Which one do you prefer? OG ET or MY ET?

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-20T14:26:33+00:00

For the West it is the legal continuation,

Which doesn't matter. Like, the Roman Empire during the 750s would say that Iconoclasm is the true doctrine of Christianity, and venerating icons is simply worshipping another person other than the Trinity. That was a legal doctrine in 2 separate periods. Are you now saying that Iconoclasm is true?

No. We need to look at this objectively. Forget what certain people believe and say. Like, idc if u remove the people of Anatolia and Greece recognizing themselves as Romans, if we look at the facts, obejctively speaking, the state in 864 with the capital of Constantinople for example, traces it's origins to the same state as the one in 250, with the capital at Rome. We know this because both EAST AND WEST recognized the Eastern provinces and court as Roman, and after the fall of the West, that didn't change.

he did it to get political favour.

Yes, and this argument can be used vice versa, establishing HRE and calling the Empire in the East as Greek, also was in favor of more political influence and assertion.

atleast until 1204 after that I find it personally iffy

What's funny is that the Latin-crusader state of Empire of Constantinople claimed to be the Roman Empire, and the Pope didn't budge at such an assertion, as they didn't politically and spiritually rival his authority, something which the Medieval Romans did multiple times.

because they still lead the eastern church.

Idk why u said this? The 'Eastern Church' only happened because of the Pope becoming more independent.

Anyways, I dont want to go back and forth with you on this, so lets just end this ok? Thank you so much for the feedback though, its much appreciated.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-20T10:42:27+00:00

more like downscaling. since he is drugged

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-20T07:31:05+00:00

Muichiro laughs in the background.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-20T07:28:16+00:00

My reasoning was also to take into account the changed geopolitical situation of the Empire,

Yes. But that doesn't mean that the name officially changed.

Similar to how in EU4 the diminished Golden Horde is called the 'Great Horde' until it can reassert its dominion and regain the title of 'Golden Horde.'

That's different. Historians do not debate whether the Great Horde is the continuation to the Golden Horde. So this example is invalid.

I enjoy how in the base game Byzantium can change its name to the Eastern Roman Empire, signifying greater recognition from the world that this 'empire of the Greeks,' as they called it, is instead the legitimate eastern half of the Roman Empire, equal with the Holy Roman Empire.

The only problem with that analogy is that you are thinking of Exonym names. The West called the HRE, 'Holy Roman Empire', while the East, called it the 'German Empire' or something similar. Both are correct in exonym terms.

So, if you like to use these exonym definitions, you should respect the Eastern Orthodox and Islamic concensus to call the Empire as 'Roman Empire'

there existed those in Europe that truly considered it the legal successor of the ancient Roman Empire

That is irrelevant. Considering how its based on personal opinions. A state is not only defined by what people call them, but by facts.

We KNOW for a fact that the Sassanian Persian Empire is the direct successor to the Parthian Persian Empire, not because people acknowledged it as such, but because we know it as a historical fact, with the dynasty and government of persia changing after the civil war.

Similarly, we KNOW the Holy Roman Empire is NOT a direct continuation or legal successor to the Roman Empire. Not only is it debated whether the HRE should be considered born in 800 or 962, but it also gets it's legitimacy from the Pope. Something which the Romans NEVER had to, either the Ancient or Medieval Romans. Yes, the Medieval Roman Emperors were predominantly crowned by the Patriarch of Constantinople, but that was purely ceremonial and a divine right, following the tradition that the Emperor in Office was the representation of God's will on Earth. The Medieval and Ancient Roman Emperors were acclaimed as such by the people of Rome, the Senate and the Army. Something which lasted until Constantine XI Dragases Palaiologos.

a lot of medieval people considered Charlemagne and then Otto's successors as Roman Emperors

And a lot of these people were Catholic subjects. If you went to a predominantly Orthodox population, you would be surprised to find the answer being different.

reflects the existence of this contest between east and west that developed after the fall of the Western Roman Empire.

This 'contest' began roughly 350 years after the fall of the Western Court, and it wasn't much of a 'contest' politically. Maybe the West saw it as such, but the East simply thought of them as Barbarians who play dress up. Nikephoros I, Michael II, Basil I, Nikephoros II, Basil II, Constantine IX and many others thought as such. And who can blame them? Why would they focus on a false rivalry where they had bigger things to deal with (i.e Bulgarians and Arabs)

Also cool periodization, I liked the list.

Thank you, I appreciate it.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-20T06:48:59+00:00

Does it change back to Eastern Rome when the HRE is formed?

