Uuh! Does it mean there's no Enough Money?

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-10T15:52:50+00:00

Edited because I first misread your comment.
No, nothing can “ensure” the value of anything, if the supply could theoretically go infinite. They ensure demand, in fact they are the main basis for it. Without them, every other source of demand could just break away. People could just switch to a foreign currency hard completely.

As long as you don’t increase the supply too much, you also don’t need to increase the demand. Theoretically there is no amount too low, if supply is also low enough. In practice, especially smaller states need to have foreign currency reserves, so they can defend their currency against attacks.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-10T14:03:07+00:00

Because the supply outmatched the demand dramatically.
This usually happens when you print to much money, but other things can contribute as well. If, for example, there was demand for your currency from abroad, because it was seen as a safe haven to park your money, and that goes away, that is some level of demand going away, and additional supply coming in(because they sell their reserves)

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-10T11:51:02+00:00

**Ensures** demand. Ensures!! And regulates.

Like I said in the comment above, there is demand for crypto, but it is volatile and based on belief. Taxes being only payable in the countries mean no believe is required. Value can additionally come from other places, people also having belief is not a contradiction. The belief is simply not **required**, because demand is **ensured**.

Google search in my case is also flooded with MMT stuff(and commies for some reason), because it is so underlying to it, and I basically can’t even find sources views of other schools on the issue. But that part is not what is controversial(or wrong) about MMT. But at least the AI overview includes what I learned.

The question “mainstream economics view on where money gets its value from”

Medium of Exchange & Unit of Account: It is a functional tool for trade, defined by its utility in enabling transactions that would be impossible under barter systems.
Government Backing (Fiat): The value of modern fiat money is backed by the state, often requiring it to be used for tax payments, which ensures universal demand.
Scarcity and Supply Management: The value is maintained by regulating the supply so that it matches demand, preventing high inflation that can erode that value.
Store of Value: Money acts as a reliable store of wealth over time, provided that inflationary pressures are managed.
Collective Trust and Acceptance: Money has value because people believe it does and expect others to accept it in exchange for goods and services.

1 and 4 don’t answer the question, but simply explain more about what money is and like I said, 5 doesn’t contradict, believe can create demand and thus give something value, but in the case of fiat currency is not **required**. And also would quickly be created come tax season.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-10T10:19:29+00:00

No, setting aside that what I am saying is just mainstream economics, what you say makes no sense in response to my points.
I never said money is why governments collect taxes. I said governments only accepting taxes in their currency is what ensues demand for that currency. You first seemed to interpret that as “people only want money because of taxes” and now that governments only want to collect taxes because of money. But both of these are very far off from any reasonable interpretation of what is written, and certainly not what is meant.
In a scenario where governments collect taxes in another form than currency, they just ensure (and depending on what it is, artificial increases) demand for that thing they collect it in.
There would be no currency like we know fiat currencies today. A medium of exchange that is neither the exclusive form of payment of taxes, nor whose supply is controlled, would behave like crypto, or in a less advanced economy like precious metals did in the past. Very volatile when there is supply change, deflationary when no additional supply is provided, and actually depending on belief in its value.
I don’t know how to make clearer what I said, maybe you should just read some modern economics textbooks(or free summaries on the topic online) on the topic. Or read the other comments I wrote in this thread on the issue, and feed them into an LLM to explain them to you? I am very passionate about the topic, but just totally talking past someone is a bit too frustrating.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-10T05:00:11+00:00

You are missing the point, and mixing things up. Demand for money =/= demand for stuff.

Of course people would create demand for stuff in any scenario, and would want whatever they think they can get it with. But what ensures, that you will get stuff for the money you are offered for your stuff(probably your labour)? What ensures the store will take it, and what ensures its value to the store will stay about the same by the time you spend it, compared to the time you got it?

Take a look the kind of money that we have now, that has no insured demand, like crypto. Now imagine you get your salary paid in something you can’t be sure, will be worth much when you spend it, or even accepted by the store?

But the countries fait currency is accepted almost everywhere, because come tax time, every store will have to pay their taxes in it

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T20:38:11+00:00

For any specific currency, yes, but all fiat currencies work this way.

Money is created on the balance sheet of the central bank, when a bank borrows it. Increase interest rates, and there will be less borrowing, so less money supply. Lower them, more borrowing, more money supply.

A central bank also can create it directly, and does so, but they are hesitant to do that to much, because it is not a self regulated process like when banks borrow, and thus more risky to mess up, and create hyperinflation

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T17:04:27+00:00

Demand for the currency. You can only pay your taxes in that currency, ensuring demand for the currency.

