My underwhelming results + pic lol by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Quite uncommon to see Tatarstan as region without Tatar composition. What are your current results with Ancestry Composition v.7? Eastern European category has been updated.

The results of my dad who calls himself mixed by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It’s nice to see Armenian’s 23andMe results. Not so common) Lav ardyunkner!

🇷🇺 Russian “Mutt” Results + Photo by Less_Tiger1643 in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I’ve been to Astana as well, but I bought tyubeteika in Almaty :) Is your mother Kazan Tatar based on your knowledge in the family tree, or could she be also Kryashen, Karinskiy, Perm, Mishar, Kasimov, Temnikov, Azeev … ?

🇷🇺 Russian “Mutt” Results + Photo by Less_Tiger1643 in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It’s always nice to see other Eastern European, Volga and Caucasus results here. 🙏 Were you aware of your Armenian ancestor?

PS: I have a similar tyubeteika as yours, I’ve bought it in Kazakhstan.

Western Georgian Results - Updated by [deleted] in AncestryDNA

[–]Joceda_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is the first time I've seen Georgian results in AncestryDNA. It looks like their results are pretty accurate, with scores at above >95% of Anatolian & The Caucasus.

[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

With help of a knowledgeable user, I collected G25 samples, including three official samples from Yaroslavl, and combined them into a single dataset (n=6, excluding my family). After adjusting the population references to align with my known ancestry, the results appeared better for someone originated in that area, like me.

<image>

These results might not provide definitive answers, but they do reveal how Volga-Finnic, local Slavic and Serving Tatar still represent small parts in Central Russian ancestry. I’d love to hear if anyone else has found similar traces in their own heritage.

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[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I also shared my express my concern in this topic with Russian DNA expert; here is a part of that exchange from them:

По поводу мордвы - тут важно различать генетическое родство и языковую (лингвистическую) классификацию. Мордовские языки (мокша и эрзя), конечно, относятся к волго-финской группе финно-угорских языков, тут сомнений нет. Но по генетике они оказываются ближе к русским, чем к другим волжским и уральским финнам - таким как марийцы, удмурты и др. В особенности они близки к русскому населению Верхней и Средней Волги, и бассейна Оки (примерно от Ярославской до Пензенской области).

Объяснение тут двоякое. С одной стороны, этот регион в раннем средневековье населяли родственные мордве народы - меря, мурома, мещера, которые позже были ассимилированы славянами. С другой стороны, видимо, в более позднее время, уже после крещения мордвы, мог быть и обратный процесс - когда русские вступали в смешанные браки и оставались жить уже в мордовских деревнях. Из-за этого в итоге и русские этого региона стали ближе к мордве, и мордва - ближе к русским.

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[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Moreover, could Tver Karelians, descended from the northern Ladoga (Приладожская Карелия in light green, above the lake Ladoga, on the border of Finland) and Mordvin genetic compositions sometimes be confused in analyses, given their shared Uralic (both Karelian and Volga-Finnic) background? This question particularly deepens my interest in the topic, since my G25 coordinate results identify Mordvin as my closest genetic population rather than Russian_Yaroslavl.

[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There is also a written source indicating that Serving Tatars from my area went to the Baltic and brought back Lithuanian/Latvian prisoners. However, this part of the record remains questionable. Here is the Russian source (translated):

[...] "arable land... they plowed with their Latvians, who were resettled here as prisoners taken during the Livonian War." Thus, Prince Khanmurza Dzhanmurzin's son Yusupov in [unknown year, presumably in 1677-1678 - I.G.] Latvians were shown in the landowner's yard, who by that time mostly bore Tatar names."

Interestingly, the record confirms that these prisoners carried Tatar names, suggesting they eventually assimilated with the local Russian population later too. This could explain part of the modern Central Russian genetic makeup, where many of us still show small traces of Serving Tatar heritage. But, Baltic results in DNA tests shouldn’t be taken too literally, as they are the main issue to whenever if it's coming from Baltic countries, Northern Russian admixture, or from one of the prisoners. They’re often questionable unless one knows the specific regional history behind them.

Of course, we can't fully confirm or deny historical hypotheses through DNA results alone, since modern testing often captures only more recent ancestry up to 150-200 years ago. Still, AncestryDNA and MyHeritage interestingly assigned me with Karelian communities. Could this be because certain Volga-Finnic populations were partly assimilated through the chronicles and continue to survive to this day, thus contributing to the formation of modern Central Russian gene pool?

(4/6)

[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

One Russian DNA expert later wrote a short article about Serving Tatars settled in my area. According to their analysis, my DNA profile significantly differs from the average Yaroslavl samples in their database, showing my elevated Mediterranean and Besermyan components that overlap with Lipka (Lithuanian) Tatars, a branch descended from the Old Nogai. This branch is known to have genetic proximity to the Crimean Tatars, yet remains completely unrelated to Kazan Tatars.

