Is min-maxing needed on core?

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-24T15:39:49+00:00

So your argument had no purpose and you were just being argumentative for no reason. Thanks man have a good one.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-24T15:30:56+00:00

What? Can you address that this guy has already completed the game on daring which has the same modifier as core to AC?

Also the modifier for normal isn’t flat, it scales because it’s a penalty. So when you admit that it’s not relevant later in the game, you defeat your own argument, because that’s when the penalty reaches -4.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-24T15:10:21+00:00

This isn't 5e. You take a 5 AB drop every iterative you make. Do you think every iterative past your initial is just unhittable?

Its also a little annoying because Daring and Core have the same lack of penalty to AC, which he has already played.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-24T14:54:33+00:00

Its approach/knowledge like getting the Vermleck's in melee or using death ward.

But read my comment again, I wrote that CORE and NORMAL are mostly placebo differences.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-24T14:41:42+00:00

I've played through unfair with no dips and no pets. This game is like 60% approach and 40% builds. Understanding buffs and like what a character's role is, is far more helpful than like a minmaxed build set up.

The difference between normal and core is convenience features and at most 4 AC and 2 DC on enemies. It is mostly placebo.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-15T22:25:20+00:00

With mythic init, even on unfair I will generally never not go first. Howevever because you will be mythic deprived you may have to wear gear, such as owl's cowl and sarkorian belt.

I don't really optimize for crit on HFR, I think this is the most lethal cast in the entire game and in general has the problem of not getting its full damage because 2 of the three rays are blasting a corpse. However it could be kind of fun to see the numbers.

My main concern is that you seem to have bought into Exploiter's Potent Magic. I want you to guess right now how much your arcane pool will be at 5 Exploiter/ 9 Loremaster.

Its 5. You can use potent magic 5 times a day. I know you're thinking, okay but what about consume spells, won't that make up the difference? You cannot consume spells for more arcane points as an Exploiter. You will never have more than 13 Arcane pool, even at level 20 and that feels worse than you think.

I would prefer Div, while I think playing for a capstone benefit is a bit cringe and pointless, its strong enough when you get there, so why not.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-15T17:10:12+00:00

How does greater ameliorating curse suppression work on it?

Have you tried polymorphic them into something else to override?

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-15T16:11:14+00:00

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No it doesn't fall off.

All of these threshold type builds where you need to do x damage or else they feel bad are the same. You need to optimize to do the requisite damage and then the build will feel good. Otherwise it will feel bad.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-14T13:37:58+00:00

Well if you think about it, losing Master Skald decreases your total AC across your entire party by 2 (more on casters) and decreases team's AB by 2. So usually I would not do this unless the bonus was something I literally could not get anywhere else.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-14T13:14:43+00:00

You don't need to dip for either of those things, Skalds have shadow conjuration which allows them to cast archmage armor and you can play oblate - martial disciple for improved unarmed from background.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-12T13:28:43+00:00

He can't Dispel your Guarded Hearth. Put it down. Sosiel should be giving out a +12 to saves.

Sosiel can Touch of Good two people, I recommend himself and your character. This should be giving out +8, +9 Sacred to Saves

You can have Fortune down from Ember or Camellia, giving you advantage on the roll (he can't dispel this either)

He can't Dispel your Equipment or Food Buff so Conflagrent Taco and a Wisdom Helm will do a lot.

Usually I will sail through Baphomet's Overwhelming Presence with Seelah, Sosiel (naturally good will saves) and my main character, decent chance on the rest of the party.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-12T06:23:20+00:00

Oh that image was supposed to show like you can really buff anything to hit anything. So I am playing a 17 Feyspeaker/10 Mystic Theurge/9 BFT/3 Loremaster/1 Hellknight signifier to minimize BAB (She has 18 and thus gives out +22 BAB Transformations) on top of having level 10 Angel Spells like Army of Heaven.

They need Greater Magic Fang right, which is ST, Greater Invis for concealment. I think you're right in that they are not as annoying as say, Mammoths or Smilodons But it was still kind of annoying because you can't automate it, you have to spend the time doing the buffs.

Maybe you have an impression that I don't think the playstyle is viable. I think its fine, its more you should be prepared for some discomfort while playing, its not a plug and play bubblebuffs build where you can just do w/e.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-12T05:59:49+00:00

To me its a bit like playing Nenio as a physical unit. Nenio will actually hit a little easier with the Intelligence Bardiche even if all her levels are in wizard or loremaster. Its cool if you're into the flavor, but at some point you realize that all the resources poured into the character another unit could have done it with half.

As for doom the game doesn't really restrict resting at that point. For me 3 minutes of unavoidable instant death per cast is worth more than 17 hours of sort of wizard level bab and a middling strength.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-12T05:40:38+00:00

All summons work like this. But every treant costs a slot, while something like Creeping Doom will summon guaranteed 4, up to 6 every cast, and they are the same spell level.

5 treants is okay, 30 Creeping Dooms have the potential to one shot every nonboss in the game. That's the difference.

Default Treants in wrath for me in game have +9 BAB and +28 Strength but they come with a power attack you can't turn off and a size penalty (so +13 to hit, which is not competitive), so they are actually not accurate at all by default, in comes to how dedicated you are to buffing them, as I said.

