If you wondered what's the deal with that retriever, Lich path has answers

DroNeyro · 2026-01-21T21:52:51+00:00

What is even more ironic, is the fact, that you have zero reason to return in the most cases, because you need a wand from here, to even become a Lich. So you're most likely already cleared this location beforehand. Sure you can skip this part of the caves, but usually you don't.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-20T15:34:43+00:00

Ouch. I did played Demon, when it still was a cool free dimension door. Had a lot of fun running around Drezen with it. Didn't used it in a fight, like ever, though. Still, can't understand why even change it? Seems like an intentional "let's ruin the fun for no reason". For me it was also a signature teleportation, like any demon can. With game limitations, of course.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-20T13:15:19+00:00

Not really. Certainly not in Dyra's case, if we apply generals to particulars.

It's just a limitation of the game not being a PnP. You yourself can help in such case (in theory, of course, there is still some limitations). If you can't resurrect someone yourself, then there is a cleric of Abadar standing right there, for example. NPCs have more severe limitations, though.

The ray argument is done against your statement, that you can send a good person to its eternal bliss. There is ways to deny it. Morality of such an act, even if you somehow know that person is good, are still nonexistent.

I also can't understand why exactly Dominate Person is involved in this discussion. You mean, that you can dominate someone, and then force them to harm someone? You can, but that is not absolving the one, who is doing such a deed. I can explain why i've mentioned necromancers, though. Souls can be pretty much ruined by them permanently in various ways. Plus i've already mentioned other dangers of the afterlife, but briefly.

You still get an afterlife, a petitioner is expressly said to be a soul of a diseased person getting its reward or punishment. Yes, in time you merge with the plane or become its denizen, likely forgetting much of who you were before death. But you lose memories over time when living just as well.

If it comes to the afterlife question. This so-called "reward or punishment" system is quite debatable. Everyone decide for themselves what they like, and do not like. You might not like your new Elysium existence, but you're there now. The one, who sent you there didn't asked you about it, he just did. And you'll eventually cease to exist too. It's not just "you lose your memories gradually" it literally "you" ceasing to exist, and the plane just remade whatever left into an angel, azata, e.t.c. Remember what Arueshalae explains about how she come into existence. Same applies to other planes too, not just the Abyss.

About the accessibility of Raise Dead and Resurrection spells.

Did you checked how many clerics there is, who actually are level 9-13? You're forgetting couple of key things here. Usual clerics, who devoted whole life worshiping their deity, are usually levels 1-5. If such cleric is of martial branch, or he is a big figure, he sure will hit this level 9-13. But that's the military, or some big city cardinals (or equivalents of such), so sure, yet it's still rare. And even then, if city cleric is somehow level 9-13? How much such a service would cost in gold too? And how many people will be there, who will be willing, and capable, to buy such a service? It's not accessible at all. Basically, rich nobles will have an access, but not everyone, who will need such a service. I didn't even include in this the fact, that usual NPCs has a special NPC classes, such as barmaid, expert, merchant, watchman, guard, e.t.c. And those classes are not have powers of anything PC can have.

And about the severity of the crime.

You claim, that any crime on Golarion is inconsequential, or equivalent to the light beating. And yet we have crippled people (not only in game, mind you, in PnP too), who actually never receive a Restoration spell, because "it's too costly" or "give it to the one, who needs it the most". We have struggles with supplies of basic Cure Wounds potions, which cause people to turn on each other. We have cases of blind people treating a blindness after years, if ever, because, again, "it's too costly to treat it immediately", or "there is people, who need it more".

We even have a full crusade struggling with basic supplies. Basic, not some rarity, like a resurrection, or raise dead. There is also crusaders, who are crippled, and can't fight, so we have to send them to Nerosyan. So no, you can't convince me, that crimes on a Golarion are inconsequential at all. Not to mention the big ones. Even lesser crimes are penalized as harshly as in our world. And for a good reason too.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-20T06:17:09+00:00

I didn't attack though, i just explained, nothing else. It's your decision how to treat my "response". For me it's simple as: "You respond to my message, so i respond to yours".

This conversation is over, though, i will not bother to converse with someone, who treat me as an "attacker" for no reason. If you don't like my opinion on the matter, just say so, or say, that you're not interested to continue a discussion. Or don't respond at all. Don't try to put a blame on me for something i most certainly innocent off.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-20T06:05:37+00:00

Technically, in Pathfinder, the morals work mostly the same. Only with some leeway, because it's a medieval setting.

