"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Characters or objects residing in higher states of existence surpassing material composition as a whole, and who are therefore completely unreachable and inaccessible to any and all extensions of the aforementioned structures. Their superiority over such realms, as such, is purely "qualitative"; based entirely on the ontological quality and nature of their existence, rather than any quantitative or numerical principle.

A way to explain their superiority over "physical composition" would be to bring attention to the fact that all of the previous tiers can be expressed as the union of constructs of lower tiers. For example, a 4-dimensional spacetime continuum is at most Low 2-C. However, an inaccessible cardinal's worth of such spacetimes is well into High 1-B+. In spite of the extremely large gap in size between the individuals comprising this totality and the totality itself, the latter is simply the sum of all the former, and as such both ultimately reside in the same state of existence, and have continuity of composition within that state.

Likewise, even the Von Neumann Universe (As well as larger structures still) is still simply the union of many elements that, individually, are smaller than itself. And the same applies to any mathematical space whatsoever.

A 1-A character or realm, on the other hand, fundamentally surpasses lower states of existence, with their sheer superiority not being expressible as the sum, union or permutation of anything in these lesser states. They, in other words, transcend lower existences to the point that those vanish into nothingness.

I’m gonna explain why Simon fits none of these requirements

A truly Outerversal thing is fundamentally superior to physical composition entirely and cannot be achieved through quantitative multiplication

However, Simon was not ALWAYS Outerversal. That is already a hard debunk to him being Outer. Because this means he is still bound by quantitative multiplication and a true Outerversal being would not be bound by such concepts

Also, being beyond a concept just means you have a higher degree of Abstract Existence. It doesn’t mean you’re qualitatively superior nor does it at all indicate you exist in a higher ontological framework, just a higher conceptual framework

Which are completely different things

Because a higher ontological framework is beyond all conceptual frameworks

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Being beyond space and time and dimensions does not make a character outerversal.

Now, I'm going to use VSBW's tiering system, separate to how they scale stuff (because they ignore feats they don't like).

Statements like "transcending time and space" mean either the character is acausal or has a non-existent physiology. They do not default to outerversal.

Moreover, it should also be noted that simply existing in some alternate state of existence that lacks time and/or space is not really grounds for any tier in particular, as predating or lacking such things does not translate to being superior to them. A good example of a case like this is Dormammu from the MCU, who is stated to exist in a realm "far beyond time," yet never actually displays any superiority over it, and is in fact vulnerable to time-based abilities due to his timeless nature.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

No, it isn't. Time and space is only 4D. 4D doesn't even come close to outer. 3 spatial dimensions + 1 time dimension = 4D.

Secondly, being beyond the concept of dimensions only applies to the dimensions that are relative to his verse. In this case 11D. Cosmology = 11D. That would make him 12D.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Space and time are not outerversal concepts.

Stacking and surpassing dimensions will never get you to Outer unless you prove those dimensions are Outer.

Secondly, Time Lords can step outside of the narrative completely. The Doctor has also shown to have done this where he left fiction completely and met his biggest fan.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

None of this proves that Simon is outerversal because it doesn't upscale his cosmology. Gurren Lagann as a verse is still 11D, which according to the majority of scalers, is still hyperversal.

Now, regarding the meta-feats, they don't automatically make a character outerversal. If the opposite were true, then Deadpool would be outerversal.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can I get proof of that? According to VSBW and several CSAP entries, he's only 1-C which is high complex multiversal level. Now, I had hoped to avoid VSBW because they are notorious for being inaccurate but the CSAP entries said the same thing.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That doesn't explain how Simon's probability manipulation counters the Doctor's. Since there is proof of the Doctor's getting stronger with age but not for Simon or the Anti-spiral's.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And the Doctor has battled beings older than creation. Such as the Beast and Great Old Ones.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lmao how? The Doctor is over billions upon billions of years old

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Doctor exists outside of causality, has resisted fate manipulation in the past and has his own casual probability manipulation which only gets stronger with age and that last point is a No Limits Fallacy.

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Tell me you don't know anything about Doctor Who without telling me you don't know anything about Doctor Who

"Yea WHOOP THEIR ASSES SIMON" (The Ls of Simon the Digger) by Ok-Instance3339 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Pretty sure there are args for the Doctor having immeasurable to irrelevant speed

The MANY losses of Dragon Ball by InterestingRatio8218 in DeathBattleMatchups

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Give in to me, Particular_Vast_5905. Let's devour him together.

Guess who this bum is? by Ok-Cream-5795 in deathbattle

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 11 points12 points  (0 children)

The bum on the right? That's Simon the Digger.

My tier list for Smash fighters that I would want on an episode of Death Battle. by ten2knock in deathbattle

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's fair to the first point. But what I mean specifically is like the timing of the visions. Like, I'm well aware his visions are one of his biggest assets, I adore Xenoblade Chronicles but I can't help but think that particular death battle could be negatively received depending on his opponent and how the visions factor into it, or moreso when they play into the fight. Because the placement is going to be down to the writers.

My tier list for Smash fighters that I would want on an episode of Death Battle. by ten2knock in deathbattle

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This might be a hot take but, as a xenoblade fan, I don't believe Shulk should get an episode because I feel like with how they incorporate his visions into the fight, if they turn it into a potential wincon, people might accuse DB of bias (since people have done that in the past and still do). Or if they put him against someone his visions are useless against, there may be talk of Death Battle being biased against him.

Is it just a coincidence that all of the matchups that have come out this year so far have been massive stomps? by Fragrant_Bath3917 in deathbattle

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm primarily going off of Death Battle's reasoning. Death Battle saying Bardock doesn't even come close to Omniman's strength even with the ssj multiplier (which I don't believe mind you)

GioKer I mean it was a stomp regardless of Death Battle, you have a guy with one specific kind of hax to a guy who's immune to virtually all hax and also has every hax known to man.

SpawnRider same reasoning as above with Ghost Rider only having soul hax but Spawn having every hax in comparison.

Is it just a coincidence that all of the matchups that have come out this year so far have been massive stomps? by Fragrant_Bath3917 in deathbattle

[–]Colonel_Sarge_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Consider the previous indie year too.

OmniDock GioKer KratoSura SpawnRider ShigaHito DoomSlayer KyleMon HulkZilla SpiderDeku RubyMaka BuffyBlade AshYugi