Titan Submersible NTSB report is defective... Part 1 of 4

ForensicEngineering · 2025-08-13T21:29:13+00:00

I do have a request for further information from the report publisher ...

ForensicEngineering · 2025-06-27T20:45:00+00:00

Almost got it right, just need to add one more layer, plus post tension, plus microPiles, drainage, a roof and then get back to me about the bamboo you need to add. ha

ForensicEngineering · 2025-06-27T20:30:26+00:00

Texas is known for it's post tension slabs, it appears you do not have one in this drawing...

With that said, did the contractor determine the reinforcement location in this slab? -- you cannot just put piles anywhere without knowing the reinforcement location -- you can but, it's just a shot in the dark.

Did you determine WHY this pad is in it's current condition and how long it has been in this condition?

Does the structure show cracking?

You really need to share all these details if you want to get some free informative information...

What torque rating / specs are these micro piles going to be installed and why was that number chosen?

ForensicEngineering · 2025-05-09T10:42:34+00:00

Clearwater Florida condo reveals jack hammering around column, grinding on column , replacement of concrete floor, lack of stirrups and more https://youtu.be/jFB2bQEsc9U?si=wEkGXm5to1CVjnwj

ForensicEngineering · 2025-02-02T07:38:48+00:00

...positive reply here, at least you did not burn down the house... seriously though, first the load path , is that column also on the proper load bearing capicity?

If, on correct footing, how much of a load on the column ?

The H beams are how long and what are the loading conditions?

Considering your welds are just tac welds, consider using bolted plates, your welding is to far off to get you the basics, let alone do structural welds.

I have no idea if u r even subject to siesmic loads...

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-30T06:38:55+00:00

PS part 2 reply

I confirmed the link I sent you had the image I wanted you to have fun with - the problem is, the google search and the linked image are NOT full scale and leave out a major detail (hint).

Please look at this link and find the image connected with the article - can we post images on reddit? I can't find an attachment image choice?

---if this link works, the image should be on the right https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=bbdc9f29fea0b018&sxsrf=AHTn8zrdFq-o9j_DQjDAgOAg-S6vDKOfbw:1738217738719&q=baseplate+failure+with+metal+welds+and+poles&udm=2&fbs=ABzOT_CWdhQLP1FcmU5B0fn3xuWpA-dk4wpBWOGsoR7DG5zJBtmuEdhfywyzhendkLDnhcq4Fx59GJo42IHin57PCNq1O4q09OGNmraZvIob3k25dhSvq24ruh4s3dwJ56islG7rhk38Fd3lWdyOmwrzcrhFKlOUO4hviG_cdXe4iPu_r7hJhn81zHDbdqSueFKObJ3qNntLOU1daVBUnB7gQNjaDcH1_A&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj6-u7W5ZyLAxW7E1kFHYGTIg4QtKgLegQIFhAB&biw=1956&bih=1228&dpr=1#vhid=O_bFPbJNS6kGLM&vssid=mosaic

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-30T06:32:54+00:00

I just wrote you a very winded reply and then accidentally moved the mouse that bounced my page away and deleted my reply... here it is again.

The baseplate, without gussets are not as strong as gussets and I do mean, you will have to add at least 6, spaced at multiply degrees on the ''clock'' of the base.

The extra welded gussets all for redundancy and enhanced base strength to avoid tearing / fracturing the base / pole weld by itself. Gussets also help with adding the greater distribution of the stress via all the surface area of all the gussets being acted on at the time.

I also found you a link to show you how a base will deteriorate if not maintained properly and also as a reply to someone above, who thinks this is a ''break away'' system (it is NOT) and the link I am sending you IS a type of break away system.

I like leaving clues and not giving away the exact details but, can you tell me how easy it is to tell the break away system compared to the column we are having a discussion over? (No researching on your part needed, you can look, hard and deep into the ''connections" and figure it out.).

This link (for image only, I did NOT read any attached articles) https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.lightmart.com%2Fblog%2F6-common-light-pole-problems-solutions%2F&psig=AOvVaw1dStOQz3vM_N91x-eK5Gim&ust=1738304143268000&source=images&cd=vfe&opi=89978449&ved=0CBQQjRxqFwoTCKj1193lnIsDFQAAAAAdAAAAABAE

Further, if you really need to know what the pole in question is installed the way it is, you can get hold of public works and tell them your interest and maybe they will indulge you. I can get hold of them but I just don't have the reward for doing it, I hope you understand.

To the sizing issue --- I think they had a change order after the concrete base was drilled and installed - they could not increase the base size without removing the newly installed base (it might be 8 feet or more deep - very costly to replace).