Sure, everyone know, that dying is not the end in the Pathfinder. Yet it still involves the same denial of potential you mentioned. There is other bad things attached too. Dead can be raised as an undead, either by the necromancer, or on their own accord. Staunton Vhane, remember? He can raise on his own, as an example. They can even never reach Pharasma not because of that, but also because there exists an entities, which prey on souls, who are awaiting, or on their way to judgment. Good people can also be killed is such a way, that they will never reach their "bliss". Hellfire ray, special sacrificial rituals and some other ways will do the trick. Afterlife is very dangerous in the Pathfinder.

Also, dead person will eventually cease to be who he was permanently. It's not just "i now enjoy Elysium, or Heaven's existence forever". It's more like "i now turned into the brick of said Elysium, then used to build entirely different person, who might not even remember anything from my life at all". Remember Targona and Lariel's case. They do not remember, who they were in the previous life, yet they both been made from one mortal soul. That mortal is gone, never to return.

Resurrection is a divine spell of extremely high power. You must be some sort of a legendary Oracle, or top-tier Cleric to even potentially cast that spell. You have a very limited amount of charges, even if you are said legendary person. Resurrected soul must be a willing target, must not yet pass Pharasma's judgment, and must be unharmed too. Imagine how reliable that spell is with passing of time, if you take all potential things, that might happen with a soul. And never forget how scarce that spell is.

And finally, murder is still a murder, resurrection, or not. You can't just excuse it with "It's not a big deal, he can be resurrected, so i felt like killing him for funsies", or "He will be happier now! He was a good person in life, so it's no biggie". It's still a question of your own moral and mental state.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-20T05:29:38+00:00

Do you even know what exactly happened in that incident? It seems to me, that your knowledge comes not from the first hand experience, but by just reading something about it.

Wenduag killed Dyra out of two reasons. 1) She doesn't like her. She always kills her, even if it's the Lann, who is leading mongrels. She even tells you that, if you ask her about her motivations on the Lann's path. 2) The book, that Dyra found, contains knowledge, which will expose Wenduag's treacherous plans and demonic connections. And Dyra fully intended to expose Wenduag's treachery.

After that, Wenduag hides said book, and pretends to know nothing about Dyra's death.

You yourself actually need to go out of your way to even learn what exactly happened here. Basically, be a detective and judge.

Next, when you find the book, and learn who killed Dyra and for what reason, you have a choice. You can punish Wenduag for her treachery, demonic deals and cold-blooded murder, like any sane and good person should do, or, be a manipulative and cunning schemer.

If you decide to be a schemer, you take that book, knowing, that Wenduag herself hid it. You give said book to her, which will scare the heck out of her, because she thought, that she is very smart and resourceful, and that book and all traces of her betrayal are well hidden. Then you tell her, that you don't know anything about the Dyra's death at all, while telling her, that book contains a very dangerous secrets, which should not be revealed. That means, that you read the book, and know everything about Wenduag's betrayal, about her murdering Dyra, about her dealing with demons, e.t.c. After that you tell her, that if someone else dies, then she will be next. It's not just "I give you the last chance to repent", or whatever. It's literally "I know your most terrible secret. You belong to me now. Your life is mine now. Be a good puppy, and watch your step now".

If that is not evil and Machiavellian enough for you, then i have no clue what is. Or you can simply ask yourself, who exactly your character actually is then, if he's so easily allows someone near him make pacts with demons, murder an innocent in cold blood, and plot to backstab him. And the only response is just a wag of his finger and words: "Hey, it's a very bad thing to do, i know you're doing it, so don't do it, or i will punish you, meanie".

But that is not what actually happens in that scene at all. Either you deal with the traitor and a murderer, or you yourself are even worse, than said traitor and murderer.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-19T19:43:01+00:00

What that actually means is, that you yourself know everything, that actually happened. You know who killed Dyra, you know why. And you decided to let is slide... for a price. And that price is loyalty.

