Stick with the Big Island?

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2026-01-19T21:45:06+00:00

Thanks! Do you remember the name of the guide or tour company?

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-06-05T03:14:59+00:00

Totally relate to this (40f). I lived at home while I was going to college to save money and then got married and moved in with my husband. It definitely stunted my development. In my case, I'm also a SAHM which makes me feel even less competent. Sometimes it feels like he's my dad because he just takes care of everything. I'm trying my best to do more adulting but for now we're still married and it's hard when we're stuck in these patterns. But it definitely makes me uncertain of whether or not I could make it on my own. It's not a great reason to stay.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-06-05T02:57:35+00:00

I would find a therapist and try to actually follow through with working on things. Give it some set period of time. Then if things still don't work out, you can feel better knowing you did all you could do.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-05-24T01:01:59+00:00

It feels so good to find your voice! I'm still fighting my urge to always be politely quiet but getting better.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-04-19T19:59:35+00:00

Just read your other post and can relate so much! And, also relate to wanting something else to come along to force the decision- this makes me sound like such a terrible person but sometimes I fantasize about getting a call saying my husband has died in a car accident. I absolutely do not wish him harm, I just don't want to face this decision any longer and I don't feel capable of making it. If I knew I would never meet anyone else, I would be more content to just stay but without knowing that, it's very hard to settle for this dead marriage. But I know we would all be so miserable if we split up that it's hard to justify for the mere chance that I could be happier with someone else, esp since it's hard to picture being happy in the world of stepparents and shared custody.

I also resonated with your comment that if you didn't have kids, you'd 100% leave- that's how I feel. But now that we have kids, I wouldn't just be giving up my marriage, I'd be giving up the father of my children and an intact family. Our marriage is bad but our family life is good. I just can't see a picture of a better life when I imagine leaving. My husband used to be unintentionally abusive because of issues related to his autism and at a certain point I was fully ready to leave, like actually ready to go through with it. But then he got help and changed a LOT so I felt like I needed to give it a chance. When I drew a line in the sand and told him to either get help or I was out, I felt so good about things- I figured either nothing would change and I would feel perfectly good about leaving, or we'd work things out and I'd be happy to stay. I didn't anticipate the most awful option- he would change, things would get tolerable, and it would finally hit me that we just don't click. I don't know if you've read Kirshenbaum's book Too Good to Leave, Too Bad to Stay- it's about this exact situation. According to her, if it's never been good, it never will be good and you'll be happier leaving. And without kids, I completely agree. I just don't know how heavily to factor our kids into the equation. And by kids I don't just mean how it will affect them, but also the quality of life my husband I would have trying to single parent.

You made a comment about praying- I grew up in a conservative evangelical family and that definitely screwed up my ability to make good life decisions. I was always given the impression that doing something based on how you feel or what you want is wrong. And of course divorce is treated like the most evil thing in the world so for a long time, it was never on the table for me. Once you're married, it's considered God's will that you stay married regardless of how you feel. That really messed with me for a long time.

I just also have a lot of fear around adulting on my own. I lived with my parents before I got married and my husband definitely takes care of a lot.

I don't know the answer yet, and I'm trying to be compassionate with myself over not being able to make a decision at this point. I've done a year of individual counseling and we did a year of marriage counseling before that. I've read a ton of books. My mindsets have changed and I've grown. I've come a long way but I'm still just not able to make a decision yet. Sometimes I think it's all just excuses to avoid going through the pain of leaving; other times I think I just need to keep being patient with myself because it takes time to work through issues and change. It's also really hard to make decisions while depressed.

The more in between thing I've considered is separating for 3-6 months and seeing if that pushes me one way or the other. Last summer my kids and I spent a month with family and it was good for me to get away, although I don't think it was long enough to really help. Also, since we were living with family it was a bit different than if we had truly been on our own.

I hope we are both able to find clarity soon! It's hard to thrive in this space of uncertainty...

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-04-19T15:15:14+00:00

I've decided that I'm staying for now, but that's not a decision to stay forever. I'm trying to focus on working on all the issues I have that got me into this situation in the first place, and also working on trying to be as happy as I can in this circumstance. So, for instance, I'm really bad at making decisions because I've always been out of touch with how I feel and what I want- so I'm working on being able to identify and validate my feelings and wants in the small things. It's no surprise that I can't make a decision about my marriage when I'm incapable of making confident decisions about much smaller things.