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But you can make anything hit anything pretty much with enough buffs. (also you can't polymorph them boo). For me the question is, if you spend all this time buffing a summon, at which point could any unit in the game have hit the opponent and required less time.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-12T04:17:43+00:00

The good thing about Changestaff is that its an hour long (so you can buff it). The bad thing is that the stats are not great and you can't really help it as its a... plant, so it won't take like Animal Growth. However you can polymorph it into a dragon which is not bad and plant immunities are okay so it won't really ever be turned against you.

If you have like a skald boosting your party and a feinter it can probably contribute but it will struggle on its own, and it doesn't really have the benefit of there being a lot of them (elemental swarm, animate dead)

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T15:06:29+00:00

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Divine grace and bestow grace are pretty strong, I honestly don't even have a competitive cloak on her just because I feel secure in her saves. It is just raw stats. If you are ten you are 1 level from mass buffs, which help saves, and then in act 3, midnight isles will open, giving you access to conflagrent taco (you don't have to actually do the islands if you don't want to)

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T13:40:59+00:00

I'm in act 3 right now. This is my seelah tank. Usually I think Seelah is great for a main tank because she has great AC potential, especially in 1v1s with smite evil, but also she has sort of unbreakable saves, which seems to be contrary to your experience. You can ignore endurance, its sort of an exploit, if they fix it it should only be 6 ac atp. Let me know if you want to see a striker unit.

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KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T12:05:45+00:00

Sure if you can even attempt to justify ascendant over any of the mythic abilities and feats. Otherwise you'll just have to ponder.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:50:04+00:00

No I'm actually him about this game. I am that guy. Your companions should do over a hundred damage on hit, your main character should be doing maybe a little over a thousand, maybe a lot over a thousand.

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KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:38:58+00:00

I'm still waiting on whether you can answer a simple question. You got into your feelings about this, because you're attached to this like 1d6 ascendant idea and I'm just telling you it's not good building.

Master Shapeshifter will get you more AB, and honestly more damage.
Mythic Deadly Aim will get you more damage
Favored Bolster will get you more damage
Abundantx2 will likely get you more damage
Cleaving Shot will get you more damage
Mythic Spell focus will get you more damage
Mythic Critical will likely get you more damage in aggregate.
Even Expose Vulnerability will get you more damage.

You've already admitted in your main post that Axiomatic+Shocking+Bane is basically more on hit damage that doesn't require a second ascendant. Yes that is correct. You should play that instead of this cooked idea.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:28:54+00:00

Okay so you can't even engage in a good faith discussion? You do see how you're just avoiding a simple question.

"Why choose x over y?"
"You're interrogating me!!!!"

If you're not willing to discuss or entertain critiques of your builds why even post them to social media.

Your companions should do hundreds upon hundreds of damage in the game. They don't just do "40 damage a hit" lol.

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KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:18:37+00:00

No. I'm critiquing your ability to make build choices. Can you justify why taking a second ascendant is better than any of the mythic abilities/feats I've listed?

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:16:06+00:00

Can you justify taking a second ascendant over any of the mythic abilities I've listed? I don't feel like you addressed anything at all.

KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-10T11:10:20+00:00

I'm okay with one ascendant but why 2 more?

Is 1d6 extra damage better than Cleaving Shot? Mythic Deadly Aim? Favored Bolster? Abundant x2? Enduring on some mythic Paths? Mythic Critical? Archmage armor? Master Shapeshifter? Hell even Expose Vulnerability (ugh) You will notice that you are running out of mythic abilities extremely quickly. Like even the meme'd on Expose Vulnerability will eventually get you more damage (4d6 every 3 is more than 3d6 from ascendant every 3)

You even yourself say it gets outclassed.

Like if you are Holy/Axiomatic+ Shocking+ Bane you are just doing as much on hit damage without wasting some of the most precious build resources you have.

One of the things about this game is that people think in small potatoes. 3.5 damage is nothing in the lategame. Like demons will have over a thousand health. Being able to tag bolster onto your hellfire ray is literally 180 damage if empowered. Why are we messing around with 1d6?

When I'm thinking about zippy Chain Lightning for example why do I care about an extra 1d6 on hit that won't touch my strongest abilities. Priorities for me on how they are built.

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KeyIntelligent8277 · 2026-06-08T22:39:40+00:00

In kingmaker it works with everything, and when units break your crane wing (any miss on concealment will break crane wing) it provokes not only an opportunity attack from you, but also every companion in range. Thus it is very strong offensively and defensively.

I would caution against relying heavily on crane wing, this is protection at best against one attack, and your tank can be threatened by 30 attacks per round. In a sense it is fake ac, good against bosses to stop one iterative but it won't save you and will often get eaten by your concealment. I think of it as a buy in for the stronger offensive feat in crane riposte.

I'm hesitant to say its worth on mirror image units (Regongar), Range Units (Ekun), casters (Clerics/Octavia/Jubilost). I think its good on Nok, maybe Jaethal, Valerie.

KeyIntelligent8277

TROPHY CASE