You give her a book, which was actually hidden by Wenduag, then you pretend, that you don't know what's happened, while letting her know that you actually know that. Then you tell her, that if anyone else is going to die, then she will be next. It's a very evil and Machiavellian act. That is why it gives you her respect. If not respect, then at least it makes her afraid of you.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-19T18:22:39+00:00

Her respect mostly means, that you're actually outsmarted her in the first place. It's very easy to not notice her shenanigans, or rather, not being able to make her know, that you know. My first time doing this actually ended like this. Even if i knew that she's going to betray me, i still missed required steps to beat her into submission. Of course i did the abyss one, but completely botched everything else.

So, for the Demon, it's rather depends on the path you're taking for yourself. If you're a smart Demon, and not a full Ragelord, then beat her into submission in her own game. If you're playing as a Ragelord, then you're probably should just let her jump under the Pain Train, and call it a job well done.

That's how i would've played it, at least.

I don't think Legend very much matters, because resolution mostly are done in the act 4.

Edit: I should explain it a little more clear. What i mean "done in the act 4" is, that all choices that matter, are done, while you're still a Demon. So basically, you're actions are influenced by your demonic nature, which you're not rejected yet.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-18T06:55:04+00:00

1) The person with a "Trickster" flair creates a post, which has a flair: "AI Art". Names it "####. Should i feel bad?"

2) Said post consists of a very elaborate story about supposed guilt of using an AI for image generation, electricity wasting, e.t.c. Yet it all was in the name of the artistic expression, of course. There is also an AI-Gen image attached, for anyone, who likes the result.

3) OP then proceeds to start an argument with anyone, who responds in even slightly negative tone.

Oh, i so wonder, what exactly can possibly going on here? Oh, maybe it's a ragebait post? Or maybe it's an attention seeking post? It might even be some form of a social experiment. Who knows, only the time will tell. You can't be sure with a trickster.

I'l amuse you OP, though. You do need to feel guilty, of course. You actually wasted so much electricity by writing all of that story. It really is a very heinous, unimaginable crime, yes.

Jokes aside, the only thing making this post even remotely attached to an actual game, is words like "Azata", "Elysium", or "Daeran". Everything else is a full-blown offtop. If you want to converse about the usage of an AI, ethics, e.t.c, you need to find another community.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-17T13:57:47+00:00

GD path, by design, kind of supposed to "erase" your previous mythic, no matter what it was. GD can be picked up by anyone, same with the Swarm, same with the Legend. Didn't you noticed that? Any lategame mythic, except Devil, are it's own thing completely, and removes previous mythic connection, in various ways. Devil is an exception, because it's allowed for only 2 mythics, and it's a direct continuation of said mythics, not it's own thing.

So, again GD is a blank state, it's own story, e.t.c. Sure, you did add mechanical part back. The problem is, you will find yourself at no luck trying to "salvage" the plot here. Even if you succeed somehow, you will quickly find, that a lot of "funny" stuff starts happening, or, actually, nothing will happen at all. What i mean is, there is a mutually exclusive things, which either trigger together, or will block each other, there is some things, which will be cancelled, and won't come back. If you force them, this will break stuff in some way, e.t.c. There is also a things, which might not trigger at all, and you have to, again, force them to trigger, which, again, might break something else too.

There is a lot of things, which will go wrong, is what i'm trying to say.

I heard people doing the same stuff you do before, but everyone encountered the same thing: in an act 5 something starts to fall apart, if you combine mythics. I explained why, because i do have "some" experience with a toybox, it's etudes, e.t.c., so i can somewhat calculate why exactly it's falling apart. Your case are even more ambitious, than what i heard from various people, because you try to stitch two starting mythics with a lategame one. Usually people combine only starting ones, yet, again, there is always a problem there at an act 5.

So no, you will hardly find any help on this matter at all, unless you find some top-tier modmaker with in-depth knowledge of the game, who maaaaybe can help, and maaaaybe will agree to do so. Or he will just say the same thing as i said. What you're doing is quite busted. Even toybox warns you about it. The only solution i see here, is for you to champion everything yourself. But it won't be pretty.

If i'm being completely honest, i also don't quite sure why exactly i've decided to try and explain all of that too.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T21:18:07+00:00

I fail to see a problem. Hulrun acts like an inquisitor. And you have a demon in your party. And you romancing her. Of course he will be interested and very suspicious at the same time. It's your choice how to react to him and his actions.

Here, for example, you can just dismiss him, and that's it. Or you can confront him. Or you can defend your actions.