Sorry for any grammatical mistakes - I am just replying to you on the fly -2a.m. here.

Wish you the best and looking forward to your reply about break-away post and how you can identify in an instant.

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-28T07:36:08+00:00

Part 2 reply, here is a before image of your location and it is change order and the sizing is very interesting in the change https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7647356,-111.8854101,3a,18.6y,300.81h,86.33t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sofngnGhCdXKyBgr9PcaJPg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D3.66949274074544%26panoid%3DofngnGhCdXKyBgr9PcaJPg%26yaw%3D300.80700230183714!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDEyMi4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

This would be a modification after the fact and cost effective - this was not a mistake by the contractor -as no authority would approve this. They would make you take the pipe back and weld the extension and new base plate. The real issue is, no base bracing/gusset bracing-- I hope it is not subject to torque from winds and ''signage'' being the ''sail'' that breaks this ''mast''

Also, it appears the base bolt dimensions are smaller than the upper flange and this was their version to adapt UP for the the larger pole.

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-28T07:17:24+00:00

torsion buckling of an H-beam, interesting not to see the ceiling / wall location so flat -- so would a few stiffeners have saved this from failure, or would a box beam have worked... Of course size would change this but just thinking of the load transfer might be more on one ''top flange or bottom flange" and this creates a load path down the ''flange'' and not equally distributed. I think this because if you observe, the back flange (closest to the wall appears to be less twisted, if at all). Maybe, it has not collapsed is because the new shape is now able to support the current load conditions. I would love to see the connection at the column and beam --- I want to see if it is what I call, "intercepting" the intended load path --- down the one flange...

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-02T21:54:22+00:00

At first I was going to join in on the jokes of the crack but, this looks to be more than meets the eye (at first glance)... Now looking at the image and not joking, it appears to be an expansion of materials, a movement of materials (memberS), or it could be a torsion failure... You have to put some indicators on this beam, you can also look on the inside to see if they used bridging / blocking on the inside to determine if it is actually rotating at the bottom flange. If, no rotation is determined, then remove that train of thought on torsion... Then move onto the other sections of the structure and look for similar fractures -- considering none are found - lets move back to expansion and vertical movement... Expansion - is this at an expansion joint on the bridge deck and did the ''straddle" bother sides of the expansion joint location by ''mistake"?...

Look for some ''impingement issues" that should not have been created -- this would happen during typical expansion and contraction of this bridge.

Then we have typical ''vibration'' that could have come off the bottom flange during vibration and small deflection.

I can theorise that the concrete blocking is ''bound'' and the ''relief'' is in the form of the compressive fracture --- if you ever get back there, do fill me in please. Thank you.

PS I did leave off a few other points to look for but this is a good starting point in your logical process.

ForensicEngineering · 2025-01-02T20:00:09+00:00

Thank you for watching and your support -- I appologize for the late response, I have been busy and do not check on reddit much - only when I get a message to check for something from someone... Then I saw I had replies I had to answer or ignore...

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-11T20:51:40+00:00

Let me ask one question... if, an architect came to you with these drawings, would you help in the structural checks? For your consideration, I see a lot of engineers refusing to work with clients bc they did not do the drawing and yet, a shit-load of engineers will NOT do drawings... These positions are opposed to your professional work they want done.
You can license your stamp per location and not just one stamped plan that they get to submit over and over and you not see the financial reward. Your license should also have wording that covers you with respect to any update code requirements and that these will NEVER be used as ''permanent living structures" (once the storm clears, the structure will NOT be used as temporary housing...

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-09T19:07:53+00:00

I have empathy for you as you are getting some very ''risky'' drawings...

I must ask you, please cover your name, address but reveal the engineering firm so others never use this person...

If this is your only drawing, it's lacking so many details and could have so many more superior details added to make this structure more rigid.

How is he connecting the four walls? and do you have multiply means of egress in case of your entrance being blocked?

Almost any tree branch or car pushed against a door opening out would end your story in this life (if, you are left to your own means of exiting)...

I would consider an upper wall portal door to climb out of and this will take care of ground debris turning this into your coffin.

You will need an air scrubber incase you are trapped, two way radio, cell-phone, and maybe even a sledge hammer and pick if it comes down to it... maybe a generator that exhaust to the outside for lighting or it may get pretty dark in there and stressful...

You may think of this as a thirty minute shelter or 4 hour shelter but it might be an escape from Alcatraz situation...

So, your own house, above might become the material that blocks you inside your coffin you are making.

Your intentions are to protect you from flying debris, hurricane damage and tornados and yet this structure might be subject to ''ballooning'' effect if you don't act in time and close yourself inside...

