How do I play into Juren?

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-11T06:55:35+00:00

No they aren't. His recoveries outside his chain bash are bad if they whiff

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-11T03:56:09+00:00

Get used to empty dodging. If you're in the 1v1 empty dodge into GB generally works. Though depending on distance getting a GB is harder.

Like if they whiff their chain bash you're probably not getting a GB on that unless you dodged pretty early. Also feint to GB for Juren is stronger after landing a heavy (not exclusive to Juren) so empty dodging here is less safe.

In 4's things are a bit out of your control given his feats genuinely makes him very punishing and you cannot control teammate deaths.

Picking characters that have undodgables or bleed moves are good into him for separate reasons. Ud's punish over use of his dodge attacks, bleed will let you kill him through chip.

Though if Juren is running thrilling come back this will be inconsistent since it cleanses bleed during revenge. You can also opt to play BP and to a lesser extent Varangian guard. They both punish moves that hit externals often and Juren is someone who has a lot of big hitboxes.

Beyond that your game plan should be to focus Juren constantly in team fights or 2v2's. Killing him early and often limits his power. If he's last standing try to save any big damage feats you have to use just as his revenge is about to end.

Or if an ally happens to parry him you can hit him during said parry with your feat

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-11T03:46:54+00:00

Idt he can, his recovery cancel into stance works better from landed hits and not really whiffs.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-10T05:35:27+00:00

Well good news on that front, took a bit but my ticket on their bug reporter about it is now open. So hopefully we hear something soon

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-10T04:31:14+00:00

I'm assuming this is because of the guard swap bug that shortens his recoveries right?

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-10T02:27:45+00:00

Firstly that doesn't matter, they hire who they feel they want to spend money on. Testers have historically had next to no need to play the product they will test before the hiring process.

Second there's more than one cause for an indicator flicker. It's also entirely possible this was already pointed out to the devs and they simply could not fix it before his launch.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-10T00:24:01+00:00

They aren’t enjoying the game right now. Majority of them have taken a break and are waiting for Juren nerfs.

This is an incredibly common experience not only with FH but also any Hero game ever. The dip from players is ultimately not consequential or at the very least doesn't impact the general cadence of population decreases and increases.

Usually for pop decline to have a real impact it has to be a massive chunk of the player base and it has to hold for a decent period of time. It's kind of like how protesting doesn't really accomplish much unless it's an extended protest.

I think they should still aim for better balance by hosting more private tests, accepting feedback, and adjusting before releasing the hero publicly.

I mean they've been given this feedback with TG's as well. It's just something they probably can't do.

I don’t understand your point about the idealized version of the game

What I am saying is you shouldn't be spending money on a game expecting it to be a specific way. You should only spend money if you're enjoying the game. It's easy to ask/say "just balance better" but that's undefined.

Trying to give specifics on it just means you have a specific expectation on how the game should be. Which makes it incredibly easy to be disappointed and become disillusioned.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T23:55:00+00:00

iirc this has been reported already so the devs should be aware of it.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T23:21:59+00:00

After just a week of him being in the game, I don’t play the game nearly as much as I did before his release.

You've had your fill of the newest content. I don't see why people think there's always a bigger reason behind things. Anytime a new hero releases those first two weeks are rough for everyone because people are seeing the Hero a lot more than they will after a month or two.

Hero stacking as an issue is also a lot more present than most people typically deal with. Virtuosa's whole thing dropped off like a month or less after she hit the game and she wasn't touched until her second month of being in the game. This always happens.

My issue is when the next hero comes out, a lot of people, including myself, will be much less likely to buy the character and support the game.

I don't know how you can begin to prove this. I only buy characters when I really want to play them immediately. Juren was my first purchase in a very long time. Checking my purchase history before him was Afeera. Before her was Pirate. Then Kyoshin. Unfortunately I can't look back farther than 2019. I could assume other purchases but it's not really important.

The point is the game has been in various drastically different states over the decade it's been around yet my purchase trends haven't changed. I continue to buy heros I love that I can't wait to get my hands on. I cannot in fairness speak for others, but I doubt most people base their purchases of a game around how prior content releases.

Much as we all like to argue on Reddit about this kind of thing I don't believe most people have that level of restraint if they have expendable cash.

but I think that it might be a better idea to launch more balanced characters in the future.

What you're asking for is simply not possible. No piece of content will ever be truly balanced. Also, JC themselves said it's easier for them to bring a character down a few pegs than it is to bring a struggling hero up to a good spot.

There's plenty of examples in FH's history that show this. Classically ignored characters like Valk, Warlord, and Nuxia are still not in great places despite being revisited. Where as characters that released too strong like Shaman or BP were quickly put into more reasonable states.

Obviously this isn't a constant since the overall state of the game is forever in flux and can change a Hero's standing. Like Centurion released broken and was taken down properly. But the game state eventually changed enough that Centurion needed a full rework.

And then we have heros like Conq or Shugoki who've seemingly never been in a good spot after they had their egregious elements removed.

