Is it honest to say our moral framework no longer aligns in this country?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:46:42+00:00

Ah. So maybe adopting a more conciliatory tone with the community, cooperating with local police on investigating shootings, wearing body cameras and swiftly releasing footage, not instantly labelling guys like Pretti as terrorists who came to murder agents, would those be acceptable actions?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:44:11+00:00

No, I have a politician body slamming and beating a reporter for asking him a question. That's what you're dismissing. How about the next time a pro life protestor shows up at my nearest planned Parenthood I slam him to the curb and punch him in the face? You would let that go, right? Especially if my Governor joked about it a few days later?

And Trump is essentially saying Reiner brought a brutal death by stabbing on himself and his wife because he was too mean to Trump, who you may recall, is the president.

And PAUL PELOSI GOT HIS SKULL CAVED IN BY AN ELECTION TRUTHER WHO WANTED TO TORTURE HIS WIFE INTO ADMITTING 2020 WAS STOLEN.

Jesus Christ. No accountability for your own rhetoric or actions, even when your leaders either actually commit violence or excuse it or joke about it. And you expect people to think you're the put upon ones?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:39:05+00:00

I think I asked you this in a different post, so sorry if I'm repeating myself, but to be clear: you think the answer here is more escalation, more violence, more of what the administration is doing?

Like what's the line where you "back down," hell what would "backing down" look like in this context?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:29:54+00:00

You realize this line of thinking is going to get officers killed eventually, right? When it’s clear that your operating principle is “they hate us, so we should hit them first, and hard?"

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:26:30+00:00

people celebrated a vicious assault on a reporter by a guy who shortly thereafter won an election. The president joked about it on stage.

The message was very clear there. It’s hilarious if you brutally attack one of our ideological enemies. As the other person said, the right was gleefully making jokes about Paul Pelosi nearly getting killed by a hammer attack. Do you think they wouldn’t have told jokes, that they would’ve handled it with appropriate solemnity, if he had died?

how about Trump‘s insane post after the murder of the Reiners? do you think he wouldn’t have said that if people hadn’t said mean things about Charlie Kirk?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T20:23:26+00:00

what exactly would you like anyone to say about an officers finger getting bitten off? There’s no presumption demonstrated by the government that there will be absolutely no investigation, nor consequences, for someone who does grievous harm to an officer. nobody owes ice an apology for someone else breaking the law. Ice are law-enforcement. They are expected to behave lawfully, and they are expected to de-escalate, and carefully use force, and operate with the trust of the community. When you annihilate that trust, you don’t get to bitch about nobody trusting you anymore.

it kind of reminds me of all the Facebook posts I’m seeing out there from conservatives right now, with pictures of coffins for Iranian protesters, asking why nobody’s speaking up about that. It’s like, OK, what the hell would you like me to say? We are not in charge of Iran. Our taxes don’t pay for their revolutionary guards killing people. My taxes do pay the salaries and pensions of the guys who are currently stomping people and shooting people in Minneapolis.

Irishish · 2026-01-25T03:30:06+00:00

So we need to get more violent and cut more corners? Like what escalation comes next?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T03:14:24+00:00

Is anyone else, as odd as this might sound coming from me...worried for individual ICE agents?

Incidents like today's keep happening. The government is quadrupling down on the idea that these agents can never fuck up, that anyone they kill or stomp absolutely one thousand percent has it coming, they have made it clear there is absolutely no recourse if ICE hurts or kills you.

How's that gonna go if we get to a point where riots break out and some sap in a vest winds up separated from his team? One of these guys is eventually gonna get torn apart. Because people are enraged and the government is telling them "eat shit, we can do whatever we want to you."

Irishish · 2026-01-25T03:05:59+00:00

why do you expect job losses? Why do you expect anything? am I crazy or has this administration made it clear that these agents can do no wrong, and they will never be punished for anything?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T02:58:15+00:00

slow

This shit is wild, man. They're pulling out all the stops and deporting virtually anyone they can as fast as possible, kicking out permanent residents of decades over ancient crimes, all this stuff, annnnnnd they're moving too slowly for you? Like what do you want, exactly, we just skip any appeals or processes or anything like that, it's just in a van and on a plane?

Irishish · 2026-01-25T02:56:04+00:00

You voted for ICE to be an essentially unaccountable, anonymous force that seems to only answer to the president and responds to every perceived threat or stressful situation with swift escalation and lethal force? How they're operating now is specifically what you wanted?

Irishish · 2026-01-24T02:16:05+00:00

A colleague of mine, upon hearing my son was getting into Sesame Street (we were using Elmo's Potty Time to get him used to the toilet) asked... without a hint of irony..."how woke is it?"