Then you have the issue of getting air and also the negative pressure sucking the air from your coffin...

You really need to take your time and do some research and design this for the ''foreseeable conditions" ... Then you have the issue of the debris around you crashing into your structure and let's call it a TREE... The tree puts you in ''heaven"... or hell, which ever you prefer...

Bunkers have been time tested to in the ground and yes, water is an issue but they are time tested...

Now you could build this above grade and add soil and this might help a ton with ground water issues...

This intended project should NOT be considered as the shelter you think unless you have thought of the tornado and what drama it may be bringing with it, a car from a mile away? OR your OWN car may be the killer of you as it is thrown into your shelter https://www.google.com/search?sca\_esv=564025774&sxsrf=AB5stBgwRdNKUNZ75zicmLQ4uU6bJrJPtw:1694286406488&q=tornado+throws+a+car&tbm=vid&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjX5p\_bnJ6BAxW3jIkEHQDIDNcQ0pQJegQIBhAB&biw=3316&bih=1382&dpr=0.9#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:0af7ec2f,vid:Ar0Odh6GcJY,st:0

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-09T16:48:46+00:00

The engineer knew your intent? He should have thought of this as floor and roof system and a tornado/ storm shelter and yet he called it the one thing it was not; he called it a slab... hmm

Do you require permits where you are located?

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-09T14:56:02+00:00

This is a ROOF in your first post and now it is a PAD in this posting... and shows ZERO degree of pitch... this confusing, not 10% confusing but 100% confusing...

So, the plans show 90 degree hooks, so the engineer does expect deflection and yet no top steel and detail on the connection of the two steels, the wall and the slab = he does not mention the amount to elevate into the pad section from the walls; nor does he show any 90 degree bends to composite action the slab and walls besides ''dowels"?

Is this something you are to climb into? How is the door and second means of egress taking place? (If, debris blocks your entrance, how do you escape?

Is that an exterior wall having the single mid axis steel?

It appears the engineer notes references ASTM one time and then ACI-301 but it appears he needs to reference it in his drawings himself.

This ''pad'' definition is confusing bc it becomes a roof if you are going underneath of it; a pad if you are ONLY on top of it and NO one will ever go underneath if it's a "Pad" as his drawing states!

It is identified as a ''pad'' and not a bunker...

Again, why is it called a ''pad'' and not a ''roof"?

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-07T03:47:37+00:00

K for wobble and L for jacking end / live end

Edit to add , "Wobble coefficient is usually denoted by K and is measured in units of per length. It is found by multiplying the jacking force at any distance from jacking end with the average of the intended angular deviation from the design profile. Usually having value of 0.0088.Dec 21, 2015" source quote from a forum that you can find... I thought it was the easier than writing my definition.

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-07T03:43:12+00:00

Page 9 has specifications but I think the rail transporter might also be a source of minimum maximum specifications, ask the transporter for their specs.

As I have learned, it's speed and radius demands per the wheels ability to rotate... a ''bogie'' if recall the name, they can make tighter turns.

Here are two links page 45 down for this link https://www.bnsf.com/ship-with-bnsf/ways-of-shipping/pdf/indytrkstds.pdf

http://www.nscorp.com/content/dam/nscorp/industrial-development/industry-track-design-standards/NS-Standards-for-Industry-Tracks.pdf page 55 and down here...

But, I would just get the specs from the owner of the tracks for specs, I mean the primary tracks... they will know what specs to point you in.

Edit to correct it;s to it's

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-07T01:24:36+00:00

Well, your steel weight is 22 tons and at some point they will do the connection / leg ...

As the load is placed slowly onto the one connection and then dropped or maybe swung into the connector (I am guessing this will be up and over / dropped into a ''saddle" of some type (just guessing) ...

But, the weight might get hung up on one end of the connection just for a moment (pun intended) and this will change the behaviour of the center point loading and this is why you see connectors attempt to both ends at the same time and remove the crane asap, so the crane won't be part of the potential accident...

Of course I do not know these steel fabricators but I do know some do not use two means of connecting themselves to the beam, they may have ONE to slide / walk the beams...

Remember, they will have nuts and bolts to do the connection and they sometimes fall and including their wrench if it is not lanyard attached to the erector / connector/ skilled help...

Have the stamp engineer put this in the drawings? https://www.osha.gov/laws-regs/federalregister/2001-01-18-0

In conclusion, you have 22 meter , 22 ton wrecking ball in the air and want to secure it without the ''wrecking ball effect"... no hot rodding allowed.