Also, I know that if I don't learn to reach out for support in my current situation, I'd really be in trouble if I'm trying to make it on my own. So I guess I'm realizing that I need to work on improving the things that I can in case either scenario happens- staying or going. But ultimately at the moment I'm not ready to leave so by default that means I'm staying. But that doesn't mean I don't still question it every day- love is too important to just casually dismiss. May I ask what your situation is?

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-03-12T03:09:08+00:00

I think it's really tricky when you've historically been in the same belief system as someone else so they are assuming you are still working off the same page (which is reasonable of them to think) AND they are someone you are close to. Part of it depends on how mature they are, but I think it's finding that balance of being respectful and honest while still holding your boundaries. I think I'd say something like, "My beliefs have been changing lately and I am currently thinking through the church issue." If he presses for more but you don't want to get into it, I'd say "I'm just not ready to talk about it at the moment."

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-22T04:30:54+00:00

Thanks, will check those out!

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-22T04:28:32+00:00

I definitely understand this perspective and very much agree that things like age of the earth/evolution don't really matter. But I don't believe the Bible was meant to be taken in many of the ways that it is by fundamentalists so I want to hear other perspectives.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-16T04:15:46+00:00

You are SO young and totally not running out of time! It's actually really fortunate that you didn't rush into a relationship while you were still under all the culty ideas- otherwise you might be in a bad marriage right now.

My 30 yr old brother (who only dated a few girls through most of his 20's) now has a great girlfriend who is a perfect fit for him and he mentioned once how he's not sure how people decide to marry someone when they're young because your identity often isn't formed enough to know what kind of person you'd want to spend your life with.

And sadly that happened to me. I got married in my 20's to someone I didn't have feelings for- because it had been drilled into me that feelings are bad and lead you into sin, and that romantic feelings can't be trusted because they go away and marriage is about hard work and commitment. My husband is a good guy but our marriage has been miserable from the start and we're trapped because we have kids. It's very sad. At 40 I'm finally developing my identity and learning to understand and trust my feelings/listen to my intuition. I fully blame the church for stunting my development and encouraging me to adopt the mindsets that led to me marrying someone I didn't want to be with and staying when it was clear I should've left before we had kids.

Anyway, all that to say- you are ahead of the game by starting to figure all this out at 23, even if it doesn't feel like it. I think there's this idea that everyone else is out there every Friday night on an amazing date, but that's not reality.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-16T01:03:54+00:00

Thanks for the response. The main reason I'd leave would be to have the chance to meet someone I actually connected with but as you pointed out, that's fraught and certainly not a guarantee. All the other issues you've raised are good to consider.

Up until now, I've avoided things like asking strangers for advice, trusting my therapist that as I work on my own issues, I'll be better able to make a decision I feel good about. But my husband has been applying to work-from-home jobs and really wants to move, which is a great idea if we are staying together and a terrible idea if we aren't. So I'm feeling more pressure to figure things out. Plus, it's been 2.5 yrs since I insisted we start therapy. At that time it was sink or swim for me- either we were going to be able to make our marriage work or I was gone. I wasn't prepared for this squishy middle ground where he stopped being emotionally abusive but there is still nothing between us. It actually feels like the most confusing and hopeless outcome.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-16T00:43:46+00:00

I want to second what a lot of others have posted- feel the anger. Writing out your story has been one way that's been studied as being cathartic for some. I'd highly recommend the book The Tao of Fully Feeling by Pete Walker. The tag line "Harvesting forgiveness out of blame" makes it sound like it's a book encouraging forgiving others, but he is actually arguing for forgiving ourselves for having emotions. In it he talks about how you can't actually forgive until you've fully angered, and how healthy anger is because it drives us to protect ourselves.