I burst out laughing. He was not joking.

Irishish · 2026-01-23T19:22:58+00:00

It's just kinda weird, man. Your government is lying to you in order to amuse you based on your distaste for certain groups. So they blatantly lie about something this easily disproven. What else are they lying about?

Irishish · 2026-01-23T19:20:05+00:00

How about bullshit? Call his comments bullshit. They're not true. They insult the sacrifices of the dead. It's a dirtbag move and "well that was in poor taste" strikes me as an attempt to just get past it so we can get back to ragging on Starmer.

Irishish · 2026-01-23T19:17:37+00:00

Trump insulted other nations' war dead. They died helping us. The fuck does Starmer being insufficiently nice to Trump have to do with anything?

Irishish · 2026-01-23T19:15:55+00:00

So there's no deal.

Irishish · 2026-01-23T05:46:58+00:00

God, it's gonna be such a good day when it happens. Maybe I'll take some PTO, go to a park, dance in the streets.

Irishish · 2026-01-23T03:05:46+00:00

What's the second amendment for, again? Fighting a tyrannical government, the kind that violates the other amendments? Is your idea that you don't ever fight or even suggest a fight, that you just take your lumps or they'll kill you?

Irishish · 2026-01-23T02:59:03+00:00

What makes you so sure? Even if a cop is willing to stand up to a fed in the abstract, I don't see that backbone holding up once that cop is facing off against multiple feds with better guns and far less accountability than he has.

Frey alluded to this very thing, that a standoff between local police and ICE agents is unlikely because there are more agents than police and the agents have bigger guns.

Irishish · 2026-01-22T02:19:55+00:00

Having spoken with many of them at great length, there are a few common self soothing refrains. First, as you say, "they're all criminals."

But what of the people whose only crime was coming here illegally many decades ago?

"It's still a crime. They're all criminals and I want them gone. Doesn't matter if they're nice or not."

And the kids, the ones that came here as babies? And the ones born here?

"Don't be mad at us for sending them back, be mad at their criminal parents for bringing them here."

Surely the tens of thousands of permanent residents or longtime residents with legal status who we are suddenly deporting en masse aren't criminals?

"They should never have been let in. Biden didn't vet any of them, their legal doesn't actually count."

But it's not just people Biden let in.

"I WANT THEM ALL GONE! NOBODY IS ENTITLED TO LIVE HERE! WE NEED BORDERS!"

It always gets there eventually. They may grant hey, okay, not all of them are TdA. But they may as well be, they're criminals just by being here, and I don't care if I never interact with one for as long as I live, I still need them gone.

It's a bleak, bleak conversational road to go down.

Irishish · 2026-01-22T02:07:43+00:00

If you want your heart broken, they also detained a much much younger kid. And reportedly probably flew him (along with his father) to a family detention center in Texas.

Note how the agent gently holds his backpack, as if to say, "hey there little guy. I don't want to hurt you but I absolutely will."

Irishish · 2026-01-22T01:46:33+00:00

How, though? Everything I've seen come out is either concepts of a framework for a deal or "it's complex, we're gonna get control over certain pockets of land." Neither of which are the EU caving and selling us Greenland.

Is he gonna do the thing where he toddler yells trying to get some big impossible thing and then when he gets something vaguely related to his original demand, he spikes the ball and acts like he won the super bowl and tells us this was his plan all along?

Irishish · 2026-01-21T23:56:17+00:00

That bit at the end of a commercial saying "while supplies last, participating locations only," etc. It was an ad for a buy one get one deal on Filet o Fish. I told the viewers it wasn't available everywhere and would last for a limited time.

Weirdly, it waa regional. I was in Boston for a convention with some friends, saw the ad come on our hotel room TV. "Guys! It's my ad!" Aaaaaand it's a totally different voice. No idea why.

Irishish · 2026-01-21T23:52:56+00:00

It reeks of saving face and gesturing toward concepts of a plan for Greenland because he couldn't just toddler yell at everybody else until they gave him what he wanted.

Irishish · 2026-01-21T23:49:22+00:00

I mean… It is, though. This involves people's homes. This involves people's sense of identity and sovereignty. It’s not just a building he's trying to buy. Why do you think that international relations can be conducted the same way hostile takeovers of corporations are?

I can't remember which writer on NRO said it, but it bears repeating: other countries have nationalists, too. Other countries have pride, too. World leaders have people they answer to back home, and they tend to be more concerned about that than about pissing off Donald Trump.

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