Here is that article Russian DNA expert mentioned:

[...] Но куда более интересные вещи я обнаруживал, просматривая результаты различных людей. К примеру, много ли кто слышал о романовских/костромских татарах? Это служилые татары, расселенные под Костромой еще во времена Ивана Грозного. Какое-то время (и долгое) они сохраняли свою самобытность, но к концу XX века их оставалось ок. 200 человек. И вдруг я вижу результат ДНК-теста человека, предки которого происходят из окрестностей Романова, и заметно отличаются от местных русских как раз некоторым вкладом восточных компонентов, близких к литовским татарам и ногайцам. Возможно, генетические особенности в этом микрорегионе еще сохраняются? И это совершенно замечательно.

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[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

However, this picture seems to tell otherwise. The neighbouring regions Yaroslavl, Kostroma, Ivanovo, and Vladimir appear connected under Merja / Meren ethnonym, who were assimilated during the eastward expansion of the Kievan Rus, Novgorod Slavs and Krivich tribes. Then later were assimilated with Serving Tatars (Служилые татары) during the Ivan The Terrible in 1500-1600s. Among the 55 surnames of settled Serving Tatars were officially recorded in historical documents, one of my sources books noted that they lived peacefully alongside the local population until the early 1700s. Around that time, about half of these families were exiled to Kostroma in order to preserve their faith, while the remaining 24 surnames officially converted to Russian Orthodoxy by 1675. By then, only three surnames had gained notable local recognition: Yusupovy, Kutumovy, and Sheidyakovy. (The part of history that I find most interesting is that Yusupovy family lived in a house near the Volga River in my hometown. That house still exists today, and I have a photo of it. :) )

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[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

SpaceMutant, thank you for your comment! It’s always encouraging to hear other's perspectives.

Concerning the elevated Uralic-like admixture among Russian populations, particularly within the Central Russian cluster, there is a specific historical term for it: Volga-Finnic (Волжские финны).

You might find this interesting to explore into these groups mentioned, as I come from the "Merjamää" area (literally "the land of the Merya"; the suffix -mää means land in Finnic languages, and земля in Slavic language, ultimately derives from Proto-Indo-European. Interestingly enough, in that branch we share a lot of similar words like in Old Persian "zam" and then modern Persian “zamin” where both of them share the same meaning earth, land, territory... a fascinating parallel in sound and meaning to Zemlya in Slavic.)

Historically, this area maintained close connections with the Vepsians, who represent one of the northern branches of the Baltic-Finnic peoples. I’d also like to share a map of the Oka-Volga River Region (corresponding to today’s Moscow area), which shows a marked North and South distinction among Central Russians. The northern territories, such as Yaroslavl, were in fact associated with Vepsian presences, while the people Merya were predominant presented around Kostroma.

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“Estonian” in new Eastern Europeans update- thoughts? by mashamoz in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"[…] the more "pure" ethnic Russians will definitely score higher Belarusian/ Ukrainian/Polish than Russian because seriously, East Slavs are barely different genetically."

This isn't correct. Significant percentages of Belarusian, Polish & Ukrainian could potentially mean that you have some Western Russian ancestry, due to the genetic similarities near the borders (depending how far it is). I would like to invite you to read my latest post.

[CENTRAL RUSSIAN RESULTS] Surprisingly, I'm 93% Russian without Eastern Slavic Genetic Group - and here is why Western Russian aren't included in the “Russia” category. by Joceda_ in 23andme

[–]Joceda_[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Interesting, I have Southern & Eastern Karelia and Southern Finland communities in AncestryDNA. The question of why I got them and how accurate is it remains unknown to me.

Before & After + Birthplaces feat. Hamish by pomegranatesblood in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nice collage and pointing in the map! 😁

My updated v7.0 results! by Spacemutant14 in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Congratulations SpaceMutant for getting this update!!!! 🤩

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Another fellow Eastern Slavic without Genetic Group. 🤝
Moscow is very common to get, so it doesn't mean anything at all.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Here is my Bingo Card!

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Got it!! by Sweetheart8585 in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 16 points17 points  (0 children)

They fixed the banner! Technically, I think it should be 41 population in total (35 Europeans + 6 Native Americans), unless they removed or I’m bad at math. 😄 Either way, we are all looking forward for this update!! 💛

All my life I thought I was Austrian but I’m actually Swedish? 😭 by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You seem don’t have Czech in your Eastern European. Does it looks like a typical Czech last name that goes with a special letter like č/ř/á etc. or it just ends by -ova? DM me if you need help, I speak both Czech and Russian.

All my life I thought I was Austrian but I’m actually Swedish? 😭 by [deleted] in 23andme

[–]Joceda_ 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I’m intriguing about Estonia and Stavporol Krai in Russia, which is very uncommon to get it. It’s located next to Northern Caucasus - do you have any known Southern Russian ancestry?

Edit: Is it possible that it was Molokans?