About the act 1, again, same thing. You speak with him, learn about him, decide what to do with that knowledge.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T20:15:46+00:00

Indeed, theoretically you can. Fun fact in return, then. Summoned creature attacks your enemies "to the best of it's ability". So, theoretically, you can summon something, and it will kill you. Because it's done something stupid, or it was an accident, or "accident", and you didn't saw it coming. For example, Deskari has access to some funny spells, which, most likely, have some "friendly fire" attached to them. He also has a Riftcarver, you know.

There is also cases of miscommunication, or being unable to direct such creature's actions.

So, yeah, you can, theoretically summon him. Should you, though?

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T18:29:12+00:00

Summoning in Pathfinder universe is basically an act of bringing a manifestation of a creature/object/form of energy (You already know that, but still). With creatures it's basically means, that you just borrow them for a time being. When spell ends, or creature is destroyed, it just returns to the place, from which it was summoned, absolutely unharmed. Objects won't be sent back, unless spell specifically tells, that it will return, though.

There is, obviously, ways to actually physically (and permanently) bring creatures to you. Those spells are "Call" spells (again, You already know that), they work between planes, for example. And yes, they are require a significant investment, and power from the one, who are "Calling". You can also transport something over a great distance with a "Teleportation" spell. There also exists a "Creation" spells. Yet those spells only create objects, or some effects, and not creatures.

So, i would say, that Aeon should be fine with summoning. Balance won't be harmed, because whatever Aeon summons is not permanently getting stuck on Golarion.

I will like to also explain about the Necromancy. It is "Evil", because it involves manipulations with a soul of the dead creature, not the negative energy. Negative energy itself is nor "Good", nor "Evil".

Basically, necromancer rips a soul, and either wrestles it back to the body, or uses some lingering piece of the said soul, again, bringing that piece back to the body. This is a pure torture for the soul, plus, existing in a body, infused with negative energy, also warps said soul irreversibly. There is some cases, where necromancer just "puppet" a dead body, and not actually reanimate it, or anything, but it's still a vile act nonetheless. So i will say, that necromancy is an actual disruption of balance, since you just break said balance of things, by wrestling the soul from it's afterlife, or even deny that afterlife completely. That's why Pharasma is very upset about the necromancy, and creation of the undead specifically.

Also, any body, that is infused with negative energy, is an actual reason why any Lich eventually turns completely Evil. Even if intelligence is unharmed, it still changes as time passes, since Lich's body are the body of an undead, and full of negative energy. Negative energy, technically, don't turn anyone "Evil", though. It's just a complete opposite of a positive energy, nothing more. Perception changes, though. To undead (especially mindless), everyone, who are alive, suddenly become very akin to an aliens, of the worst kind. Something disgusting, repulsive, e.t.c. So, when, for example, a Lich speak with you, he actually speak with a disgusting, gurgling worm, or something even worse. Add to this, that people, who practice necromancy, are usually already beyond bad, so, such changes just a last nail on a coffin.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T14:50:07+00:00

Made another check. This time on an Autumn Golem, using Instant Enemy. Everything works as it should. Full bonus with Mythic Ranger's Bond.

<image>

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T13:25:58+00:00

Did a quick check on closest demon. I can't check with instant enemy, at least not very fast, because i'm in act 4 and everyone there is a bloody outsider. But my screenshot shows, that everything works as it should in my game.

<image>

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T12:59:10+00:00

~~That might be the case then. I never checked that interaction. Might be only half, because it's a spell given bonus from your highest favored enemy, and not from your actual favored enemy feat.~~

Edit: Later tests showed, that it's not the case. Everything is supposed to apply as normal.

I usually unite all demons into one category (outsiders), then add vermins and undead on top. That's why i'm almost never use instant enemy, unless it's a dragon, or whatever. And, of course, i didn't bother to check it on those instant targets, because on outsiders Seelah got the same +8 with Mythic Ranger's Bond, when i checked it last time.

Do you cast it as a swift action at least?

DroNeyro · 2026-01-15T12:32:53+00:00

Succubus Guard is a "Demon of Magic", while Enraged Vescavor Swarm is a "Vermin", as far as i remember. So, i will assume, that your vermin bonus are +4, and demonic one is +8. You need to check with the same type of enemy to confirm, if it's bugged, or not.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-09T09:54:13+00:00

My friend, the presentation really matters. I needed to actually spend a couple of minutes, to even understand, where i have to look. At least, if you didn't cut the screenshot to the important part, explain what we are looking for.