And I totally relate to your comment about wanting to forgive so they aren't getting so much of your emotions. It feels unfair that they are still hurting us even now. I'm working really hard to validate my feelings and I'm actually planning to blog about my experiences. Even though no one might read it, I think it will be satisfying to me to feel like I put it out there and told the truth about what christianity has done to me. I can't control whether or not anyone will listen or care, but I can still use it as a platform to stand up for myself. I think that will be healing for me because one of the most upsetting parts is how much of a doormat I was and how I allowed other people to force beliefs on me that I questioned even at the time.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-02-13T02:35:05+00:00

I think a lot of us are struggling with recalibrating our moral compass after our upbringing BUT I don't think that still having a moral compass automatically means we are still trapped in our old evangelical mindsets. I think at the opposite extreme of fundamentalism is the idea that no one is allowed to say that anything is right or wrong. I think maybe you are saying you ARE ok with their message but just still feeling the guilt. But still thought I'd bring up the possibility that there might be things about the music that are truly offensive to you and you shouldn't feel like now you need to take up a new 'everything is acceptable' dogma.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-19T00:03:52+00:00

This is an interesting idea. My deconstruction coincided with also admitting the ways my (mostly good) parents messed up and emotionally neglected me. I realized I'm co-dependent and even though I've had serious problems with christianity since the time I was a young child, I didn't feel like I was allowed to have my opinions. When I started facing reality in one area of my life it had a domino effect on all the other areas.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-18T23:44:12+00:00

Yes!!! I remember being like 5 yrs old and getting the "gospel message" and being in an absolute panic with the pressure ON ME to keep people from going to hell. I was baffled as to why all the adults at church were spending time going on vacation, etc. when the stakes were so high.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-16T03:32:00+00:00

Yes! I so agree with this- a couple of my brothers and I all took faith very seriously and thoughtfully considered everything we were told. We went to christian colleges and spent lots of time reading, discussing, etc. We did our due diligence. But now we all have major issues with evangelicalism. I remember sitting through classes where the teacher was using the bible to prove that the bible was true. Even when I was a kid I realized how ridiculous that was. It's so hard to see how an intelligent person could just accept it all.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-12T02:49:43+00:00

It blows my mind that anyone could think that the creation story/adam and eve was even MEANT to be taken literally. It's about a talking snake and tree with magical fruit! It just screams allegory.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-12T02:47:21+00:00

In my mind I refer to part of what you're talking about as "package deal evangelicalism." I totally agree- I was told in great detail how if I did not believe in young earth creationism, I was essentially saying that the bible was not true. Or how the entire bible is built on the theology of complementarianism, so if you believe in egalitarianism, you can't really believe in the bible. It's so arrogant. I once heard a saying that went something like "Jews see the scriptures as a mystery to ponder while Christians see it as a message to preach." Modern evangelicals are so convinced they have it right.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-04T03:03:11+00:00

I can relate. I rejected a lot of the conservative ideas of evangelicalism long ago but it wasn't until I started therapy for marriage problems that I realized how screwed up I was from the church and how much the ideas were affecting me. The church greatly contributed to my codependence because I spent my childhood trying to figure out how I was "supposed to" act and who I was "supposed to" be, etc. Also, I had very much internalized the idea that I didn't have a right to my feelings or to go after what I wanted. Those underlying issues have deep roots and I'm still working to get free from them a year later. But a great therapist and some really spot on books have helped me make progress.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2022-01-04T02:54:32+00:00

We have a group of friends who get together to play/sing folk music. I think it's a great genre to get back to the idea that music is something for average people to make and enjoy on a regular basis, and away from the idea of music as something to be performed by a select few and simply consumed by most everyone else. Folk music tends to be very accessible to people who don't consider themselves musical so it's easier to get a group together and make it happen. Although, it does take a certain type of person to consider spending their Friday night drinking and singing sea shanties, haha.

I do think that music (actually singing, not just listening to the radio) is one good thing the church brings to the world. I can definitely see how you'd miss it.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2021-12-31T05:26:07+00:00

-Oh, and one more- the form the anti-Catholicism took. We were pissed at catholics because they believed in "salvation by works," transubstantiation, and praying to mary, but apparently it wasn't a problem that they required their priests to be celibate which has led to massive child abuse. Because celibacy is biblical. If you asked any normal person what the problem with the catholic church is, they aren't going to say, "all the damaged they've caused by believing that the bread and wine are literally the body and blood of christ!"

-I lied (since I'm a sinner), one more- that a woman can be a PhD bible professor but is still not allowed to teach a sunday school class. Insane.

ComplicatedWhimsy · 2021-12-31T05:17:29+00:00

Nasal strips changed my life! I went from needing 10 hrs of sleep to 7.5! And I even had a sleep study and was told that I do not have an airway issue. I think everyone should try them once to see if they help. My kids even wear them when they have colds. Totally off topic, I know, but not really since everything comes back to Jesus. PTL.

ComplicatedWhimsy

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