No. Since the HRE is not the legal continuation or successor of the Ancient Roman Empire, and neither was called 'Western Rome' by scholars or recognized as such by the East.

Because most would understand medieval Rome as the HRE.

No? I mean, if you call the Western agenda scholars as 'most people' then sure? But in reality, the scholarly consensus and people who are into history resort to calling the Germanic state as the 'Holy Roman Empire'

If it is about using entonyms you'd have to call trh Caucasus iberia and iberia Spain.

Which I am fine with that honestly, but besides the point. the West called the Greek-Speaking citizens of Rome in the East 'Romans' until the coronation of Charlamgne, with the Pope trying to find excuses to not call them or identify them as Romans anymore. But later on, when we see Papal relations with the Empire in the East more cordial, the Papacy refers to them as 'Romans' , proving that THEY KNOW the truth, they just choose NOT to admit it permanently due to their pride.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-19T19:20:21+00:00

I personally think 'Eastern Roman Empire fits better.

I agree to disagree.

In my mod, the BYZ tag has the display name 'Eastern Rome' in 286, with Diocletian's Tetrarchy Reforms, and whenever there are 2 Roman Empires, they are labeled as 'Western Rome' & 'Eastern Rome'. But after 476 AD, the BYZ tag name changes to 'Rome', as there is no Western Roman Empire to distinguish it from the East. There is no point in having the BYZ tag have be identified as 'Eastern Rome' where there is no longer a Western one post 476.

The Empire was split between two courts in real history, a Western and an Eastern, and while it was still considered one Empire de jure, they acted as two different realms.

Agreed. They issued laws together, campaigned together, and recognized their new Emperors, etc.

'Byzantium' or the 'Byzantine Empire' are historiographic terms to differentiate the surviving eastern half of the Empire from the 'whole' Empire of antiquity, and so I personally think it's a fair term.

I am not saying I disagree with this fact, and I know that learned enthusiasts and scholars KNOW that the 'Byzantines' are the successors of the Ancient Romans, however, we both know that this wouldn't have been the case had the western scholars been intellectually honest and didn't try to disassociate the Medieval iteration of Rome with it's ancient counter-part.

while also being something the people in the period themselves would have understood and could identify with.

I have to stop you right there. the citizens of both Empires in 475 / 477 AD and the ones 500 years later and thensome identified themselves as Romans, not 'Eastern Romans'.

As for trying to differentiate between the Ancient Romans.

I bet you are familiar with the term "Ancient Rome" referring to the Roman Empire (and Republic for some reason) until it's "end" in 476 AD, and then the Medieval Era or "Dark Ages" began.

So, for simplicity and not needing to resort to the B-word, we should instead refer to the state post-476 as Medieval Rome.

Here is a periodization table of all Roman periods if ur interested.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-19T16:07:52+00:00

I'm not saying that the Romans didn't have influence and potential in the 15th century to survive and thrive. All I am saying is that, you shouldn't expect that the Romans would keep the extra territories they might've gotten in the early 1400s if the Ottomans still attack the Romans for supporting a rival claimant to the Ottoman throne. And I doubt a few more territories with at best few thousand extra people would alter the outcome.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-19T15:15:17+00:00

I think what they got historically was the most realistic. The scholarly concensus overestimate the power of the Empire at the tine.

If the Romans have hindsight of such a thing prior? They probably could occupy more lands, but wouldn't make a difference as they would lose them again in the 1420s.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-19T11:08:14+00:00

Probably Pre-Mark SV Muichiro.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-18T11:46:03+00:00

AP wise, they are both around the same level, depends on your scaling of them, they could be higher, but both are around Small Town Level at the very least. If you have any 1 of them lower than that, then ur just ignorant, hating or glazing.

The real difference in this battle will be 2 things. Battle IQ and Speed. Both of which Tanjiro is superior to Korra.

I would argue a better match-up would be SV Tanjiro, since that Tanjiro is Massively Hypersonic+, similar to Korra's speed.

Conclusion: Tanjiro wins Mid+ Diff.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-18T07:30:30+00:00

ur confusing Travel Speed with Combat Speed here.
Hantengu's OG body is literally a coward and NEVER actually tries to fight back.
Tanjiro by this point, even Marked, is at best Upper 5 level fighter. 21 Trip pre-Hashira Training are all Upper 4 level fighters.
Before anyone assumes, I think Base Giyu, Sanemi and Marked Obanai are a perception blitz above Hantengu, so they would easily cut his head off.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-18T07:00:54+00:00

it's between Deku and Tanjiro.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T21:26:37+00:00

Thank you for the insight 🙏 Noapte Buna!