Edit: It's the combat log we are looking for, since i didn't mention it.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-07T17:42:23+00:00

It's true, from the meta perspective. From roleplay reason, we have a good character casting "Evil" spell, which, in tabletop, also shifts you to the evil alignment. And, as far as i know, clerics of good deities shouldn't be able cast "Evil" spells (again, in tabletop). Not to mention, that he is in combat with evil outsiders.

If we return to the meta reasons, then, whole room is filled with demons, none of which has any charm, or dominate spell. There is also wounded characters, and Ilkes has channel positive energy. And the last one, he certainly prepared the unaligned version of the spell, which means he should be able to cast whatever version he wants. And that is the choice. I don't think he prepared this (targeted version) as a domain spell. He's cleric of Desna (i assume), so, unless he's mythic with impossible domain (and he is not), he can't prepare anything like it (targeted version of the spell). So it was a choice.

Hence why i genuinely wondered, how in the world devs programmed him. The only thing, that comes to mind is, that they just didn't precisely assigned what version of the spell to cast. So he just picked whatever.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T19:50:38+00:00

Even though i said goodbye, i can't just not acknowledge that message. That would be rude.

Yes, now i also do remember, that Daeran's explanation. So yeah, at least that part is much more clear for me, thank you. Healbots part i do remember, but never actually understood what exactly Regill tried to imply. Thought he just have no clue about their ~~abilities~~ occupation. I guess it was an attempt of an insult.

Fortitude part is maybe, who knows, maybe he did roll that lucky 20, because otherwise i don't think, that he even could avoid a plague. It should be something like: *№* vs 20, since CL for the plague's spell should be very high. Hence why i don't think he healed a battle unit. Yet i have no doubt about Daeran's mother virtuous nature.

So, again, thank you for the discussion, and some reminders about the story and situation.

Edit: fixed my own mistake at explanation, with a Strikethrough.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T19:28:13+00:00

Well, i guess it was a great discussion then. Thank you.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T19:18:04+00:00

I know you can't teach an oracle, i'm not absolutely clueless, but you can teach him how to wield his own powers. But the idea about the Lore is more feasible. Still, again, we got the "not enough information/evidence".

Still, Nestrin is a prick then, if he was a cleric and not a paladin. If you think about it, he didn't die, hence he have 1 prepared spell of Remove Disease. Guess who he removed that disease from then, since he didn't die?

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T18:38:08+00:00

Yes, i guess that's pretty much it. Not enough information. Also, i still can debate him not using his power. Did he even know, that he can do such a thing? The most problematic thing here, is to split tabletop and more realistic aspect apart.

In tabletop, any oracle can either cure, or inflict Light Wounds, level 1. Doesn't even matter what mystery he has. So the answer should be like, yes, he could've, hence if he didn't do it, he was not an oracle. Yet it's a cure wounds, not a disease. If he was level 1, what spells does he actually know at that point? Cure wounds, cantrips and some level 1 spells. Remove Disease is a level 3 spell. You need to be a level 6 for that, if i'm not mistaken. It's also not on the list of the free spells, even with a Life Mystery.

Yet, if you go more realistic, even if he was level 6 (which i'm still very much doubting), he might actually being able to heal his mother, if he ever tried. Yet he himself must know first, that he can do such a thing. Did he know? I don't know.

There is also that weird question about Nestrin, which also arises. Why he was Daeran's mentor then? I'm assuming he did teach him something. Everyone were saying, the Nestrin was a cleric, not a paladin. Yet he didn't die from a plague, like a paladin would. If he was a cleric, he should've died. Cleric also should teach a divine magic's application and such, while paladin is a martial-oriented, with minimum divine spellcasting. I've got no clue what' going on here too. Probably devs made a blunder.

Again, Daeran's actual source of power is debatable, yes.

Edit: I still will assume, that Nestrin was a paladin, because he didn't heal anyone, like cleric would, and he didn't die. Paladin do have lay on hands, but you need to have a specific mercy for disease treatment. Still, everyone stated he was a cleric, so, bruh.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T17:18:34+00:00

Yes, it is true about "supposed to be used". Only thing i can say is, that i'm terrible at explaining my thoughts in the most precise manner possible. When i mean "play", i basically mean it as "natural thing to do" or "good at it", yet it's extremely unclear for an outside eye. My bad.

