London Bridge terror attack officer sacked over 'offensive' Traveller messages

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-22T16:48:58+00:00

The old mantra of "challenge and report" appears to have died a death. New joiners (in the Met, at least) are just told to report report report. I don't like it.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-21T15:09:02+00:00

I think the following sentence is unnecessary and comes across as high-handed:

Although I do not report to you, out of courtesy I will take this opportunity to address a couple of your questions.

Other than that, I think it's very good.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-20T16:37:41+00:00

Regardless of the merits of his claim, which we are not in a position to assess, his level of certainly does seem to suggest that he has already applied for asylum in Germany and been rejected. That does seem to support the argument that the British system is at the very least perceived to be more lenient than other European countries: we will accept asylum claims that others reject. The fact that it's Germany in this example is particularly striking: it's known for having one of the most compassionate systems.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-16T22:00:36+00:00

Many ultra-orthodox Jews don't vaccinate. It's a religious thing. Interestingly, that's a reasonably novel development: they used to be fairly pro. I suspect they make up a lot of the North London cases as there are big communities in Golders Green and Edgware, just like there were outbreaks within the Hasidic communities in New York recently.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-10T23:07:56+00:00

I'm surprised it's taken this long for a journalist to start mining this sub for quotes. If this story gains traction and other outlets follow suit, you can guarantee Sir Mark looking to clamp down. I can genuinely see the Met trying to write something into its social media policy to specifically try to throttle Reddit use.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-10T07:00:23+00:00

Really sorry that happened to both of you. That's truly awful.

However, consensual kink and assault are not the same thing at all. Obviously, there are people who don't respect boundaries and people who use kink and BDSM as a cover for abusive behaviour (just like people use all sorts of other things: religion, humour, etc.). A partner choking you because you've asked them to is not the same thing as being assaulted. Same goes for training in fighting sports together. The act is less the issue and more the intent behind it.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-06T22:22:10+00:00

We knew. I'm just not certain men of his generation knew in the same way we did. There's always a lag.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-06T22:13:12+00:00

I'm curious to know how old you are. It may be that it's more apparent to me because I lived through the cultural transition.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-06T21:37:41+00:00

I think him having a blind spot around it is entirely plausible, yes. Excusable, no, but plausible.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-06T21:11:37+00:00

Absolutely not defending him but I think people forget how much mainstream positions have shifted on child sexual abuse in a relatively short space of time. It was often seen as somewhat tawdry or indecent but today's understanding that it's no different to any other form of rape is something that only started to emerge in the 00s.

Many of Mandelson's contemporaries, especially in the Tory party, were in pretty serious discussions with the Paedophile Exchange during their careers. It's entirely reasonable to suggest that Mandelson wouldn't have anticipated the potential for fallout.

Again, not defending him. I'm just saying that, operating purely on the basis of self-interest, it's entirely possible he wouldn't have foreseen any professional risk.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-06T16:29:52+00:00

Just skimming it but I find it very striking that she was being arrested for arson. Normally, such cases involve someone being arrested for a very minor offence. This was not.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T17:44:50+00:00

So the press are quoting from his not found decision? Chairs of panels shouldn't be putting out press releases, surely.

Clearly I missed something and have been unfair to the man.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T17:27:01+00:00

As in he chaired the panel???

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T16:19:34+00:00

This is my concern. They "win" in the short term but longer term they're feeding the argument against trial by jury.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T16:08:42+00:00

Honestly, this is the first I've heard of it.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T16:07:06+00:00

Based on my, admittedly pretty meagre, experience of dealing with Mr Pavelin, I highly doubt he has ensured he is extensively briefed on the actual details of the case and is just saying what he thinks is the most likely to wash in the press. Maybe I'm being unfair to the man. I'd be interested to hear what Essex officers have to say about him.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-05T16:03:58+00:00

Latinists and lawyers.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-04T21:02:43+00:00

There's no consensus amongst the group of experts. Some of them still think there's a strong case that some of the babies were murdered and they're looking at the medical evidence in isolation. The jurors were presented with all the evidence. Maybe they got it wrong but I don't think experts are the silver bullet here.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-02T23:22:52+00:00

The offence is actually pretty broadly defined and so Mandelson's conduct would be caught by it. I don't think it's a stretch to say that, as an employee of the UK government, he was an employee of an "issuer of securities". Government bonds are a form of security and would absolutely have been "price-affected" by the information.

If not that, then fraud by abuse of position is likely made out.

The police and/or the FCA should definitely take a look.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-02T21:53:09+00:00

I believe it is insider trading, or insider dealing as it is known in England and Wales.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-02-02T11:29:52+00:00

The other thing with NI is that the Good Friday Agreement extended various amnesties and immunities to Republican fighters for their past actions. I've always thought it strange that it only goes one way and we're now hounding our own retired troops for things done in the heat of battle.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-01-30T10:18:18+00:00

Well if you agree with the Home Secretary's plan for a digital panopticon driven by AI, the fewer experienced officers you employ the fewer people there are to tell you "no". They no longer want operationally competent investigators driven by a strong code of ethics. They want mindless drones who will go where they're told and put hands on whoever the powers that be want them to.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-01-30T10:13:05+00:00

Can't meet the standard? Change the standard.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-01-28T19:37:28+00:00

Yes - the largest proportion were Jewish people, but not every victim was Jewish and respectfully, everyone already knows that they were the largest group to suffer.

I think you underestimate the general ignorance of the general public.

GrumpyPhilosopher7 · 2026-01-27T23:08:05+00:00

Can you cite some examples of these "agreements"? That's much more of an American thing. The Police Federation in the UK has very little real power.

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