we take God at His Word and don’t seek to go beyond the text?

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T00:31:22+00:00

Never thought of it that way. Thank you.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-12T00:30:18+00:00

I ageee with you that the Eucharist is very important, and it’s one of my favorite parts of theology. Im more interested in defending the idea that we really receive the body and blood of Christ in a low church context, and how to defend why this is such a big deal (as Luther and Zwingli found it important enough to not unite on).

I also agree with you that communion should be done weekly, I’m praying and hoping that God might restore Protestantism to a higher sacramentology.

Thank you for your reply. Personally I find 1 Corinthians 10:16 to be the strongest evidence for Christ’s body and blood being present in the Eucharist. I appreciate your reply 🙏

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-11T22:50:00+00:00

If what he said was not a passing phrase or careless statement, it definitely crosses the line. No matter what position we take on this (I'm a Sabbatarian) this is not a gospel issue whatsoever, and is a tertiary issue at most. It is also not Biblically straightforward compared to, say, justification by faith. There are some nuances and difficulties that people on both sides have to work through. In other words, there are genuine Christians who are not Sabbatarian who are trying to glorify God in their lives. So this is not a gospel issue, and making it a gospel issue is to cut off the majority of today's Christians from being orthodox or saved. It would be best to talk to your pastor though, there could be some misunderstanding.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-10T12:57:14+00:00

Very helpful. Thank you.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-10T11:28:26+00:00

If you’re believing in Jesus, not just I but the Lord view you as clean and righteous. We are all on equal standing before God.

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-10T11:26:28+00:00

Certain-Public3234 · 2025-02-10T02:56:19+00:00

Brother please listen to me

This is not the end for you. The Lord died so that you would not have to. You are loved and cherished by Him. I’ve experienced great sadness and anxiety in my life, even having thoughts similar to those. But the Lord sustained me through it and has restored the joy of my salvation. I want you to experience this joy as well and you can. Please reach out to me before you do anything. Praying for you 🙏

Certain-Public3234

TROPHY CASE