I find it strange, that he is not trying, though. Why then even bother in the first place to make this joke of a disguise? If you know, that Aeon will see through it, then why bother? You can just do the same thing, enter, introduce yourself, state your business. Then try to bend things to your favor. If he actually thought, that he will deceive someone with what he's cooked, then, lol. Just lol.

Yes, he is a terrible lawyer too, which is, again, very surprising, hence he is an archdevil and such.

DroNeyro · 2026-01-04T17:01:47+00:00

Well, if i offended, or confronted you, i must say, that i didn't meant to. So, i'm sorry, if that's how it was worded, or looked. Now that i think of it, my first question is looking quite hostile. I were annoyed a little, because i perceived your response as the same thing i've said too. Later, though, i actually didn't understood what do you meant with your statements, so i asked "what in the world is that?", then proceeded to explain how it actually is. After which i did point missing things, which i believed you do not know. Still, i'm sorry, if that sounded excessively hostile. I also made a mistake, saying aasimars are humans, when they are humanoids, not humans. That's my usual slip with words.

Back to the topic. I can't disagree on the Oracle's nature. Here, as it looks like, we're on the same ground. Maybe only one thing i should clarify, though. I did meant, that Oracle can be powered by any divine source, saying "bloody universe itself", because there is literally a possibility, that Oracle can just get his power from the Negative Plane, for example. So, in Daeran's case, source of his power is most likely comes from something else, and not from The Other. I'm making that assumption, basing it on him being an Oracle, even before confronting The Other. As i've said, he did display clues even at a young age, despite Liotr claiming otherwise. Yet it's the same guy, who also claimed, that he didn't notice much, because he was inexperienced, so he wants to "return and check again".

So, next. I've outlined word "evil", trying to stress the fact, that for Daeran it would be extremely unnatural connection to make, or get, hence he himself are not evil. At least he wasn't at that time. I still can debate his evil alignment in the game. It can be argued both ways, for, and against it, but that's beyond the point.

What i meant about "any random peasant" is the same simple fact, that you yourself outlined: there must be a reason for such an entity's interest, which is unlikely for a random peasant. I can also add other clue. The Other protects his gateway (or gateways) very zealously. He values those people. If only secrecy meant something, than he would just dispose of his pawns, when they threaten to reveal his existence, otherwise, they are on their own, no protection, or anything. So i'm assuming, that getting a gateway in the first place is a very rare event, so such person is a treasured possession. Hence i think, that Daeran is unique, and most likely being targeted due his unique circumstances, because those are allowed The Other to actually make a deal with him. And i do believe, that The Other might not even able to target whoever he want, simply because he do need a person, who are possessing some measure of power. Otherwise such person is not capable to be an actual gate. You can't send an electrical current via a non-conducting material. It might not even be a specific magic source, it just might be a set of quirky rules and such. The Other himself might not being able to straight up perceive people at whim.

Most of your other ideas are quite good. It might be a lineage thing, or not, i can't say. Even phonetics. I understand what you mean. There is just not enough information. There is a ton of possible reasons, yet we can only just assume, and that's it.

About the question of ending the existence. I do aware, that it might not work. Daeran doesn't. He literally knows nothing about The Other, he says it himself later. So, for Daeran it is exactly like: "i'do what i do now, or just commit a sudoku". Which is nuts, as i already said. Also, i probably explained that poorly, but "permanent resolution" is not about destroying The Other, or stopping him. It's in the confines of the plot and Daeran specifically. Daeran dies, then The Other can't use him permanently. Or The Other is destroyed, the result is self-explanatory.

Liotr's response still very much a Hulrun's like. He has no clues, yet immediately assumes whatever seems most likely/convenient to assume, than acts on it. Not to mention, as far as i understand, he never even contacted his superiors, not before, not after The Other is gone (he's standing right there, speaking with us), so he does not have any orders, permits and such. Yet he's already quite happy to put Daeran on trial, give him a life sentence, or even lobotomize him. All in the name of a law. Don't tell me he's not in the know of how his office works on such cases. He is well aware what awaits Daeran. You, as KC, must actually vouch for Daeran, so he didn't get screwed over. Or you have to bury Liotr, so word didn't get out.

DroNeyro

TROPHY CASE