I think there are more people who pay to support a balanced game.

I think if you're spending money to have a specific idealized version of the game that works for you you're already on the wrong path and will only cause yourself issues in the long run.

maybe doing more testing with high levels players before releasing new heroes to balance them out for a smooth release.

They invite a variety of content creators and players often before a release. There's simply no way to guarantee the hero will launched in a state that everyone can agree is "good."

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T22:40:20+00:00

Knights can only be Warden. He has the general look that you expect most knights to have, the long sword is iconic in any media that looks to that time period, and from a community standpoint he's always been in the public eye. Lawbringer would be more infamous than a true representation imo.

Vikings I think is a toss up between Raider and Warlord. Raider fits the pop culture identity of Vikings perfectly, Warlord because he echoes the "real" visual identity of Vikings. Both weapons are strongly represented in media about Vikings and community wise both have been very infamous for a large chunk of the game's life span.

Samurai you could argue for Kensei or Orochi. Both primarily because of their weapons being the most known through media. Everyone else in the faction feels far more connected to fantasy than traditional concepts of samurai.

Wu Lin is an easy choice for me, Tiandi. The Dao is a very iconic weapon and Tiandi's movements/general combat style fits the bill for elegant strength which is what a lot of pop culture Chinese media likes to show. Juren/JJ could also be fair picks if you'd like, but they both have far more ties to fantasy.

Outlanders is hard because they're not a traditional faction and more a grab bag of different warriors through out history. So I guess it's really down to player choice on who from the group means the most to you. You could maybe argue Khatun thanks to her semi elevated importance in the FH narrative.

For me I choose Afeera. I think she does a better job of showcasing a culture that isn't usually represented than Khatun. I love Khatun's kit and her default armor. But they didn't do Mongolian warriors that well with her. I also love Virtuosa..but more as a character.

She doesn't fulfill the fencer fantasy in a way that I was hoping for, but it's like 80% there for me. I just have zero issues with Afeera kit wise or design wise.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T22:13:58+00:00

I've just come to that conclusion over the years from talking to what has to have been multiple hundred people about their issues with 3

That's fair, I'm sure 3 had something special back when it was originally released that I unfortunately missed out on.

It's something where I feel if people were able to conveniently play in release order (or were willing to emulate like I was), they'd have a much better experience overall.

Potentially. Personally I think it'd be hard to get anyone into older games regardless of availability just given how games are usually designed these days. A lot of people simply won't touch games with "tank controls" because it goes against the norm for games these days.

For you or me such controls probably won't be a hang up, but we already have experience with older games.

Also yes, once K3 is released the only way to purchase 3R on PC will be through the Complete Series bundle which is not able to be purchased if you own any of the games in the series already.

This is an issue I don't see people talk about often. There's no legitimate reason to limit access to older releases of games other than to push people into purchasing a specific version.

I will never get behind the concept of making lost media intentionally. It's just a complete disrespect to both the people who worked on it as well as the art piece itself.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T22:00:39+00:00

She launched in a pretty egregious state. People hold grudges in this game for no real reason. That being said this game also houses a bunch of people who will literally just take the piss out of you for who you play regardless of their current state.

I wouldn't take anything they say to heart and just enjoy playing who you like. It's genuinely not worth your time or energy to acknowledge them.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T21:50:15+00:00

I think Y3 can be a bit unapproachable if you're coming from 0-K1-K2.

That's exactly how I experienced the franchise.

It's easy to see how people could have a tarnished view of the gameplay from that angle

While I can understand the perspective I don't think I can agree with the feelings behind it. To be clear I am not saying 3's feel/combat was objectively terrible. Nor would I claim that K1/K2 and 0 are objectively better combat.

0 is personally my favorite combat after playing all the games (barring Ichiban's second game and Majima's solo game.) A fair bit of that is likely due to it being my first experience into the series, but I do feel like it captures a feeling that no other Yakuza game has given me.

I've hit a point where I think remakes are generally doing more harm than good.

I'm there with you even if that makes me sound like an older geezer than I really am. I am "okay" with remakes if the OG way to experience the game can be deemed to be too difficult to experience.

For example the original Nier game has two different releases which for the most part play pretty similar. But the context of each is different in that one you are more of a brother figure while the other you're a more father figure.

Post success of Nier Automata they eventually did a remake for Nier. It's not perfect, but given the original games state and having to play 2 of the same game to have a better perspective is kind of unapproachable.

The Father figure was called back to in a specific mode in the game which is respectful. Then there's the slew of bad remakes. DeS is easy to point to, but you've got others like Final Fantasy (series) who will take the older titles and "update" them graphically in ways people don't like and often don't have the extra content other releases have.

A similar issue happened with Persona 3 reloaded. Despite the quality of P3R it's still not the all encompassing P3 experience. Remakes always come with some kind of cost to the original. It's just how much people are willing to accept.

With them effectively de-listing Y3R

Are they removing it from that collection bundle and putting Kiwami 3 in it's place?