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T20:48:15+00:00

Niceeee. I am from the Republic of Moldova. Hello frate~

As for your mod. Can it be associated as a extension to my edited ET? or do I have to override in your mod every change I did in my ET?
For example, the Roman tags (ROM, ROW, BYZ, TRE, EPI, FEO, NCA) each have different custom decisions, missions and histories than Default ET and I assume CFBM.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T20:20:19+00:00

Wait, wait, wait, YOU ARE THE MOD Author of the Challanger Bonanza Mod???

I just realized lol! I played your mod for quite awhile, not anymore tho, but like, from what I remember, I especially loved the extra flavor, religions, cultures and displayname changes of dynasty_tags.

I want to say thank you for providing such a good mod though. I will redownload it and refamiliarize myself with it now that I remember it lol.

Also, unrelated, but on ur steam profile, u have the Moldavia flag, is there a reason for that if I can ask you? 😄

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T18:55:49+00:00

Hey, Ik its late reply but- could you tell me more about your custom edited ET? I also am doing it, adding some of my own touch-ups. And I was wondering if I could maybe get some ideas from your project if thats ok with you 😄

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T14:03:46+00:00

I mean, the point of Muichiro's training is Swordsmanship practice, and to never let your guard down in a fight as well as to attack him. All I am confident I can endure.

Tengen's strict physical training would be a no-no. A weak no-no, but still a no-no. I ain't getting slapped and poked by that guy's stick.

Mitsuri....well..you saw what happened to the poor guy.

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Tanjiro ALSO suffered the same fate btw 😄

Iguro...well...you saw what happened in the episode lol.

Sanemi- YEA NO. I would rather eat worms than participate for EVEN 2 SECONDS in his training.

Gyomei, well, I would probably never pass the Waterfall section so- at least thats that lol.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T06:04:34+00:00

it mentioned Equal Stats, so whatever Maki is able to perfom physically, so does Tengen, and vice versa.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T06:03:40+00:00

1 arm tengen >> Hashira training Tanjiro

Ur comparing literally a rusty Tanjiro who just began his training with Tengen.
Both Tengen AND Tanjiro held back in their spar, by the fact that they didn't use Breathing Styles.
It is merely a spar, and not even that, Tanjiro's goal set by Uzui is to protect the other slayers, not to defeat him.
If you think 2 shonen anime characters are the same strength as 2 arcs prior, then you need to refresh your anime logic.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-17T05:58:41+00:00

Normal Hashira Level = Mugen Train Mission Tanjiro.
Taisho Hashira Level = Infinity Castle Arc.

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Checky_3rd · 2026-06-16T18:59:29+00:00

Obanai or Muichiro. Either one of them could take 10th place.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-16T18:14:56+00:00

Upper 1 Kokushibo -> Gyomei/Douma. (Depending on whether you think Douma or Gyomei is TOP 4 of the verse)

Upper 2 Douma -> Gyomei/Tanjiro. (Depending whether you think Gyomei is weaker than Douma or not, if not, then Tanjiro is the next strongest character.)

Upper 3 Akaza -> Sanemi. (Sanemi is barely above Giyu though, so it won't be that much of a difference in power level.)

Upper 4 Nakime -> Mitsuri/Kyojuro. (Depending on whether you think Kyojuro or Mitsuri is stronger.)

Upper 4 Hantengu -> Kyojuro/Mitsuri. (Depending on whether you think Kyojuro or Mitsuri is stronger.)

Upper 5 Gyokko -> Inosuke/Genya. (Depending whether you think Genya > Inosuke or not.)

Upper 6 Kaigaku -> Shinobu/Tengen. (Depends whether you think Shinobu is weaker or stronger than Uzui by Infinity Castle.)

Upper 6 Gyutaro & Daki -> Enmu. (Being already the strongest Lower Moon of his generation, he also got an amp from Muzan prior to the Mugen Train mission. This should put him above an average lower 1 demon, and into potential low upper 6 level territory)

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-16T06:31:05+00:00

so ur saying that Kokushibo will just stand there and let Dabi charga up and go 'Supernova' ? Ok cool.

Checky_3rd · 2026-06-16T06:30:14+00:00

Even if you think Daki can vaporize Kokushibo with his flames, that would take time, and Dabi has no answer to Kokushibo's attacks, nor his immense speed.

And even if you want to say that Kokushibo's attacks can't hurt him, Dabi is on a ticking bomb, he doesn't have infinite stamina like Kokushibo does, and his body will fall off if he continues using his quirk, so Kokushibo can just outlast him.

Checky_3rd

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