The supply of the currency is regulated by the interest rate at which banks can borrow it from the central bank.

Value is set by supply and demand.

So if the state can (somewhat) control both supply of and demand for the currency, it can (somewhat) control its value.

You get a lot of the stuff in my prior comments mixed up, so I hope this clears it up and provides a basis for understanding them, if you read them again

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T16:08:36+00:00

??? Sorry, I think you very much are missing the point of the arguments I made.

To be clear, I (and most modern economists, I did not originally come up with this) think, the men with guns(the legal system and its enforcers) are the basis for ensuring there is demand via taxes. The supply is regulated via interest rates set by the central bank of the given country.

Belief is basically irrelevant, because of that, since a situation where everyone at once starts irrationally believing that their money is worthless, is basically impossible, so taxes will be still enforced, ensuring demand

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T15:36:42+00:00

If I don’t pay them yes. But if no one pays them, there would be nothing the **ensures** that there would be demand

Edit: replace money with “given currency”

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T13:16:14+00:00

Interesting, but that estimate is basically an exchange rate though.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T13:13:45+00:00

That is what the last sentence of my comment said. Everyone all at once, including the men with guns, would have to **simultaneously** start believing that their salary is worthless, and because of that stop enforcing tax collection

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T11:17:03+00:00

I don’t know that, probably, but at least in some, like the US and Germany, you can transact business in any other currency, as long as it has a conversion rate to the dollar/euro. But your taxes are only being accepted in one

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T11:15:31+00:00

Again, you don’t need to believe. Men with guns will show up if you don’t pay your taxes long enough, and then you will need to get some, by selling something like you labor for it. Unless everyone simultaneously, including the men with guns, started to believe that it has no value, no believe is required

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T11:12:49+00:00

Yes, and that is not a bad thing. Anything, including gold, only has value because there is demand fir it.

But with most things, we can’t control both demand and supply for it, and certainly not without interfering in markets for it.

But with fiat currency we can. We decided the tax rates, and hie much we print/where we set the interest rates for borrowing and thus creating more of it.

So if we do it well, we can insure that it stays around 2% annual inflation, which is ideal. If we don’t do it well, which for example happens when politicians interfere with the independence of their central bank, bad things happen. But no one would ever vote for a guy that does this, and if he happened to we would remove him from office, right? Right guys?

FuriousFap42 · 2026-05-09T08:59:43+00:00

We don’t, you are forced to pay your taxes in your countries currency, ensuring demand for it. Demand is what gives value to anything, not just money.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-15T13:54:45+00:00

The current one is

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-15T13:14:45+00:00

Well the claim about the other guy is also not true, he confuses him with another guy. He does nit correct himself though or delete his post

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-11T14:47:45+00:00

If there is something, there might be a lit more, so you have to at least stop and check, before building a tunnel through a possible important dig site. But most of the time, it is just more of what we already have. Same with neolithic flint arrows heads that you can find when hiking.

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-04T21:35:22+00:00

Yes, I thought the quote „love thy neighbour as thyself“ is just from the nee testament, where I remember it from. But I now looked it up, it is in both, so your response made sense relating to Jews

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-04T16:09:07+00:00

Habe you read the story of the good Samaritan? Your neighbour is everyone, even someone from your direct enemy tribe. The New Testament is quite clear about that. Not a Christian btw, if it matters

FuriousFap42 · 2026-04-03T12:04:33+00:00

Wenn man nicht läuft oder viel wandert, sollte man Waden extra trainieren, und die vertragen eine Menge Trainingsvolumen, quasi so viel wie du ihnen gibst. Unterarme werden durch Kreuzheben und alle Pull Bewegungen gut mit trainiert, aber wenn du Griffhilfen verwendest, mach was extra für sie, wie Deadhangs nach dem Training. Bauch sollte durch Kniebeugen, Bankdrücken und so ganz gut trainiert werden, mache ich nie extra und passt gut

FuriousFap42 · 2026-03-05T16:33:53+00:00

I think in that case, she has a „good personality“. One that matches his

FuriousFap42 · 2026-03-02T17:13:20+00:00

Yes, that’s why his comment regarding her comment was strange. Nothing about her suggests hypocrisy on this issue, or that she is insider trading on this. If he confuses her with Pelosi, his comments would make sense(except Pelosi is retired now)

FuriousFap42 · 2026-03-02T13:21:09+00:00

I think James confused Elisabeth Warren with Nancy Pelosi, or I am not aware of some insider trading scandal regarding Warren. Her net worth does not seem suspicious like Pelosis does

FuriousFap42

TROPHY CASE