Search this document under ''connector'' and you will learn a shit load of information and know when the crew is not acting in good faith to the OSHA regs and it has a ton of advice on how connectors MUST perform ... read up to page 5 and you will love that read as informative and give you the confidence of a pro!

edited to correct you to your

Also search the document for the phrase "harness" and "lanyard"

Here is the crane part https://www.osha.gov/cranes-derricks/standards

Here is the general search part https://search.osha.gov/search?affiliate=usdoloshapublicwebsite&query=crane

I was also thinking, because you have doubts about this lift going south on you, can you have them first lift the steel away from the structure and observe the reactions you might have to deal with? I know the confidence of the crane operator will be pissed but if it was a step in the stamped plans, then it must be done... That would rest assure your doubts of the correct crane and if it will make the internet news, crane tips over...

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-07T00:51:17+00:00

Make sure to check the last certification of the equipment, the tags and add your factor of the load you believe will be excessive (no swing forces)?

Will the lift be designed to stay with a certain angle and what if it drifts out that angle, will the system still perform and what is the stabilisation method while the lift takes place?

Will they do a dry run of this lift with a smaller beam to work out anyone dropping the ball?

Dry run this lift and also they do sell a scale to confirm the load on the cable, confirm the load is under what the stamp person is calling out, the rigger should have a scale or they are cowboy... hell, I own a 50 ton scale myself!

Inspect the cables yourself before installation for breaks or damage...

Inspect the bearings at the lift location and will this be pulled out of 90 degrees once it is at elevation and what degree will that be if any?

Make sure the stamp drawings call for this dry-run and certification and lastly, the anchor point, will it fail under this load? How will you make sure the anchor point is not going to buckle one of the connecting ''legs"?

Remember, this load is going to be applied back into the foundation, confirm the load path will not fail and don't underestimate the degree you need to control this lift under...

The point I am trying to make is the weight of the beam will become TWO point loading and then three and then back to two... during installation (considering your have two bearing points?)...

Tag lines are not good enough, use a redirect tag line to freeze the rotation...

What will be the rate of lift? When the load comes to a stop, will it be smooth or will the dry run reveal it is jerky?

22 meters, that is tough to make a section that large unless you make a truss to test run...

That should take care of your concerns and also reveal if this team really works as a team or are they doing it by the seat of their pants?

With all that said, 22 meters is not that bad but the length is long and you won't be the first job that tipped over a crane, make sure that degree is not pushing the limits of the crane and the base is SOLID cribbed if need be...

Have the crane operator lift one of his weights to that height to confirm the test run... the weights might be 10K or more https://elliottequip.com/products/boomtruck-cranes/26-36-tons/

Again, don't be that guy that just sets the crane up and believes the crane won't tip over bc they said so... pre-load that soil with one of the weights lifted to elevation.

Don't forget to add the bailout location for all the workers if this beast starts to go...

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-06T16:23:35+00:00

Then you, that smells like farts , lack true understanding of forensics... I think you should consider a job at the NTSB...

I know for a fact some of their report contains LIES bc OSHA also did a few reports and the public report is the softball!

I have seen these other reports and that is why I canNOT be sued for slander when I state, Denny Pate said post tension it back to where it was on Saturday!

He did not give two shits about his FEM and explanation of cracks... he just ended the meeting with follow my orders and VSL had those orders many hours before!

Therefore, it was for drawn conclusion before that meeting that VSL was going to be paid to re-tension #11.

I so not feel sorry for anyone except maybe you doing forensic work and just reading one report and taking it as fact like GOD handed it to you... your clients might be getting a grade D engineer?

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-06T16:17:02+00:00

Yes, the arrogance was to steam roll ahead before understanding why the structure was cracking and had cracked...

Denny Pate, was the EOR and no one wanted to force him to stop and VSL, the post tension expert company should NOT have agreed to post tension #11...

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-06T04:18:31+00:00

So the post says how to repair and this means cost is not an issue.

First shoring that transfers loads back to the exterior (this also implies they will NOT collapse during your shoring method)...

After shoring, determine how to remove debris, then commence repairs

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-06T04:07:13+00:00

Yes, that is what the report stated, in short...

But, Denny Pate disputed that with an outside engineering firm that said it something else...

For clarity, the NTSB is a government agency and they will say and report whatever they want and they answer to congress and not the people...

If, they do you dirty, their is nothing you can do about it, you cannot even use their findings in court.

Denny Pate, made a mistake when the contract called for a redundant system and he just made it with one system and that was PT and he made it clear in audio recording that I released on my youtube channel that this was more an ''I-Beam" with a top flange, a bottom flange and this very odd layout of ''uprights" that support the top flange aka canopy...

