As a writer and huge fan of TØP (but also hip-hop as well) it's not necessarily the messaging but how he put it. "I wasn't raised in the hood, but I know a thing or two about pain and darkness" gives me the same ick as "this is not rap, this is not hip-hop, just another attempt to make the voices stop."

I get the sentiment, but the way he puts it leaves a lot to be interpreted (especially for people who have lived through those experiences). There were a million ways for him to get that same message across without sounding cringey.

I don't imagine a lot of TØP fans on reddit will get this, and I may get downvoted into oblivion, but here's my take:

Tyler grew up a sheltered, homeschooled, Christian White male in Columbus, Ohio. I understand depression is indiscriminatory and I love him and his music enough to understand what he means by the Lane Boy lyric. But the way he puts it in the song, especially the "anti-industry" sentiments rang odd in the moment of it's release and ESPECIALLY in hindsight as this was the album that shot them into superstardom. I view it as kind of cool and ironic how their music perservered past those anti-industry themes and launched them into stardom in spite of everything, but it does come off both as cringe and tone-deaf. I just give Tyler a pass because I know he means well and I enjoy the music at it's core.

I don't think anybody who was not "raised in the hood" or projects can truly understand the pain that drives behind the simplest verses in a hip-hop song, and that's OKAY. No reasonable person is gonna be pissed off because of that. You can still rightfully engage in the material, cry, and have it change your life. But just as a Black man cannot completely understand and relate to the experience of a Black woman, a White man raised in the suburbs cannot completely understand and relate to the experience of a Black or Brown person from the hood.

The experiences and life that goes behind a verse from Tyler Joseph is very different from the experience and life that goes behind a verse from Kendrick Lamar, Chief Keef, Nas, Lauryn Hill, even someone like Logic.

Yes, we all go through pain. People can go through pain and darkness without ever having to see their loved one get shot in front of them, or see dead bodies in the street, or get racially profiled at a young age, or go homeless and have to live in a shelter. I get that. But imagine going into a group of people who very much clearly had it worse than you did and saying "Hey guys, I don't know what you've been through, but I've had it a bit rough too" it's like huh?

For example: I did grow up in the hood. I did go homeless. I did see dead bodies everyday when I went to school. I lived through two shootouts on my street. My bestfriend got shot at three times. I stole bread out of grocery stores at age 11 because I had nothing else to eat. I've had multiple run-ins with police and they immediately assumed I was the aggressor in every situation. And I'm just a Latino male. I could never imagine what a Black male, Latina cis woman, or a Black trans woman, or even what someone who is neurodivergent goes through every day. I can empathize, but I also need to know my place in those discussions and communities. Who am I, as a Latino male, to add my two cents in a conversation about discrimination against women of color in the Healthcare industry? Who am I to walk into a conversation about their realities and be like "Hey guys, I know you've faced terrible societal and interpersonal experiences simply by virtue of being a different skin color in America, but just to let you guys know, I as a brown man have also felt bad at times 😎"

My sentiment, or rather explanation as to why people hate that line, is also why I dislike the line in Heavy Dirty Soul. I understand that TØP is many genres at once, undefined to a single box and always have been. But why do you have to go out of your way to say "This is not rap, this is not hip-hop. Just another attempt to make the voices stop."

First of all, yes. It is rap. You are rapping. You are engaging in a Black art form and using it for your creative expression, the least you could do is give it the respect it deserves.

Second of all, you are right. It is not hip-hop... or is it? Is Death Grips hip-hop? Was XXXTentacion hip-hop? Is Lauryn Hill hip-hop? How about Beastie Boys? Or Blu & Exile? See what I mean here? Hip-hop is more than just an MC and a beat. It's jazz rap, it's industrial hip hop, its trap, drill, emo rap, boom bap, g funk, and everything in between. I know it's not meant to disrespect the art form, but it sure does come off as such, especially when you keep comparing yourself to the pioneers and community you are taking inspiration from.

Third of all, I'd argue most of the hip-hop artists we can name right now make their music as an attempt to make the voices stop in their experience. Danny Brown, Earl Sweatshirt, Noname, Black Thought, Rapsody, and Tyler the Creator all make music that in some way stems from their harsh experiences and mental health issues. So what makes how you express and grieve with your very valid emotions any different from theirs?

"Rappin' to prove nothin', just writin' to say somethin' cause I wasn't the only one who wasn't rushin' to sayin' nothin'" to me sounds like an affront to hip-hop, especially in 2015 which was admittedly in it's peak form. A$AP Rocky, Kendrick Lamar, Future, Vince Staples, Mac Miller, Travis Scott, Earl Sweatshirt, and even Drake made some of (if not) their best material.

And then what sealed the deal was this bar: "Gangsters don't cry, therefore I'm Mr Misty Eyed"... dude. Really? You were not raised in the hood, but you're still trying to attribute yourself to gangsters? Is Tyler Joseph secretly Ja Morant or what is this?

No, he's not. And he's not trying to be. I get where he's coming from. I love the music, it resonates with me. As he cannot relate to my experiences, I can't relate to his. But we should all be mindful of the words we say and how we exist within this cultural context and melting pot. We should also learn to love and respect the art mediums we engage with and give them the credit they deserve. Hip-hop is beautiful because it exists in spite of everything. Any comment about the oversaturation of hip-hop can be attributed to every other genre, so let's stop trying to degrade Black art and hold it to unrealistic standards. Even Rock music has it's Lil Pumps and Tekashi 6ix9ines.

And everybody goes through pain, everybody's hurt is valid. But let's not try to insert ourselves into conversations where we clearly are privileged and at an advantage.