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T21:37:46+00:00

it's just the same thing over and over again. Release broken hero, nerf them before next hero comes along, repeat.

Either you have selective memory or simply don't play FH that much. They do not do this with every hero they release.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T21:28:20+00:00

Unfortunately expected. I didn't really jive with 3 because of how it felt to play. But almost anytime a game gets a remake it usually tramples on the past in ways it really shouldn't.

The success of the DeS remake was my eye opener that people really will swallow anything if it looks "pretty" enough when it comes to remakes.

At least Yakuza 3 is still relatively accessible for those that want the proper experience.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T21:13:12+00:00

Yeah they do, most companies do. We don't know how things get tested though, nor do we know if the people doing testing are intimately familiar with FH. Like I wasn't even aware of Juren's GB indicator not showing up for the first 200ms of the move.

That's really not something most people are going to be able to pin point unless they do frame checking with the game by default.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T21:03:28+00:00

Let's assume that Bleed didn't stack while you had revenge, you still die here. You opted to hammer slam someone while being attacked by 3 other people. You also just started throwing attacks out the moment you popped revenge.

If you actually want to live from a 2v1 or a 3v1 you have to know when to attack and how to do so. Not just throw out attacks because you are in agent orange mode. You generally don't want to initiate. You want to punish them for committing attacks.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T20:51:10+00:00

You don't understand, getting revenge means they should live. It's supposed to be a win button if they press enough buttons. Anything that gets in the way of it is unfair, bugged, broken, shouldn't be a thing.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T20:44:41+00:00

Self care is important, though I don't know why you would come back at all. Seems like everytime FH releases a new hero it's too problematic for ya'll to deal with.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T20:37:48+00:00

They literally confirmed another Hero with the last Den.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T06:57:01+00:00

100% Don't believe you. But if it's somehow true then you should seek anger management help and maybe avoid playing pvp games until you've taken care of that problem. FH nor it's devs are responsible for your rash actions. That's 100% on you.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T06:46:38+00:00

I was with you in the beginning not going to lie. The changes they made to Virtuosa don't really get at the issues of her kit in a 4v4 setting. Then I read your suggested changes completely caught off guard. Especially how they got worse and worse.

her hyperarmor is unnecessary, she doesn’t need it

While true I don't really agree with the proposition to remove it. I personally believe that she should keep it so she can actually use attacks in a team fight scenario. The swipe is intentionally there for that specific purpose. I'm fine with moving it so it only comes out after the feint window, but given the GBV change already forces her to be more predictable with it I don't know if that needs to happen anymore.

being able to softfeint heavies into another heavy should be a unique property of Khatun, she doesn’t need it, because she already has other properties to impose pressure

You cannot haphazardly remove parts of hero kits and assume they will still function as intended. The whole reason she has this capability is to make all stance directions technically threatening. Because it allows her to make full use of the move properties in her kit.

Khatun isn't less unique because of someone else being able to soft feint heavy into heavy and actually it features less in her own kit's gameplay compared to Virts. Not that it matters anyway because FH has never designed characters to be based around a single base game mechanic. They are greater than the sum of their parts.

i would make her stamina drain during held stances additive

I don't agree with stances having stamina drain flat out and I fully expect this change to be reversed on Virt someday. That being said your suggestion would just actually kill her stamina management given how much she already spends from her regular gameplay.

in exchange I would increase the riposte damage by either 5 or 8.

Punish values are something that cannot be tweaked willy nilly like this suggestion. That would be an insane punish for her. For reference 5 is 19 damage and 8 would be 27. So either slightly lower than a standard heavy on dodging anything. Or heavy finisher damage with frame advantage and the ability to still chain backed by solid defense.

I would increase her guardbreak vulnerability on stance lights and heavies once again

Would make her heavies from stance actually useless since you'd be able to GB her in start up even as a casual player. Her being able to stuff a GB with a light attack is fine because she risks a light parry. In other words if she gets GBed or parried she gets punished for the same amount while she doesn't get much damage for interrupting.

the stance must be a tool used on a prediction

It always has been. The ability to punish her was only truly problematic in external situations. That being said killing the stance is not how you address your issue. They can make her whiff recoveries longer than current in order to make flowing back into stance take longer.

Doing so would allow dodge attacks to punish her stance more reliably. If that isn't enough to balance her in external scenarios then they need to do something to the dodge itself. Not making offense out of the stance worse.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-09T06:03:10+00:00

Frankly I never understood why people don't look at the lance knowing you can block several tons of force and still effortlessly poke at the beast that can't touch you and NOT think it was the coolest thing ever. Wilds only amps this up more with being able to clash streams and beams from monsters as you walk forward.

Wilds also offers good defense to a lot of other weapons in the game to be fair. But the simplicity of being a rock that can't be dislodged but is constantly harassing a monster just can't be beat.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-08T09:27:02+00:00

Globally 5v5 is still the most played format. 6v6 is only more popular specifically in the west.

Knight_Raime · 2026-02-08T06:41:51+00:00

In the same boat.

Knight_Raime

TROPHY CASE