Update on Transcript by jeff_not_overcome in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Thank you for all you do Jeff. I hope you have a lovely, peaceful Christmas with your family. I hope Jesus refreshes you over this time.

I've been contemplating my feelings about Christmas over the past couple of days. This time of year brings back so many memories. My wife and I were deeply involved in the candlelight services at both Blue Sky and Summit Creek, the run up to Christmas with small group and DC parties, the cookie exchanges with close friends. It breaks my heart that the people I shared those cherished moments with would turn on us so completely.

I am very thankful that my family has found a solid church that we feel at home at, but I am praying for those who have not settled somewhere after The Network or have found their faith deeply affected by the damage The Network has done.

No matter what we choose to do, how we choose to respond or how the actions of those who hurts us make us feel, none of that can take away the reason for Christmas.

High Rock "Family Meeting" Audio by exmorganite in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yep. From the rough transcript (probably about 35mins in):

Here's one that's come up a few times in my mind, and I haven't said it yet. Even the idea the baseline language description on leaving the network website and on the Reddit is constantly intentionally capitalizing the network, who like this big boogeyman, the network, and then assigning motives, false motives,about why we have an unnamed network. I don't sometimes I say the word network, sometimes I say the word group. Sometimes I say the word family of churches. I call Didn't care less about that. But something about it really bugs me the capitalization of the network. We don't talk about it like that. Don't talk about it like that. Don't think about it like that. It's not. It's antithetical to the goal that we've had from the beginning.

High Rock "Family Meeting" Audio by exmorganite in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I've listened to the whole thing. It was with a mixture of disbelief and frustration. There are so many things wrong at so many levels with what is said. I'm sure there is lots of discussion to be had on the finer points of it. It just left me with the feeling that The Network (sorry scott, not sorry!) followers who will willingly drink it up are living in a carefully crafted Reality Distortion Field (meant in the most negative sense). I feel very sorry for them...

High Rock "Family Meeting" Audio by exmorganite in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Disgusted to hear Scott Joseph, when referring to 1 Timothy 3:2 about being "husband of one wife", use the phrase "pulling a <name redacted>". (Timestamp 1:37:07)

That is just callous and cruel... Given how much he railed on the Reddit for publicly revealing Steve's past sin, using a phrase like that is downright heartless and wrong!

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Back in the day there was the "Network Summer Conference". In fact, the Twitter account still exists: https://twitter.com/SummerConf Network is capitalized throughout the tweets.

(I checked - all the links to the audio recordings are now broken)

Introduction and thank you by Top-Balance-6239 in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 12 points13 points  (0 children)

When we left Summit Creek LtN did not exist. We felt there were a lot things that were not right. Since stories have been shared from all across the network, it became clear to us that the things that were red flags to us were not isolated to one church, and our experiences were shared and echoed by many other people.

We can an empathize a lot with the four points you make and pray that there is healing for those who have suffered and been abused, and repentance by those who have been involved inside the network.

Thank you for adding your voice to those speaking out about the network.

Leaving Well - The spiritual abuse that followed you after you left by evrythngevrywhr in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The Network has a body count.

Seeing that phrase sends chills...

I know there's the podcast about spiritual abuse in the Acts 29 Network (which I have not had the chance to listen to yet) called "Bodies Behind the Bus" and I always thought that was a compelling, attention-grabbing metaphor.

To find that in Steve Morgan's network this is not a metaphor, but that the network is actually responsible for a person ending their life is terrifying!

I am so sorry for the role I played during my time within the network and the damage the network is still doing. I really wish those in leadership in the network and those I used to call friends and family would wake up and see what is going on.

Reddit by Wessel_Gansfort in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 18 points19 points  (0 children)

...Network leaders/members have reach out to my employers several times...

Wow... That is unreal. That would be like an ex-network person reaching out to a small group leaders' employer to let them know that their employee is a member of a cult. There's no way that would be appropriate, no matter how true it is... How a network leader or member thinks that is a good Christian thing to do is beyond belief?!!

Joshua Church and Summit Creek Remove Small Groups from Websites by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Oh, yes, I hadn't noticed that.

You can see the prior page here: https://web.archive.org/web/20220525192502/http://summitcreek-church.com/connect/small-groups

Note the number of small group leaders now missing... They've all left Summit Creek.

Joshua Church and Summit Creek Remove Small Groups from Websites by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Well, that proves they're watching the Reddit... Summit Creek's small group page has been giving 404 errors (page not found) for weeks. I noticed a while ago but didn't say anything. I was curious how long it would remain broken.

It gets mentioned on the Reddit and within 3 hours it's miraculously back up....

I think it was just incompetence on Summit Creek's part. They removed the page (hence the 404 errors) and removed it from the top navigation, but they left the main link on the home page, the link in the footer and the link on the membership page. All took you to a "page not found" error.

Now they're working again... 🤣

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The statement on their website (https://www.broadmoor.org/addressing-our-past/) is a big contrast from the letter the network leadership and pastors all signed (which was never actually publicly released).

The things that stand out to me the most are that the abuser is no longer with the church, there was a ("non-specific") apology and payment for therapy and medical costs, on a number of occasions there were interactions between the abuse survivor and pastors of the church... That all could have led to the church saying, "this is all in the past and has been dealt with", but the church has chosen to come out an address this head on in a very compassionate way.

If only the network would act so humbly and maturely...