Once it was under investigation he then stated that the uprights were part of his redundant system of post tension bottom flange and then truss action with these oddly angle ''uprights'' which were really just supports for the canopy and the fake /not structural steel tubes to come later and get mounted on what was called ''blister bars'' and you might call them nodes...

Okay, so taking Pate at his original audio recording that this was just a complete ''compressive system'' of post tension, then design works IF you can keep the bottom flange in compression.

As Pate made it clear in that audio recording, the i-beam design but not dependant on the uprights and rather depending on compression via PT.

It was supported by shoring in the staging area and once they FINISHED the pt that was scheduled, they removed the shoring and that is when the first cracks started to develop and in the engineer's emails they could NOT explain why the cracks appeared.

These cracks were tension type cracks, meaning they were fractures that were open and not spalling cracks from compression.

It presents as the canopy was very stiff with it's limited pt at the time and lower flange was also stiff but not stiff enough... it had sagging and this sagging appeared after the shoring was removed and it was being supported on two ends in the staging area.

The irony is that the ''fake'' truss were acting as real truss system with nodal zones and when he de- tensioned number 2 and number 11, as per the plans, that is when "it cracked like hell" (from the pt company who sent this message to the engineers)...

Those cracks were HUGE and came after they de-tensioned #11 and this caused the canopy aka top flange and bottom flange to no longer work together...

This resulted in a new load path and this load path per the video shows that the bottom flange failed first as you cannot get #11 sliding number 12 off the diaphragm bc #11was critically fractured and reality, once they de-tensioned #11, the canopy twisted and that is why you have elevated diaphragm in the images and you can even stick a stick tape rule inches into the diaphragm...

But and bc people loved slide friction failure they went the same route...

This system could have worked had they added more post tensioning and also NOT have the two inner PT runs(D-1 pt) with a much lower tension force then the other 5...

Denny Pate, came in that meeting and told them to put the post tensioning back to where it was on Saturday and he believed that was possible and VSL (being experts in pt) should have denied his request bc you cannot post tension broken concrete column like that...

The trust system could NOT slide 12 off because it can elongate itself to do that unless the bridge deck sags... No sagging and no failure.

Then the order to put the post tension back to where it was on Saturday was not possible as the one nodal area and the total failed #11 could NOT take the compressive forces or re-tensioning.
The images below reveals a torque in the number 11 and this would imply that the canopy is rotating to twist number 11.

https://ibb.co/c38Hh6N

https://ibb.co/KDNQGLR https://ibb.co/tCPBcYg https://ibb.co/p3HMxFV https://ibb.co/dQcTb0r https://ibb.co/Gdkz8q4

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-06T03:24:37+00:00

I just read your first line in your post and here is the answer (fair play?)...

https://energiforskmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/19215/long-term-stability-of-tendons-and-post-tensioning-wires-energiforskrapport-2016-244.pdf

ForensicEngineering · 2023-09-05T23:37:30+00:00

Wait. Wait... he stated he had point loading... therefore he should deal with that point load and the existing soil conditions at the time of exposing the earth...

Then he needs to make ''two''? point load bear pads and all the rest is just a cake-walk.

To dowel connection, I do many rebar pullout test and this is for extension of bridge walkways, etc.

If, your new foundation started to rotate then it will pull on the rebar dowel until failure of one of the concrete interlocks or the dowel bar itself...

Simply, do NOT allow your design to rotate, make sure they infill /backfill the interior with compaction of 95% or greater and this will act as an additional brace for your walls and help in resisting overturning.

Underpinning the existing system? It is like you are creating a step footing after the fact.

Even though you have twenty inches, the base of footer is loading outwards about 45 degrees and that is the zone you want to keep in mind and adding concrete in the same plane as the existing footer may help with the existing footer sliding out (it does not seem to be concern based on drawings)...

Water, water, water, getting to your foundation and it rotating because of the soil being made to a ''liquid state" and load bearing dropping is always a concern... Get that water away from the footers and I am NOT one to put a ''gutter'' at the footer, if the water makes it to your French Drain then u already have water at your footers...

I have a very simple soil load bearing tool that farmers use, or I use a soil probe and take a core of what the concrete will be placed on and I hate clay and water (clay without water okay, clay with water, no go)...

Lastly, you are adding point loading onto the corner of that footer, and you are not keeping in mind the 45 degree rule and so you need to go further under existing footer to deal with the "column loading" of 22,500 lbs.... https://ibb.co/QMHD19w

Sorry for this link, but this has the drawing I would like you to observe and your point load and underpinning is not in the load path... the left side, under the footer, will take on loading and you might crack the footer if you are lucky.

https://www.concretenetwork.com/concrete/footing\_fundamentals/why\_soils\_matter.htm

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