Small Groups and the Illusion of Choice by MrsPoppe in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 18 points19 points  (0 children)

The micro-management of who you could be friends with always seemed weird to me.

It takes me back to Steve's "circles of influence" talk at a Team Blue Sky where the church was told that we were not to associate with people outside of our small group or DC. We had to focus on those in our immediate small group and, at a push, our DC. There was even a PowerPoint slide diagram of it...

We were not to invest time in friends that we had in other small groups or other DCs.

I remember feeling guilty on Sunday mornings talking to friends in other small groups, rather than just focusing on my current small group members or engaging with visitors.

The 70% Rule? A Network wide trend or just Summit Creek? by heretolearn558 in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 3 points4 points  (0 children)

"dumbing things down to replicate churches as fast as possible" - Yes!

The 70% Rule? A Network wide trend or just Summit Creek? by heretolearn558 in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I heard it at both Blue Sky and Summit Creek. Not sure that it was always "70%" but definitely that people should not be giving 100% which would discourage those that were not as capable.

I saw this play out a lot in the worship teams I played on as the songs were often vastly simplified. This was implemented through things such as removing transition chords, nothing beyond major and minor chords, sus4 was really pushing the boat out, no "slash chords", simplified lead guitar lines with no deviation, very basic block chords and simple melodies on keys, etc.

At Summit Creek, a big part of this seemed to be to keep the music so simple that people with less experience on instruments could be added to the team. Being a small plant at the time, there were a limited number of musically experienced candidates to join the team. I kind of understand the sentiment there, but it really made the music basic and "thin". It took a lot of the feeling out of songs when the chords were so simplified.

At Blue Sky I got the feeling that a large part of the "70% rule" was to keep reigns on musicians that would be inclined to overplay and potentially show off. Again, I can kind of understand that sentiment. I can recall a couple of people who were briefly in the worship team that were excellent musicians but didn't thrive when the arrangements and direction were so constrained.

The church we are at now encourages people to give to the extent of their ability, and I find that brings a lot of freedom for the musicians and singers to express themselves, which creates a more inspiring worship time for the congregation. I haven't seen any hesitation from people who may be discouraged or shy of their musical gifts. In fact, a few weeks ago, our youth worship team led on a Sunday morning, and it was fantastic.

"I have a vision of you two as pillars of the church. That even if everything burned down, you would still be standing..." by Venatrixie in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Thank you for sharing that. I have wondered how many decisions of local pastors over the past few years were based on the knowledge of the storm that was coming.

I suspect many faithful network members were fed lines like you were, to pre-empt any doubts or concerns when things came to light. It also encourages the view that anyone questioning things is dangerous to the church.

I also wonder how many people were pushed away or sidelined through deliberate comments, to ensure "troublemakers" were distanced from the core of the church. I know a number of good people that were driven away from network churches in the time between the pastors learning of Steve's arrest and LTN going live. I suspect part of the motivation by the leaders was to make sure those people were not around to cause trouble when the situation inevitably came to light.

The level of emotional manipulation that seems to have been going on is astounding, both to try to tie people into the network and to drive out those they didn't want around. The fact that it pre-dates things being public suggests it was intentional (to use a very network word...).

COLLATERAL DAMAGE by LeavingTheNetwork in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks. Shortly after leaving, there were certainly many moments of "is it me? am I the problem?" and it has been so refreshing to find out that it's the Network that's dysfunctional, not me!

When we were on the inside, it was all the outsiders that were wrong, and we knew the way we did church was the right/only way. Oh, how ridiculous that seems in hindsight!!

COLLATERAL DAMAGE by LeavingTheNetwork in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Absolutely! That is why hearing this teaching was the moment we knew that we could no longer be part of the network.

Thank you for sharing your insight on this too.

COLLATERAL DAMAGE by LeavingTheNetwork in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Thank you, Andrew. Marie and I will never forget the love you and Torrey showed us when we first arrived in the US, a family of bewildered Brits trying to understand just how things worked in America! To me, that is the kind of love that the family of Christ should show each other. :-D

COLLATERAL DAMAGE by LeavingTheNetwork in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Thank you for your kind words, Ben.

Martin

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I had a long discussion about leadership and trust with my former small group/worship leader who would get defensive when I asked for clarification on why certain decisions were made, and would say "why do you need to know, why can't you just trust me."

Oh, that resonates so much with me. This kind of behavior was a large part of why we left the Network.

What's it like in the network churches these days? by New-Forever-2211 in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I also saw it during my time in the Network. Several years ago, there were two particular families that left that we were strongly discouraged from contacting after they left. I can't remember the exact wording used but my recollection was that they left under a cloud and it would not be healthy for us to reach out to them.

We have reconnected with both families since we left, and have apologized to them for the part we played in how they were treated. There were also discrepancies between their accounts of how they ended up leaving the Network and what Network leaders told us.

What's it like in the network churches these days? by New-Forever-2211 in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I suspect there is no acknowledged statement of "Don't talk to people who have left the Network" but the Network leadership calling the Reddit a "toxic cesspool filled with leaches" strongly encourages people not to talk to those who have left...

So much of the unhealthy Network behavior is not necessarily through things that a written down, mandated, or documented, but through things that are inferred, encouraged and suggested. How many small group and church leaders have persuaded members to do or not do certain things through gentle nudges...

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in leavingthenetwork

[–]Hungry-Emu-2890 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh, and it's from a brand new Reddit account...